cut a sweet pic

[Tyler Gadzinski]

I just got done watching TNA No Surrender and how sweet is it that TNA signed Kurt Angle... any way can someone cut a pic of Kurt on a TNA background thanks Gaz do you still hate everything about TNA?

[b0shey]

You know you should not spoil results for the people who hasnt seen the ppv and wanted to see it...;)

and the announcement sucked , Now his theme suits him "You Suck" after joining TNA. :mad:

WWE FOR LIFE!!!!

[Tyler Gadzinski]

i think its freaking awesome that he joined them I really didnt think theyd bring him in cuz his agent was saying that he retired from professional wrestling and he was gonna go into MMA and sorry about spoiling it but it just ended and I had to share the awesome freaking news

"Its Real, It's Damn Real"

[b0shey]

i think its freaking awesome that he joined them I really didnt think theyd bring him in cuz his agent was saying that he retired from professional wrestling and he was gonna go into MMA and sorry about spoiling it but it just ended and I had to share the awesome freaking news

"Its Real, It's Damn Real"

His agent saying that him wanting to join MMA could just have been a way to lead wwe away from them finding out that he signed with TNA and wwe spoiling it for them.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

on rumor only 7 people knew about Kurt in TNA and they all had to sign confidentiallity agreements and i dont think WWE wouldve done anything... and i think the reason really for Kurt leaving WWE was cuz he didnt like ECW

[Almaida]

and i think the reason really for Kurt leaving WWE was cuz he didnt like ECW
The reason Kurt left WWE is that he was fired. The decision was made for a variety of issues, including but not limited to; drug problems, erratic behavior and fears he was destroying himself. Dave Meltzer's been covering it pretty extensively in the past few issues of the Wrestling Observer Newsletter and it's a very complex story, but the gist of it is that he became impossible to deal with, his behavior was irrational, he refused to slow down with his body falling apart and he refused any help for his obvious personal and drug-related problems.

The story about it being mutual was fabricated as a way for Angle to save face publicly, but was not true.

I will also say that knowing all this, I think it's absolutely horrible that TNA would hire a guy like this, when he so desperately needs to get help and heal up. Honestly, I was hoping for his own sake that the guy would just get the career-ending neck surgery that he's needed for nearly four years and retire before he does even more irreparable damage to himself and his life. But at the rate he's going, if he doesn't stop (which he won't) and no one stops him (which I'd hope they could), the chances are very real that he'll end up like Dynamite Kid in a best-case scenario, or Eddy Guerrero in a worst.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

yeah i dont want to see anything bad happen to Kurt but you gotta admit TNA really needed this and the publicity from him and he wasnt going to stop he was just gonna go into MMA or so says his agent and Dana White on an interview with Howard Stern but hopefully he has cleaned up his act a little Im pretty sure he cant be acting worse than Randy Orton who recently failed a drug test but was not suspended.

[Almaida]

Well, apparently he did get worse than Randy Orton; Orton hasn't been fired.

And anyway, yes TNA needed a kick in the ass, but nothing is worth potentially endangering a man's life, or at the very least giving him an outlet in which to permanently injure himself. In his last match in WWE (an ECW house show match in White Plains, NY), according to Angle himself, he suffered a fairly severe groin injury, as well as a hamstring injury and a torn abdominal muscle. This was all in one match, working the safer house show style, no less. Going all out in a TNA ring, which you know he'll try to do because he's insane, is a recipe for distaster.

Basically, what it boils down to is that the idea of Kurt Angle working somewhere that has no semblance of drug testing or a health program scares the hell out of me.

EDIT: I just found one of those WON issues. Here are a few tidbits to give you an idea of how bad he'd gotten by the end, on top of what I've already told you.

From a behavior standpoint, he was said to be acting like Brian Pillman in the last year of his life, on the erratic scale. Meltz says Angle was constanstly calling, e-mailing, text messaging (and so forth) people in the company ranging from Vince to John Laurinaitis (Johnny Ace) to Kevin Dunn and some of the wrestlers. The estimate from one of Dave's sources was about 15-20 times a day with a lot of the messages making no sense while others seemed to have been written with a level head.

There was a match where he accidentally dropped RVD on his head, and then allegedly reported to an agent that it was RVD's fault. Supposedly there was another incident involving RVD based on something Kurt said in the ring, but Meltz never elaborates on that one.

Also, he became furious at not being booked on SummerSlam and started lobbying to everybody to get him on the show, in spite of his physical condition. He actually succeeded, with a couple of plans coming up, the final one being a three way with Big Show and Sabu, and he was pushing hard to get the title in that match. Then the next thing happened...

From a physical standpoint, the day before the TV tapings with the RVD vs. Sabu ladder match before SummerSlam, Angle reportedly called Laurinaitis to tell him that his legs were numb and that he was being wheeled through the airport. This is where he informed the company that his sports massage therapist told him he had a torn abdominal muscle.

[brat99]

Here are two pics of Angle on my TNA Background:

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j235/brat99/Custom/TNA%20Background/B99KurtAngle1.jpg

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j235/brat99/Custom/TNA%20Background/B99KurtAngle2.jpg

Note: second one because we all know it won't be long until he's in the title hunt (hopefully a nice long back and forth with Samoa Joe!)

[Tyler Gadzinski]

yeah thats some pretty sad stuff Almaida and brat i dont think theyll give him the belt too fast as they plan to have Sting go for it at Bound for Glory but Kurt will prolly be in the title hunt pretty fast as a rumor stated that sources within TNA said they will be getting rid of Jarrett as the main view point of the Promotion people may hate him but I like him cuz he helped make that company what it is today him and his brother helped alot and if you dont like him for whatever reason just like him for putting TNA on the map cuz he got them there TV deal with SpikeTV thats all I have to say and Joe is awesome:) thanks for the pic by the way is there anyway possible you could edit the title one and fit in the NWA world title?

PS TNA has rights to the NWA World Title all the way through 2014 just thought you TNA fans out there wanted to know that.. and TNA isnt a part of NWA anymore since Dixie owns the company now.

[b0shey]

Samoa Joe said that they threw in fake names to people in the company so that it wouldnt be leaked who signed with TNA. names like Jericho and Goldberg was some of them, boy they really tried to keep this a secret :p

[Tyler Gadzinski]

i know they mentioned alot of names like Jericho Benoit Lesnar Goldberg ... and they also said if he appeared on the show he was being kept in a hotel until 930 and no wrestler knew about who it was gonna be except for Jarrett probably

[sebsplex]

And anyway, yes TNA needed a kick in the ass, but nothing is worth potentially endangering a man's life, or at the very least giving him an outlet in which to permanently injure himself. In his last match in WWE (an ECW house show match in White Plains, NY), according to Angle himself, he suffered a fairly severe groin injury, as well as a hamstring injury and a torn abdominal muscle. This was all in one match, working the safer house show style, no less. Going all out in a TNA ring, which you know he'll try to do because he's insane, is a recipe for distaster.

Basically, what it boils down to is that the idea of Kurt Angle working somewhere that has no semblance of drug testing or a health program scares the hell out of me.


Yeah I'm also somewhat concerned by his transition to TNA, but on the plus side, TNA does have a far less gruelling schedule than the WWE, both competing and on the road. However unlike the WWE, TNA will want him on TV and in the ring at every opportunity whereas the WWE had the depth in the roster to give Angle time to rest without it too adversely effecting their product.

[TCP1]

Oh For ****sake!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would You Please, Please, Please Put Spoiler In The Title Of Your Posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks For Ruining A Huge Announcement For Me!!!!!!!!!!!

Argh!!!!

[Tyler Gadzinski]

so sorry TCP i didnt even think about it at the time really really sorry just been thinking alot about how im gonna do this Dynasty ive put alot of work into adding about 80-100 new custom people for my brand of TCW and coming up with little bios about them all i should have a diary going in the next week or so still alot of people to make again im really sorry for ruining it please forgive

[The Gaz]

Sorry guys, not long been up...Im gonna have to agree with b0shey though Tyler :p .

[TCP1]

Still now I knwo.

Let's go ANGLE, Let's go Joe!

How long do you reckon they'll hold off on that match? Or do you reckon they'll have it at Bound for Glory? That would mean Joe has had two matches at BFG that are against WORLD CLASS OPPOSITION! Awesome!

Could Angle be the only legitimate threat to Joe's undefeated streak? Probably. It's dream matches galore and I can't wait!

[The Stallion]

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g99/thestallion1025/STALAngle.jpg

[Tyler Gadzinski]

Thanks Stallion and again sorry TCP but I hope they have some Joe/Angle matches and in a press conference Angle said... "Being with TNA feels like I found my home," Kurt Angle commented. "TNA will be the most watched show on cable TV - it's just a matter of time. Thank you TNA for saving my career, my life and my desire to do what I love." so i hope he changed the whole drug thing and all the other problems he had.... Theyll prolly just have him cut some promos at first and either debut on BFG or the night of the move November16 who knows though TNA really needed this though to build some cred.

[Drcat1313]

Almaida

How Could you say something about kurt angle at least he is doing something with his life what are you doing sitting there with yourself. No reason for getting up in the morning . Next you go bring your Anti-tna WWE fan stuff around there. Remember this 4 people saved wwe from dieing during the monday night wars.
1. stonecold
2. vince mcmahon
3. kurt angle
4. the rock.

Kurt angle only has been in 3 bad matches in is entire career. All because of john cena no wrestling talent.

even if kurt angle did take drugs who are you to judge him he still had the strength to get to work and put a good match. just as scott hall did back in the day with his drinking in WCW.

[Drcat1313]

kurt

[Drcat1313]

kurt

[Drcat1313]

just 4 fun

[Drcat1313]

kurt

[Drcat1313]

one at time time for ever

[Drcat1313]

kurt

[The Gaz]

Like this:

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle1.jpghttp://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle3.jpghttp://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle6.jpghttp://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle8.jpghttp://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle9.jpghttp://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/Gazza87UK/J%20-%20L/KurtAngle12.jpg

You have to open up something like a photobucket account first, then upload them to there. Click on "Insert Image" in your post and type in the URL location of the images.

[flamebrain]

I like the thought of Angle v Joe and Angle v Daniels, hell even Angle v AJ but the conspiracy theorist in me can't shake the nagging feeling Vince is pulling some strings and will yank Angle back before his debut, making TNA look like the dictionary definition of Bush League to then boast about how he played them for saps. If I was Vince, I would :D I know its unlikely, but hey, the guy was the "higher power" after all :rolleyes:

[Tyler Gadzinski]

I dont think Kurt would resign with WWE I think Kurt really hated his storyline and being on the new ECW made him sick... also i dont know if i posted it in here but at a press meeting Angle said being in TNA felt like he has found his home and he thanked TNA for saving his Career/Life.

[bobinc]

Since you have seen the TNA PPV did they have names for the 2 girls with LAX?

[Almaida]

Almaida

How Could you say something about kurt angle at least he is doing something with his life what are you doing sitting there with yourself. No reason for getting up in the morning . Next you go bring your Anti-tna WWE fan stuff around there. Remember this 4 people saved wwe from dieing during the monday night wars.
1. stonecold
2. vince mcmahon
3. kurt angle
4. the rock.

Kurt angle only has been in 3 bad matches in is entire career. All because of john cena no wrestling talent.

even if kurt angle did take drugs who are you to judge him he still had the strength to get to work and put a good match. just as scott hall did back in the day with his drinking in WCW.

Well, that was uncalled for.

Dude, look. All I did was state facts. You can hurl insults at me all you want, at the end of the day I really don't care because you mean absolutely nothing to me. The important thing is that Kurt Angle has a myriad of problems --far more than I mentioned in this thread-- which could realistically lead to his premature death. This is avoidable, or at least would be if people with power would take their hands off their ears, open their eyes and actually acknowledge the reality of the situation.

The problem is not that Angle took drugs, the problem (among many others) is that he's addicted right now. Like, RIGHT NOW. We're talking about a man who can't function properly without an exorbitant amount of painkillers. Do you even understand how dangerous that is? People HAVE DIED because of addictions like that, and instead of getting the help he needs, Kurt keeps making the situation even worse. He won't even admit that he has a problem, for crying out loud. That WWE FIRED HIM should be more than enough to send the red flags flying; this is a company that has employed and continues to employ known drug addicts, people with histories of addiction, people who are currently over-dependent on painkillers, innumerable people who, until very recently, were knowingly taking years off their lives with steroids and HGH, and people who put off necessary surgery for months and months while consistantly aggrivating their injuries. All this, and KURT ANGLE WAS WORSE THAN ALL OF THEM.

Once again, Angle's problems were so severe that after WWE tried everything they could with him, and he refused rehab, THEY FIRED HIM. Has it yet sunk in how huge a deal that is? I'm normally not the type to say something like this, and I can assure you that this is not TNA-hate speaking, but the fact that TNA hired a guy with such problems is downright disgusting. Basically, in this situation, they are the enablers.

Again, let's recap.
--He badly needs his neck fused, but refuses to get it done because it's so severe that the extent of the surgery would reduce his mobility to the point that he'd be forced to retire. As bad as the necks of Austin, Benoit et al were, Angle's is even worse. That he hasn't paralysed himself yet is pure luck. It should be noted that way back at Wrestlemania 19, he was strongly advised not to wrestle because doing so resulted in a very high chance of permanent injury, including paralysis or even death. This was three and a half years ago.

--He has serious problems with addiction, bad enough that he can't function without the drugs but he won't admit there's a problem. This is not a man who can be trusted to make wise decisions with regards to his body.

--It cannot be overstated how bad his physical condition is. His arms have visibly atrophied as a result of nerve damage, which has also caused his hands and legs to go numb (I've heard degenerative nerve disorder, but I can't confirm that). His long-term problems have been showing outward effects for a long time now, to the point that the guy actually looks unhealthy. Not even Eddy Guerrero showed physical signs of degeneration like that.

--This isn't even getting into his regular injuries. Pulled groin, torn hamstring, torn ab, all in one match. And he kept wrestling through that, even continuing to push for a spot on the next PPV as well as to keep his spot in an upcoming ladder match, both of which he would've wrestled were it up to him. With no one to stop him, and TNA doesn't exactly have the best track record with taking care of their talent, there's no telling how far he'll go.

--Without going on for too much longer, add the fact that his family has a history of angina; in fact, if I remember correctly, Angle's father --doing nowhere near the damage to his body that Kurt has, mind you-- died young of a heart attack as a result. You take a high risk of heart disease and then add everything Kurt's done to his body, and you will not get a long life out of it.

This isn't even getting into the personal problems he's been going through.

Kurt Angle is wrestling himself into a wheelchair at best. That Vince McMahon actually took the moral high road in this issue is a testament to how out of hand things have gotten. And I am most certainly not a McMahon apologist. If you still refuse to acknowledge the problem, just use some critical thinking; why would Vince fire Angle knowing he'd be handing one of the biggest stars in wrestling right over to any competitor that wanted him? Something had to be seriously wrong for that to happen, yet TNA was content to put the blinders on and not only do nothing to help, but actively worsen the problems. You'll have to forgive me if I can't get excited about a guy with Angle's problems going to a place with no drug testing, no health policy, and an environment that'll see him push himself well beyond his physical limitations. I don't want to see another wrestler die when the result would've easily been avoidable. It hasn't even been 11 months since Eddy Guerrero died. You want another one?

Also, while I'm here, here's something for the future. Don't throw personal insults at someone who has not personally insulted you, as you'll never be taken seriously that way and it makes you look... well, bad. Secondly, if you must insult someone, try to come up something that doesn't also apply to yourself. People on the internet insulting other people on the internet for being on the internet is about the lamest thing a person can do, and again it makes you look bad. Finally, try to get your facts straight (Angle had nothing to do with WWE winning the war; he came around long after they were out of danger) and try not to come off as a fanboy ("Anti-TNA! WWE fan! Angle never had a bad match!"), because it really kills your argument.

I will also say that I sincerely apologize if I've offended anybody in any of my posts. It was never my intention to do so. My intention, apart from the obvious one of expressing what I'm feeling, was to simply raise awareness to the reality of Kurt Angle's problems. My posts were meant to inform, not to offend. Again, I'm sorry if anyone took offense, but these are real problems that people should know about.

EDIT:

I dont think Kurt would resign with WWE I think Kurt really hated his storyline and being on the new ECW made him sick... also i dont know if i posted it in here but at a press meeting Angle said being in TNA felt like he has found his home and he thanked TNA for saving his Career/Life.
Angle would absolutely go back if asked. He never wanted to leave in the first place. This had nothing to do with ECW.

Also, seriously, I can't be the only one who's seriously freaked out by Kurt saying TNA saved his life, can I?

[BlizzardVeers]

No, you're no the only one freaked out by that. Angle equates his career to his life, really. So, that's basically what he was saying and he meant it.

I've never heard the angina thing about Kurt's dad. I did hear a story about his father falling off a telephone poll, cracking his skull open and walking up to the hospital afterwards.

The points made above me about Kurt aren't WWE fanboyism in the least. The fact that WWE of all companies let someone go because of personal health issues is a huge thing. The fact that TNA signed him up is another. I just hope Kurt is allowed to heal his body - he has another 3 weeks before he actually starts working. Since TNA does mass tapings for each month.

Hopefully this isn't something that ends Kurt's career. For the record on Dynamite though, Dynamites problem was steroids and lots of them. Something 10 years straight of them, and horse tranquilizers and .. whatever other drugs he could find. Dynamite destroyed his body with drugs, a lot of them. Pain killers won't destroy your body. Though, they will numb you to the damage you do to it - if you're hard headed like Angle then you will destroy your body by simply ignoring the fact that you took the pain killers for a reason. Kurt said somewhere that when he couldn't get up to take the trash out without popping pain killers, he knew there was a problem.

I just hope this turns out for the best, and that Angle can ... get over his problems.

For TNA, this is the single best move they've ever made signing wise. There is no one on their roster as good as Kurt. Joe's not as good as Kurt, no matter what anyone will say. There's a lot to be learned from Kurt Angle by quite a few of the guys in TNA, maybe we'll see a more psychology mat-based old school TNA in the future?

lol. Yeah.

Morally? I don't care. If Kurt wants to destroy himself, that's his decision. I'll be upset when he destroys his wrestling career, but there's nothing anyone can do. WWE did the most extreme thing that they could to make him fix himself, and it didn't make him fix himself. Just enjoy him on TNA while he can still wrestle. If the problems he has are as bad as they're reported to be, he's got another few months at best.

[Remianen]

Also, seriously, I can't be the only one who's seriously freaked out by Kurt saying TNA saved his life, can I?

Nope, I'm somewhat dismayed by this as well. But....

Morally? I don't care. If Kurt wants to destroy himself, that's his decision. I'll be upset when he destroys his wrestling career, but there's nothing anyone can do. WWE did the most extreme thing that they could to make him fix himself, and it didn't make him fix himself. Just enjoy him on TNA while he can still wrestle. If the problems he has are as bad as they're reported to be, he's got another few months at best.

I agree with Blizz. Kurt Angle is a grown man. He doesn't need other people to make decisions for him. He does what he wants to do and that in and of itself does not directly harm other folks so it's all good to me. You can feel bad for him or be disappointed by the decisions he makes but in the end, that's up to him and his creator.

As Blizzard alluded to, this is the biggest thing TNA has done EVER, bar none. It gets them a high quality, world reknowned worker which is exactly what they need. It also gets them an intense, focused presence for their locker room, which will speed up the development of a lot of their younger workers. People talk about Angle-Samoa Joe but personally, I'm looking forward to Angle-Homicide more than anything else. People sleep on Homicide but he's an extremely talented and well-rounded worker. I'm willing to put money on the fact that 98% of WWE's roster and probably 85% of TNA's can't safely pull off the Kudome Valentine (aka Kudo Driver, Vertebreaker, Da Cop Killa/Da Gringo Killa) that Homicide does with ease. The one thing I've always admired about Kurt Angle is the fact that he seems to be able to get Match of the Year candidates out of seemingly everyone. And that was in WWE (where, let's be honest, the in-ring ability standards are very low with many moves banned because the typical worker can't do them safely. See: Shooting Star Press). I don't even wanna think about what he'll be able to do with TNA's workers.

[Drcat1313]

kurt may not been there for the beginning of wars but he help put the final stick throw the heart of wcw by joining wwf in 1999. Everybody knows wcw died in 2001.

you are right kurt has never put on a bad match from his part that is true. it's damn true.

wwe making him lose to that no talent bud john cena not once , not twice, but three times. then sending him down to the minors in ecw to fight such stars as sandman, balls, & test.

it would have been human to feed him to the crows.

That is the reason why he went to TNA.

scars and bones heal

Men only have one thing that we are born with and died with that is PRIDE.

WWE tried to take kurt angle and make him a loser like scotty 2 hotty.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

I agree with what Almaida says what Blizz says and drcat


SPOILER******* Impact notes from the tapings.....




Kurt Angle has been confirmed to debut at Bound for Glory but will only be an outside enforcer to the Jarrett/Sting macth



good thing there giving him some much needed time out of the ring hopefully he can fix up somethings wrong with him but of course he wont be able to fix all of them but he can start.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

something I dont understand about WWE is they seem to forget about past storylines that were important... like on SmackDown when Cena and Carlito had a feud and Carlitos mate Zeus "stabbed" Cena then a week ago or so on RAW they teamed together and after the match hugged each other... i dont understand why they would have that?

[flamebrain]

I love WWE continuity: Is Kane face or Heel this week? Why are HHH and HBK able to coexist? Why didn't Regal remind Vito that HE was the toughest man to ever wear a dress? Mae Young and Mark Henry's baby hand must be of school age by now, how is it getting on?
TNA is just as guilty: What was Gail Kim's secret? What were the Hebners doing?
And in general: Why do number one contender matches rarley mean anything? What does the new star, who has barely wrestled for the promotion do to deserve the inevitable title shot?
It's one of the problems with "Sportz Entertainment", but at the same time its also something I enjoy :) At the end of the day, if you account for past transgressions there are very few wrestlers who should ever be able to coexist. And, my god, when will Sting learn to never trust people who claim to "have his back"?!

[Almaida]

Well, I'm glad there are people here with good heads on their shoulders. I've been going crazy reading other sites. And particularly, I respect what Remianen and BlizzardVeers are saying, and agree with pretty much all of it.

I just quickly want to respond to Drcat and then I have one more point I want to make afterwards.

kurt may not been there for the beginning of wars but he help put the final stick throw the heart of wcw by joining wwf in 1999. Everybody knows wcw died in 2001.
WCW was bought out in 2001, yes. But by the time Kurt debuted in November '99, the war had, for all intents and purposes, already climaxed. This turning point was, I believe, somewhere in early-to-mid 1999; WWF started kicking WCW's ass every week in the ratings, buyrates and possibly attendance (though not necessarily in quality, as '99 was by and large a terrible year for both) and the gap in popularity between the two companies was continuously getting bigger. By the time 2000 was in full swing, WCW had no chance of turning it around and winning, and while in hindsight we can safely say that they would've gone under no matter what, at that point their best hope was simply to survive. They couldn't even think of overtaking the WWF anymore, and this was before Angle was a major player. Angle didn't become a big enough focus to matter in the grand scheme of things until well into the summer of 2000, and by that point WCW (under Russo, mind you) was so screwed that WWF could've put any idiot on top and they still wouldn't have lost.

It should also be noted that the WWF's absolute, far and away, best financial year in its history up to that point (possibly ever, though without figures in front of me I think 2000 was bigger) was 1999, which lasted 11 months before any WWF fan even knew who Kurt Angle was. Kurt certainly played a part in the latter stages of 2000, but he was not all that high on the food chain; Austin from fall onwards, Rock, HHH, Vince, Stephanie, Foley, Jericho and Undertaker were all clearly ahead of him, and a case could be made that Edge & Christian, the Hardyz, the Dudleyz, Shane, Kane, Too Cool & Rikishi, Chyna and possibly even Chris Benoit were all at least as important for the year as a whole. And it bears repeating that this was the year after WWF had already, for all intents and purposes, won the war. WCW didn't officially close until the following March, but the downward spiral --which actually had more to do with their own abysmal management than WWF "destroying" them-- was already irreversable by the time Kurt Angle became a big enough player to make any difference.

Angle definitely deserves credit later on in his career for a number of different things, but to even call him one of the absolute most important people in his first year is a big stretch, while calling him one of the four most important in keeping WWF "alive" during the ratings wars in downright ludicrous and painfully ignorant.

you are right kurt has never put on a bad match from his part that is true. it's damn true.
I never said that, man. I was paraphrasing (granted, in an unnecessarily patronizing way) what you said. Realistically there is not a single wrestler living or dead who has never had a bad match. In fact, there's not a single wrestler who's never had many bad matches. It's a fact of life, nobody's flawless.

Also, while I like Angle, I certainly find him to be more than a little overrated, but that's a different debate entirely that I don't want to get into right now.

wwe making him lose to that no talent bud john cena not once , not twice, but three times. then sending him down to the minors in ecw to fight such stars as sandman, balls, & test.
it would have been human to feed him to the crows.
That is the reason why he went to TNA.

Le sigh.

-I dislike John Cena as much as the next guy, but you can't deny how valuable he is to the company. Dude sells merchandise like crazy, and is easily one of, if not the absolute, biggest draws they have right now, especially with one of the most important markets, kids. He makes so much money for them that it'd be stupid not to have him on top. Also, it was worth putting him over Kurt if for nothing else than to add to the unique gigantic mixed reactions he gets. Besides, Angle lost nothing by losing to Cena; he actually got more popular because people who hate Cena rallied behind him. Kurt actually ended up more popular after being jobbed to Cena than he was before, which is what led to his face turn off his jump to Smackdown. Again, I can't stand Cena, but that feud is a non-issue, especially considering all that came after it.

-Again, Kurt DID NOT LEAVE WWE BECAUSE HE WAS SENT TO ECW. He didn't even want to leave to begin with!

scars and bones heal
Men only have one thing that we are born with and died with that is PRIDE.
WWE tried to take kurt angle and make him a loser like scotty 2 hotty.
So, like, do you even know what permanent injury means? It means exactly the opposite; THEY DON'T HEAL. Severe nerve damage does not heal. Spinal injuries do not heal, and even with surgery, the spine can never be 100% again. Paralysis does not heal. Death does not heal! Is this sinking in? This is a bigger issue than a broken bone or a scar.

And if you're done with your little promo there, there was no conspiracy(~!) to make Kurt Angle a jobber. They launched a new brand and needed star power to support it. So they put a star there. In fact, when Kurt was first re-assigned, they actually pushed him as hard as they ever had before. He was put over as a total killing machine and given the legit~! shooter~! gimmick that he'd supposedly wanted since day one. Since the Smackdown jump he never lost clean, not even to the world champion. In fact, he never even lost the world title (Orton was pinned) and was never beaten by the new champion Rey Mysterio. You call that the Scotty 2 Hotty treatment?

Dude. Come on.

Anyway, the big point I wanted to make, and that I forgot. Yes, I'm extremely worried about Kurt for his sake, because the thing about people with all-around problems as severe as Angle's is that they can't be trusted to take care of themselves. Kurt's behaviour, combined with the ridiculous amounts of heavy duty painkillers and dangerous opiates running through his system, would lead one to the conclusion that he isn't thinking clearly, and therefore is in no condition to determine what he can and can't do. But at the end of the day, if he wants to deny any existance of a problem and wrestle himself into an early grave, there's nothing anyone can do to stop him, unless every wrestling and MMA promoter in the world banded together to do so, which will never happen as long as there's money to be made. To paraphrase a guy on another board who came up with a way better analogy than I ever could, as long as Angle wants to commit whatever the wrestling equivalent of suicide-by-cop is, there will be someone willing to pay him to do it.

HOWEVER, the biggest issue I forgot to mention last night is this; in his current state, he is not safe to work with. The RVD story speaks for itself; he dropped Van Dam on his head and blamed him. Also, let's not forget that he's prone to losing sensation in his limbs and even suffered a random bout of parapalegia in an airport. What's to stop this from happening in a match? What's to stop him from losing strength while performing a move on his opponent? Then what? Not to mention the fact that he suffered, by his own admission, three(!) serious injuries in one match doing nothing out of the ordinary. A guy like this not only is a liablity to himself, but dangerous to his opponents. He works in a field where people routinely put their lives in each other's hands, and Kurt cannot realistically meet that expectation.

Again, I don't mean to come off as preachy nor do I condemn anyone for being fans of his, as I myself am a Kurt Angle fan. I just don't want to see him destroy his life, though we're probably already long past the point of no return on that one. But even if we are, I don't want to see a young guy's career end in his hands, either.

[Remianen]

Almaida, stop. Stop trying to counter frenzied fan arguments with facts. It's both futile and a waste of your time. This thread has been great.....except for 2 posts. People with impassioned and excited thoughts....and someone trying to retcon.

It's like trying to fight a wildfire with a water pistol. Even if it's a Super Soaker, you're not going to make any headway and usually, you wind up getting burned in the process.

[bobinc]

Since you have seen the TNA PPV did they have names for the 2 girls with LAX?

Anyone?

[Tyler Gadzinski]

oh sorry i meant to comment on that today.. no they didnt they werent even with them they were just some girls that they knew and celebrated with.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

http://www.wrestlinginc.com/v2/wi/stc/nws/2006/9/26/19977.shtml

Thats the story so far on Angle according to wrestlinginc.com.... Almaida I agree with you on alot of posts of yours and I respect what you say and no one would want to see Angle die

DrCat alot of that stuff you said about Almaida was just wrong and stupid of you making fun of him cuz he likes WWE ... you used to like WWE at one time youd have to just because they made what Professional Wrestling is today just like in TNA you have to like Jeff Jarrett cuz he helped build that company to what it is he helped them acquire Kurt he helps them book house shows(very seldom the have them) he helps with almost everything in the company and his Guitar pyros are so awesome yet useless.. I remember back in WWE when Jarrett was there and he had a dump truck full of guitars and started smashing them one after another on his opponents head and then slammed on to them my memory is kinda vague on that but it was just really awesome if anyone could help and let me know what actually happened id like to know so i dont seem like such a retard... and Jarrett's backstage video of a doctor looking at his lashes is on TNAWrestling.com those are brutal.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

suprisingly this thread has gotten alot of comments apparently people have alot to say about wrestling companys

[The Gaz]

I wish I had the time and patience Almaida seems to have lol.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

i do to mr TNA sucks.. lol... i wonder where he finds alot of that stuff its pretty interesting and entertaining.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

I was just wondering anyone else that got the WWE magazine got 3 cards with it and on the back of my Batista it says "people said hed never make it in WCW and that he was 6'6" 370lbs" i thought he only weighed about 318 or so and never was in WCW only OVW and WWE? someone please answer this

[Sartagis]

From wiki:
Batista tried out at the WCW Power Plant but was told he would never make it in the wrestling business by Sgt. Buddy Lee Parker. He then went to the WWF who sent him to work with Afa Anoai. He wrestled in Anoai's WXW promotion under the name Khan.

He made his Ohio Valley Wrestling debut in 2000, joining forces with Synn. During his tenure in OVW he was called Leviathan. As a member of the Disciples of Synn stable he would go undefeated until being beaten at an OVW supercard, Christmas Chaos by WWF's Kane (with help from Stone Cold Steve Austin). He would later go on to win the OVW Heavyweight Championship from 'The Machine' Doug Basham. After losing the belt to The Prototype, Synn felt Batista was getting too independent and "sold" him to Reverend D-Von to begin his WWE (then still WWF) career.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

thank you for answering my question really appreciate it

[Tyler Gadzinski]

Jim Ross not mad at TNA

What is the over/under on how long Kurt Angle stays in TNA? I think the world of Kurt and hope he gets totally healthy much sooner than later. Perhaps being a part of TNA will work for Kurt as it relates to travel and in ring demands. I do think this genre is much better suited for Angle than mixed martial arts, UFC, etc. I wish Kurt well on his new opportunity and that is true, damn true.

that is straight from JRs website jrsbarbq.com

EDIT http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1215276213 someone made this video about Kurt its pretty cool.

[Drcat1313]

so you think kurt is overrated?

i knew the truth will be revealed so enough.

just for the record i have never liked wwe.

I watched wwf all because it was the only wrestling on.

When scott hall jumped i said goodbye wwf.

[flamebrain]

A lot of wrestlers are overrated in my opinion, not because they lack talent but simply because of too much band wagon jumping. The same would be true of wrestlers who are underrated. Searching around the interweb shows a very narrow range of opinions on things wrestling related:

Benoit and Angle are gods
Cena can't wrestle
Triple H holds everyone down
The WWE is awful
ROH is good (haven't been hearing that quite so much lately mind)

Now while I happily accept that these are the genuine opinions of at least some people I do think that a lot of people are simply absorbing and regurgitating opinions they find, rather than forming their own. And then you find the odd individual who has their own opinion. Are they allowed to have it? Au contrere, they just get hassle: OMG how can you like Cena?!!!1 He cant wrestl!!!11 Reasonable argument is acceptable, but why oh why can't people take the opinions of others on board? It would give us all a much better rounded knowledge. I recall several arguments I had with a friend who would always tell me how good The Amazing Red was and I used to counter that I couldn't accept someone with the physique of a 10 year old as a wrestler. However I gave my friend the benefit and watched a few tapes and, although my own opinion hasn't changed drastically, I can now accept my friend's viewpoint and agree to disagree.

I'm sure I had a point when I started typing this but c'est la vie.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

WWF became WWE so technically you did watch WWE and i never said kurt was overrated and WWF was never the only wrestling on what about ECW and WCW remember the Monday Night Wars so dont tell me WWF was the only wrestling on you had alternatives you chose to watch WWF cuz you liked it and also if you remember WWF become WWE after they were threatened twice by the World Wildlife Foundation(WWF)... FB about that Amazing Red thing i never thought he was that good either but then i got to see more of his tapes and some of the things he does are amazing;)... also im just going to say it TNA should bring back Matt Sydal he is an amazing athlete if you have seen his stuff you should....

[flamebrain]

Good tip on Sydal. I'm just watching an IWA-MS match v AJ Styles and its good stuff. He'd be a good fit in TNA. What's he like on the stick though? The X Division needs individuals with personalities if he can set himself apart from the rest a la Shelley or Austin Aries then he'd thrive but, as we've all seen, in ring talent alone doesn't = success, as much as I like Chirs Sabin, he is blander than dry toast.

[Drcat1313]

WWF became WWE so technically you did watch WWE and i never said kurt was overrated and WWF was never the only wrestling on what about ECW and WCW remember the Monday Night Wars so dont tell me WWF was the only wrestling on you had alternatives you chose to watch WWF cuz you liked it and also if you remember WWF become WWE after they were threatened twice by the World Wildlife Foundation(WWF)... FB about that Amazing Red thing i never thought he was that good either but then i got to see more of his tapes and some of the things he does are amazing;)... also im just going to say it TNA should bring back Matt Sydal he is an amazing athlete if you have seen his stuff you should....

sorry tyler that was not directed at you . it was for Almaida.

he said kurt angle was overrated.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

Flame i dont know if you know this but Sydal used to be in TNA never really had promo shots or mic speaking but he is featured in the Best of the XDivision Vol 1 in the first match where he does a shooting star press off the other guys back:eek: .. that is really athletic

[Drcat1313]

nobody watch wcw before scott hall jumped.

you know that at least check the rating charts.

to give you a example

scott hall first wcw show wcw went from a 2.1 to 4.2 .
the rating to went up and up.
so basely wcw only really had 5 year run that was good.

ecw always put me to sleep.
hardcore wrestling is good ok i give you that but come on how many can be broken before it getting boring.

that is why i saided wwf was the only thing on.

in closing i thank all people who hate john cena.

[Drcat1313]

how many times have john cena & edge fought each other?

I know it does not pass hbk & triple H

but it is close to booker t & christian or booker t & chris benoit.

booker t feuds always last to long .

he is a terrible heel too.

[Tyler Gadzinski]

couldnt you edit your old post instead of starting a new one.... and Edge and Cena is about 9 months and going and just because WCW didnt have Scott Hall doesnt mean it wasnt on TV i just said it was on TV and you had your choice of WWF/E WCW and if you fall asleep to ECW you must not like pushing the level angles and stuff... to tell you the truth the new ECW puts me to sleep it just isnt even close to what the old ECW was:( they shouldve never started it back up they shouldve left it dead... they new they werent getting most of the originals such as any Dudleys...Rhino Raven Shane Douglas etc. they should just let Paul run the whole thing cuz he knew what he was doing not having WWE writers make the storylines for him and then Vince telling him he can have complete control on it and then tell him he doesnt have control was really dumb.

[Almaida]

If I start responding, I'll end up firing off another long but ultimately useless essay answer, which I'm way too tired to do right now. So I would just like to say:

-Remianen, that is damn good advice and an awesome analogy that I hope I can remember. But really, I churned out those long posts because I wanted to get that stuff off my chest. It's kinda therapeutic in its own weird little way, and I enjoy any opportunity to apply the otherwise useless wrestling information that I've filled my brain with over the years.

-Gaz, thank you for noticing. :) Though I actually don't have that much time; I was suuposed to be studying when I wrote that. And then I spent the last few days cramming. Heh heh. Yeah.

-Tyler, I apprectiate the comments and you taking my back. Against this guy, I don't need it, but thanks nonetheless.

-Flamebrain, you rule. That post about people being overrated and underrated was good stuff. Way more concise than I would've been in any case. You should post more.

And Drcat... give it up, man. Are you a gimmick? Be honest now. And what part of "I don't want to have this debate" do you not understand? That debate has come up on every board I've ever been to, because Kurt Angle is actually one of the most polarizing wrestlers out there, and this is neither the time nor the place to bring it up again. You want to have that debate? Go start a thread in the Dog Pound and I might bite when I have time. But you'll have to bring some substance.

Sorry for dragging this thread off topic even moreso. Carry on.

[Drcat1313]

I just hate Anti- kurt angle fans .

I Would not give kurt the match of the year. He is still in my top 10 fav wrestlers of all time.

Match of year:

you pick

they only fought twice
chris benoit vs finaly either match both awesome.

john cena sucks for 5 reasons:
1. he never earned his stripes
2. he has never been heel
3. he can't carry a match
4. he won't get all out of the heavyweight picture.
5. his merchanize has always been the same ( still no pumps 4 sale).

[Gremlinator]

He was Heel when he started out in WWE. He was damn good as a heel when he taunted his opponents in his raps. He can carry a match, but just doesnt work well in very long matches.

He earned his stripes for working for so long and being one of the best people in WWE on the mic. Sure his in ring skills aren't at the same tier as his charisma etc. but he is still a good wrestler.

And his merchandise is the same because it is selling well. He has no real need to change it to be honest.

That's my two cents.

[The Gaz]

He was Heel when he started out in WWE. He was damn good as a heel when he taunted his opponents in his raps. He can carry a match, but just doesnt work well in very long matches.

He earned his stripes for working for so long and being one of the best people in WWE on the mic. Sure his in ring skills aren't at the same tier as his charisma etc. but he is still a good wrestler.

And his merchandise is the same because it is selling well. He has no real need to change it to be honest.

That's my two cents.


Correction; Being in the WWE for 4 years isnt a long time. I agree that he HASNT earned his stripes. Maybe when you are a few years older you will have a different opinion of him.

[Gremlinator]

I'll apologise, I sort of forgot how long he had been in WWE, my mistake.

[flamebrain]

john cena sucks for 5 reasons:
1. he never earned his stripes
2. he has never been heel
3. he can't carry a match
4. he won't get all out of the heavyweight picture.
5. his merchanize has always been the same ( still no pumps 4 sale).

1. By "earning his stripes" are you meaning tenure on the WWE main roster? Cena was 3 years in WWE before winning the World Title. Undertaker went straight into the main event scene and won the belt in his first year, same for Kurt Angle, Kevin Nash did it in under 2 years, Brock Lesnar was in 6 months before he did it. Is it time in pro wrestling in general? Angle turned pro in 1999, the same year of his debut in WWE and won the belt by Survivor Series in 2000, far less time than it took Cena. You can argue that these people could already wrestle but ability is not the same as "earning your stripes" Bob Holly would certainly qualify as earning his stripes but isn't world title caliber, at the end of the day the fans decide that (just ask Billy Gunn/Kip James).

2. I see no point in answering that

3. Plenty of champs and succesful draws have been unable to carry a match. Goldberg anyone? Is Kevin Nash a ring general? How about Warrior Warrior?!

4. Anyone generating the level of reaction Cena does (good or bad) should be in the main picture. The only problem I have is that they don't play up his mixed reaction more, its something fresh at least. JBL got into the scene via cicumstance but stayed because he got a reaction (and initially it was a negative one about him not deserving the place much lke Cena has now).

5. That's for marketing to deal with not him. But, from what I gather, even if it never changes, it still sells.


I can't beleive how much I come accross as a Cena fan lately. I'm not but I have to speak when I read the same stuff being trotted out constantly and unfairly.

[Sartagis]

I'm beginning to love your posts flamebrain.

[Rocland]

Cena's not that bad. I mean there's a lot worse on the WWE roster right now. Cena's the WWE champ for a reason. That reason being, love him or hate him he always gets the reaction. I confess I'm a 22 year old, rock music loving, rap hating, pro wrestling fan, and I like John Cena!

Whew. That's a weight off my shoulders.

[Remianen]

You guys are nuts! Trying to counter rabid fan frenzy with facts. What are you, crazy? :p

I just have one question for DrCat. Well, one question in a few parts.

John Cena is the WWE Champion, is that correct? Who decides that? HOW do they decide that? I'm guessing if Scott Hall was the messiah you try to make him out to be, the person who MADE Cena WWE Champion would be more than willing to pony up whatever it took to get him to come back. Probably including all the nose candy and Jim Beam that Hall could ever want.

Sorry, there's more to choosing a standard bearer for an SE promotion than you seem to think. In-ring ability is very optional. Plus, given the restrictions placed on WWE workers, I'm pretty much convinced that most of the roster can wrestle better than they're allowed to actually show (well, except Chris Masters and Booker T).

But this is a fool's errand, totally futile. Yes yes, Cena sucks, yadda yadda yadda.

[Sartagis]

nobody watch wcw before scott hall jumped.

you know that at least check the rating charts.

to give you a example

scott hall first wcw show wcw went from a 2.1 to 4.2 .
the rating to went up and up.
Meant to comment on this before but forgot. Now I love Scott Hall and Hall was pretty popular at the time BUT his jump to WCW did not cause the rating spike. Well it did but not becasue it was Scott Hall. The ratings spiked because a WWE top guy was appearing on WCW. At the time most of the WWF fanbase (casual viewers who don't pay close attention to the inside workers like workers contracts expireing and signings) thought that a WWF top guy was just showing up to interupt WCW programming. Most of the fanbase had no clue who had left WWF for WCW same when Nash showed up most had no clue and they were tuneing in to see what happened with these WWF guys trying to mess up the WCW shows. WCW was smart and played off this by playing it like they were legit invaders. Thats why the whole thing worked so well and why people kept watching then by the time Hogan joined the two of them and they formed the NWO things were rolling and WWF managed it badly with things liek fake Diesel and fake Razor Ramon.

It could have been just about any top WWF guy going to WCW as long as the casual fans had no clue it was comming and WCW used that same invader angle it would have worked.

Sorry if anyone already said this.

[Remianen]

I will agree with one thing Drcat said. I am SO sick of Edge-Cena that I change the channel when their segments are on. Same thing I do for Johnny Nitro's segments as well as when that stupid music starts playing before Umaga comes out.

But what always makes me laugh is, the same man/company who once barred Steve Austin from ever opening his mouth near a live mic, gives Nitro & Melina like 5+ mins to act as insomnia relief (Jeff Hardy wasn't exaggerating :p).

[TCP1]

You guys are nuts! Trying to counter rabid fan frenzy with facts. What are you, crazy? :p

I just have one question for DrCat. Well, one question in a few parts.

John Cena is the WWE Champion, is that correct? Who decides that? HOW do they decide that? I'm guessing if Scott Hall was the messiah you try to make him out to be, the person who MADE Cena WWE Champion would be more than willing to pony up whatever it took to get him to come back. Probably including all the nose candy and Jim Beam that Hall could ever want.

Sorry, there's more to choosing a standard bearer for an SE promotion than you seem to think. In-ring ability is very optional. Plus, given the restrictions placed on WWE workers, I'm pretty much convinced that most of the roster can wrestle better than they're allowed to actually show (well, except Chris Masters and Booker T).

But this is a fool's errand, totally futile. Yes yes, Cena sucks, yadda yadda yadda.

Are you on CRACK? Booker T is a very solid worker in-ring. I mean he's slowed down a lot in recent years, but he's still a damn sight better than most!

[Remianen]

Are you on CRACK? Booker T is a very solid worker in-ring. I mean he's slowed down a lot in recent years, but he's still a damn sight better than most!

I think our perspectives differ, TCP. You might think 'very solid' equates to 'good' but I don't. And I haven't seen his moveset evolve very much over the years so he loses points with me on that. Just because a lump of coal is 'a damn sight better' than a pile of poop doesn't mean the lump of coal is GOOD, in my view. In my opinion, Booker T is an excellent 'Entertainer' (in TEW terms) but take him out of an Entertainment based work environment and put him in a situation where his in-ring skills will determine his popularity and he wouldn't do very well, by my estimation.

So if that means I'm hitting the pipe, so be it.

[Almaida]

You, sir, are hitting the pipe.

[Scott Vibert]

Moved as conversation has strayed to general wrestling talk.