Nedokius: Battle For Border City

[Arrows]

Welcome to the Nedokius Mafia Game.

These are the rules. Many mods have contributed to these rules. Many thanks to all of you.

Please read these rules. If you are unsure about something, PM Arrows or moon_lit_tears with questions.

THE OFFICIAL RULES (Read or Die!)

HOW TO PLAY:

ROLES: Every player has been given a role, each with it’s own abilities (or lack thereof). Your role PM will explain what it does if you are meant to know. You do not need to reveal your role to other players nor will we do so in the in-game write ups. Of course, you can choose to reveal information about your role if you wish to if you feel it would help you to reach your win condition. Jut remember that any information you reveal can also be used against you, so claiming is entirely at your own risk. If you want to use your ability, PM the mods of the game (Arrows and moon_lit_tears). Do NOT post it in the thread unless your role PM states otherwise.

PHASES: The game is split into two phases, Day and Night. The game begins during the day phase with all players (Town and Mafia alike) posting in the thread deciding who to lynch. Lynching is the town’s main way of eliminating mafia, so be sure to examine everything that your fellow players say in order to find inconsistencies, lies, dodgy voting patterns and anything else that could incriminate people. There may also be clues in the end of phase write ups, but relying on those is not advised as they may be veiled, misleading or otherwise unreliable. Day phases last approximately 48 hours or until a consensus is reached on who to lynch. Night phases last approximately 24 hours but may end earlier if all night activities are completed. If you have an optional ability and choose not to use it, please inform the mods via PM so that they know not to wait on your ability.

VOTING: All voting and game related discussion is to occur within the game thread. Town players may discuss who they think are Mafia, and Mafia members should be trying to avoid being lynched by bluffing and blending in and generally trying to not get lynched. To vote on anyone, post VOTE: Username (MUST BE IN BOLD!). You can also change your vote by typing CHANGE VOTE: Username (AGAIN IN BOLD!). You can also change your vote to nobody by typing CHANGE VOTE: No Vote (STILL IN BOLD!). Your last option is to vote for a no lynch, meaning that you actively choose to not lynch anyone. To do so simply type VOTE: No lynch (BOLDED OBVIOUSLY!). All votes post in the thread for your vote to count and it must be in bold. If you vote within a quote then your vote won’t be counted, so if you mess up voting and quote it to edit it then it will not count.

DAY PHASES: A Day Phase is generally over whenever a person obtains votes from more than 50% of the total number of players remaining, at which point they are lynched. It can also end if the time expires before a lynch is reached, at which point a No Lynch will be declared. There are abilities out there that can change votes such as vote manipulators, multi-voters and no-voters so vote counts may not always be as they seem. When a person dies their role title will be revealed for all to see in the end of day write up.

NIGHT PHASES: Night Phases begin after a day phase has ended. During this time most abilities will be sent in to the mods (Arrows and moon_lit_tears), with the Mafia usually sending in their kills while the town send in names of people they want to use their abilities on, such as investigate or protect. The night phase will end once all abilities have been sent in or when the time limit expires, at which point the mods will do a write up of the night’s activities. The write up will reveal what players have been killed and some other events that happen depending on what the mods consider important enough to be in the write ups. Whenever possible, try to get PMs into the mods as soon as possible after the start of the night phase in order to keep the game moving along at a quick pace.

Once night has ended, a new day begins and the cycle repeats itself until win conditions have been reached. The Town generally wins when there are no threats left to them, the Mafia generally win when their numbers are equal to or greater than the remaining non-Mafia players. Remember, this is a team effort so if you think sacrificing someone may help your cause then go ahead.


GENERAL MAFIA GAME RULES:

No players are allowed to edit their posts EVER!. Whether it be to correct a typo or to remove some accidentally incriminating things someone has said, no editing of posts is allowed. While mods may choose to be lenient, the standard penalty for anyone caught editing a post is a mod kill.

All players should play to their role/alignment and play to win. While there are likely to be times that you have to do things against your best interest, any players who deliberately go against their win conditions risk being banned from future games for failing to play to their role and going against the spirit of the game.

Players are only allowed to post their role title from their role PM, that is the bit that says you are “Town Aligned Protector” or something similar. You can paraphrase things that your PM says but you are not allowed to directly quote anything else other than the role title from your PM, which is also the only thing players will see when you are dead. Related to this, players are not allowed to ask each other about the specific wording of any part of their roles. In other words, it is okay to ask another player if they are sure that their role means "X", it is not okay to ask another player if their role reads as "X". If the mods catch you posting anything that closely resembles what your role PM says then it will be grounds for a mod kill. You have been warned!

In game “role bets” such as “I will never play again if…” is strictly prohibited. If you do this then you will at minimum be replaced as soon as possible, with a maximum penalty of a mod kill. It may also lead to a ban from future games, mods don’t want players who will bet on things outside their games in order to try and prove something in a game so just don’t do it.

Though we can’t force you to post, all mods love to see active participants in their games. We advise everyone to check in at least once a day, as games can move pretty fast and it can be easy to fall behind if you are not on regularly.

Though this may also be a mafia game, try not to postwhore in the thread. Where possible try to keep things relevant to the game that is being played and try not to let arguments get out of hand. This game stirs up some passionate arguments and we understand that this will happen, but if anything turns into a personal attack then it ruins the fun for everyone. Be considerate. :)

Unless your role PM specifically states otherwise, no players are allowed to talk about their role, game plan, alignment, win condition or basically anything game related outside of the game thread. While mods can’t easily enforce this rule, any communication about the game outside of the game thread goes against the spirit of mafia games and spoils the game. Anyone caught doing this WILL be mod-killed. This is your only warning!

Once you are dead, you stay dead. You will not be allowed to participate in the game thread or continue to talk to people outside the thread that you could talk to before. So if you are a Mafia player who dies, you are NOT allowed to continue talking about the game to your Mafia team mates. No dead players will receive any extra information from the mods (Arrows and moon_lit_tears) when they die either. If you are dead, try not to post anything in the game thread as anything you say could be an unnecessary distraction to those still playing, though a quick post going “Oooooooo I’m a ghost!!” is generally okay, no-one is allowed to leave cryptic messages from the dead, notes on their corpses or anything like that. If you are dead, your contribution to the game is over.

Talking to other dead players is also frowned upon, as many games have been known to feature a revive type ability or need to have players replaced. Talking to other players outside the game means that these abilities can’t be used properly and that you can’t be used as a replacement, which can still have an impact on the game in play. So don’t do it!

When it comes to mafia games, nothing is ever as it seems. There can be things about your role that you don’t know about, other people can bluff about their abilities, people can lie, events can happen and write ups can be read in many different ways. If you have any questions about what is happening then you can get in contact with the mods (Arrows and moon_lit_tears) via PM, and if we can clarify anything for you then we will do what we can. But there are many reasons why we might not be able to, and in any such eventuality you will get a post simply stating the following -> :cool:

Example Town Role:

You are Example Man, Freedom Aligned Example.

You have one goal in your life, and that is to be the example for all others to look to. Knowing someone else is following your lead gives you that warm fuzzy feeling down in your nether regions that you so desire. For the purposes of this game, you will show the town an example of a basic townie role PM.

You win when freedom is restored.

[Arrows]

Day Zero

For as long as anyone could remember, this meeting room has been the place for leaders to come together in times of war. Many years have passed since the last time this room found use, but today several people took their spot.

The only spot unfilled stood out at the head of the table. This spot would be filled by the man in charge of bringing these smaller forces together. Would be, if that man were anywhere to be found. The last anyone saw of their leader, he and his personal guard had fallen into an ambush.

As of first light, an army marched toward the northern border of the Southern Lands. By night they would be able to begin their invasion. Border City alone would be no match for the army headed directly for it, and a plan was needed immediately. Of course, desperation often breeds chaos, and chaos isn't very good for planning.

"You have to help."

"We don't have to do anything. You aren't in charge."

The argument would continue around the table, and get nowhere in the process. The Border City Mayor obviously desperate for help in saving his small town and preventing this war from spilling into the Southern Lands. No one else seemed nearly as interested in this strategy, most with comments on it being a waste of troops so early on.

With the slam of his fist, an angry, barrel chested man caught everyone's attention. "EVERYONE SHUT UP! This is getting us nowhere. We need to come together right now, not be at war with each other."

"What would you have us do?" A man snapped back sarcastically.

"We need someone to fill in for our King. Someone we can all agree on to lead us to victory."

"So you want us to sit here and elect a leader? I don't have time for this. My people are going to die!" With that fit of panic behind, the Border City Mayor stormed out of the room, followed by his two closest guards.

The barrel chested man shook his head in disgust before turning his attention back to his peers. "Despite the display of ignorance, he knew what we have to do. Before we can make a move to fight, we need to elect a leader. Send out word to gather anyone and everyone willing to help."

With the decision made, the meeting ended. Just in time to accomplish something before things would get much worse than expected. One after another, each man above a common soldier seemed to vanish into thin air.

"Fools. Almost made this too easy."

With his work done, he appeared before those he felt no need to fear. Adorned in the colors of his homeland, a white and gold trim robe covered his body entirely. He remained motionless and allowed those left to flee and spread word of his sight.

[Arrows]

Night Zero

Sniff.

He had spent days now in this spot. Able to look down upon the world from the forest he took shelter in. He could smell it even from this distance now, and it drug him to his feet. To the edge of the cliff, he stared down at the town touching the northern border connecting Nedokius and The Southern Lands.

"Something horrible is happening."

Hidden behind the mask he wore to conceal his identity, his eyes watched the army move into Border City. A lot of blood would be shed tonight.

"Finally."

He took a step out of the forest and leapt from the cliff, his shadow following after a few seconds.

"Fascinating."

Out of his hiding spot another stepped, much the opposite of the man who'd just left. This one wore a white and gold robe, with a hood draped down to cover his face. He clutched his staff in his right hand as he watched the other man land safely below. The tip of the staff took on a white glow for mere seconds before the man vanished into thin air.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"HELP ME!"

Screaming was useless. They had all been caught defenseless. It took little effort for the Nedokius army to surround Border City and close in. Bodies littered the streets and she tried her hardest to keep moving as she hopped each body in her path.

She rounded a corner and saw hope ahead. Beyond enemy lines, he rode towards town as fast as his horse could bring him. All she had to do was manage to get to him and she would be safe from this massacre. Her arms extended, reaching out as far as she could so that she could be swept up easily.

Until she was met by a huge hammer crushing into her midsection. With a groan, she fell to the ground, arms clutching at what could easily be broken ribs. Her eyes moved past her attacker, to her hero. She pleaded with him to hurry and watched as he fought to get all the speed his mount could muster.

It wouldn't be enough. She'd never even get a clear view of the hammer as it came crashing down, and smashed into her face at full force. The monster of a man swung the blood splattered hammer over his shoulder and turned to stare at the hero, an evil smirk on his face before making an escape.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Horrified, he sat by his office window staring out at his city. Fires raged from nearly every building. Blood stained what he would've thought to be peaceful streets only a year ago. Tears fell from his eyes as he realized that he was very likely the only person still alive in the city. It would only be a matter of time before they managed to make their way to him.

THUD.

He shook, not even turning to face the doorway that had just been the victim of a severe kick.

THUD.

This time the door made a cracking sound as it gave way to the assault. He held his arms out, refusing to turn and acknowledge his murderer face to face. Heavy footsteps crossed the floor of his office until they were close enough to send a chill down his spine. One swift blade swipe followed, and his body fell to the floor.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Master, wait!"

He fought to catch air as he held an arm up, his body hunched over in a desperate attempt to regain composure.

"We must keep going. Something horrible is happening."

He turned to face his servant and let out a slight laugh as he saw him hunched. He made his way back, gave him a pat on the back and nudged him to look just up the road to a horizon of flames from the burning Border City.

"We have to find out what's going on and try to help anyone who may be left. Some might be useful."

He ran off, leaving his servant to catch up once more.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

moon_lit_tears is dead. She was Jayde, Freedom Aligned Screaming Innocent.

Arrows is dead. He was Ashton, Freedom Aligned Border City Mayor.

[Arrows]

Alive:

1. Antithesis
2. Astil
3. bak42
5. BlueStar
6. Comradebot
14. iMac
21. Olivier le Fou
22. Paws7297
29. gonvick
31. TheKenwyne
34. Wrestling Century

Dead:

moon_lit_tears is dead. She was Jayde, Freedom Aligned Screaming Innocent.
Arrows is dead. He was Ashton, Freedom Aligned Border City Mayor.
SmartBomb is dead. She was Andra, Freedom Aligned Inspirational Lover.
Jaded is dead. He was Trevor, Freedom Aligned Waiting Traitor.
ShadowedFlames is dead. He was Duncan, Freedom Aligned Dragon Rider.
Zeel1 is dead. He was Brutus, Freedom Aligned Loyal Bodyguard.
The Two is dead. He was Ivan, Freedom Aligned Impatient Tracker.
Tha Black Phenom has left. He was Skylar, Sonia Aligned Incredible Hunter.
JMan2k3 vanished. He was Blight, Unaligned Mysterious Mercenary.
EddieFnG is dead. He was Biron, Freedom Aligned Elite Strategist.
Rabbitman is dead. He was Aricin, Freedom Aligned Rebel Prince.
praguepride is dead. He was Mark, Shining Armor Aligned Grateful Servant.
Destiny is dead. She was Emily, Freedom Aligned Gutsy Innkeeper.
Wallbanger is dead. He was Nikan, Nedokius Aligned Merciless King.
hellboy2 is dead. He was Daniel, Freedom Aligned Sneaky Investigator.
djthefunkchris is dead. He was Yama, Nedokius Aligned Brutal Knight.
Max Peck is dead. He was Gilbert, Freedom Aligned Overstocked Merchant.
mjdgoldeneye is dead. He was Michael, Shining Armor Aligned Master Knight.
Crychon is dead. He was Rom, Freedom Aligned Peeping Weirdo.
Dragonmack is dead. Alister, Freedom Aligned Reckless Soldier.
derek_b is dead. He was Perci, Shining Armor Aligned Apprentice Doctor.
masterded is dead. He was Cam, Shining Armor Aligned Pissed Off Warrior.
BHK1978 is dead. He was Ian, Freedom Aligned Yell Master.
JackalBane is dead. He was Sucellos, Nedokius Aligned Blunt Weapon Weilding Brute.
Sazzita is dead. He was Morgan, Freedom Aligned Medical Genius.
petrija is dead. She was Sulis, Nedokius Aligned Beautiful General.

Write Ups:
Day One: Astil Elected Leader. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1226931&postcount=385)
Night One: Deaths of SmartBomb and Jaded. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1228425&postcount=466)
Day Two: No Lynch. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1231690&postcount=668)
Night Two: Deaths of ShadowedFlames, Zeel1, gonvick and The Two. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1233586&postcount=708)
Day Three Mid Day: Revival Of gonvick. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1235168&postcount=875)
Day Three Mid Day Two: Death of Tha Black Phenom. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1235342&postcount=903)
Day Three: Lynch of JMan2k3. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1237504&postcount=1245)
Night Three: Deaths of EddieFnG and Rabbitman. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1239695&postcount=1399)
Day Four: Lynch of praguepride. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1242969&posted=1#post1242969)
Night Four: Death of Destiny. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1244038&postcount=1728)
Day Five: Lynch of Wallbanger. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1245814&postcount=1969)
Night Five: Deaths of hellboy2, djthefunkchris, and Max Peck. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1246842&postcount=2022)
Day Six: Lynch of mjdgoldeneye. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1249476&postcount=2283)
Night Six: Death of Crychon. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1250571&postcount=2302)
Day Seven Part 1: Mod kill of Dragonmack. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1250743&postcount=2330)
Day Seven Part 2: Death of derek_b. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1252120&postcount=2527)
Day Seven Part 3: Lynch of masterded. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1252902&postcount=2595)
Night Seven: Death of BHK1978. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1254120&postcount=2613)
Day Eight Part 1: Death of JackalBane. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1256374&postcount=2763)
Day Eight: No Lynch. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1257472&postcount=2822)
Night Eight: Death of Sazzita. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1258764&postcount=2832)
Day Nine: Lynch of petrija. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1261691&postcount=3002)
Night Nine: Nothing. (http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1263103&postcount=3027)

[Arrows]

It is now day phase one. Since this is day one, you will be electing a leader for the town. If you have any questions about a king maker game, feel free to PM me or even post them in the thread. I'm sure some would be more than happy to assist in understanding.

That went on a lot longer than I expected. I apologize.

Let's try this again.

Sees:(

Sorry.

It is now day phase one. Today you are electing your leader by majority decision. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT (I don't know. I guess. Is it 5 hours right now?)

Sigh.

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

[petrija]

I win.

The end.

[Paws7297]

Meow.....

[Toasty]

This will be an interesting game...

[Astil]

Vote: Derek_b

[Toasty]

So are we voting for a king right now?

[Paws7297]

This will be an interesting game...

:rolleyes: Every game is an interesting game to some extent. :p

Vote: Jaded He knows why.

[Paws7297]

This will be an interesting game...
Wth did this quote come from? -.- I already replied to it.
So are we voting for a king right now?

Duuno. Never played a kingmaker before. I forget where I read about it to go back and look.

[Toasty]

Can someone give me a list of kingmaker games? I want to read some.

[The Two]

Well technically Day 1 has not been declared yet. We really shouldn't even be posting yet. Just wait until the Day is declared and we know the deadline and what we should be doing today.

[Antithesis]

Can someone give me a list of kingmaker games? I want to read some.

http://67.19.230.90/~arles/forum/showthread.php?t=30813

http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37570

Guess both of these would be considered King maker games. Also maybe the Sci Fi game, but I kind of recall that not being a big factor.

[Paws7297]

So.... King. Who do we want to be king?
Who wants to be king?
What are we doing here?
hmmmmm

[Dragonmack]

So.... King. Who do we want to be king?
Who wants to be king?
What are we doing here?
hmmmmm

I'd be king, but then Paws would assassinate me.

[Paws7297]

I'd be king, but then Paws would assassinate me.

If I had a kill I'd kill you night 1 wether you were the king or not. :p

I Vote: Comradebot my little sister to be king..... errr.... Queen

[Antithesis]

Well, general ideas for King is, sometimes there are a handful of roles made to fit with the King (maybe they get a bonus ability) though not always.

Outside of that, until we know exactly how the king works, someone who doesn't have a useful night ability (investigator/watcher/tracker/protector) would make for a good volunteer. As it could be becoming the King disrupts your ability.

These are all asumptions at this point though.

[Antithesis]

Well, general ideas for King is, sometimes there are a handful of roles made to fit with the King (maybe they get a bonus ability) though not always.

Outside of that, until we know exactly how the king works, someone who doesn't have a useful night ability (investigator/watcher/tracker/protector) would make for a good volunteer. As it could be becoming the King disrupts your ability.

These are all asumptions at this point though.

Also should add, some King flavored games, its the King who does the lynching. If that is the case, we would want someone who is active and (imho) calm and able to take input from the rest of the players

[Toasty]

Also should add, some King flavored games, its the King who does the lynching. If that is the case, we would want someone who is active and (imho) calm and able to take input from the rest of the players

What do you mean, who does the lynching?

[Paws7297]

Also should add, some King flavored games, its the King who does the lynching. If that is the case, we would want someone who is active and (imho) calm and able to take input from the rest of the players

/nod
Any volenteers?

[moon_lit_tears]

/nod
Any volenteers?

Sarah Palin....

[Max Peck]

Sarah Palin....

Funny....

[Toasty]

I'm pretty active enough to be the king, put I'm a much more then below average player. :P

[Astil]

I am generally fair and am willing to sacrifice my ego to follow the towns will.

So I s'pose I volunteer.

[Antithesis]

What do you mean, who does the lynching?

King makers, at the Mafiascum site anyway, were game wehere everyone elected a king, and it was the King who chose who got lynched. Meaning all the town could vote for was who became the King.

This made the election incredibly important.

I think the games here, the town can still lynch, and the "king" mainly joins a select group of helper type roles (a bodyguard, an investigator) etc... basically the public face of a mason group.


I should probably go ahead and share this, since its basically what I've always argued for this role since Eville.

I have the Hider role this game. :D

[Max Peck]

so how does the king fit into the scheme...wouldn't he be a HUGE target for the scum (you know, Paws and her ilk...)....?

[Toasty]

King makers, at the Mafiascum site anyway, were game wehere everyone elected a king, and it was the King who chose who got lynched. Meaning all the town could vote for was who became the King.

This made the election incredibly important.

I think the games here, the town can still lynch, and the "king" mainly joins a select group of helper type roles (a bodyguard, an investigator) etc... basically the public face of a mason group.


I should probably go ahead and share this, since its basically what I've always argued for this role since Eville.

I have the Hider role this game. :D

Alright thanks for educating me on that :p

[The Two]

Sarah Palin....
Nah, she'd only get bored and quit on Day 3 to go make loads of money without the hassle of actually governing. *Oooh, topical*


Hey, what's that in the ring over there? Why, it's my hat! I offer myself up as King, and I offer you all Good Times and Free Grog!

[Antithesis]

so how does the king fit into the scheme...wouldn't he be a HUGE target for the scum (you know, Paws and her ilk...)....?

They would normally, but Kings either become bulletproof/roleblock/silence proof or have some other roles added to protect them.

Like in Simpsons I can recall him having other players dedicated to protecting him.

Kings might also be investigation proof. Meaning once we elect him, there might not be a way to check if he is actually town aligned or not.

Some games, there is an election every day phase, but from the way it was written, I think this king might be permanent.

My suggestion would be, if someone really wants to be King, they need to claim fully.

[Toasty]

Just wondering, but what does everyone else here look for in a king?
Since I am pretty confuzzled right now.

[mjdgoldeneye]

Can I ask Arrows if we're allowed to know if the king gets any inherent bonuses besides getting to pick who gets lynched?

I will assume certain specific roles will be more interested in being king, but will being king, regardless of role, have any natural benefits? Or are we not allowed to know one way or the other.

As for me, being king would be fun, but I'm not going to campaign.

[Antithesis]

This might make the process a little easier

Volunteers So faR

Astil: No Info given

The Two: No info given

[Arrows]

Can I ask Arrows if we're allowed to know if the king gets any inherent bonuses besides getting to pick who gets lynched?

I will assume certain specific roles will be more interested in being king, but will being king, regardless of role, have any natural benefits? Or are we not allowed to know one way or the other.

As for me, being king would be fun, but I'm not going to campaign.

Will say there's something to be gained. We won't get into what.

[Paws7297]

Vote: Astil This time my vote is real.
Change vote: Astil Just in case.

[mjdgoldeneye]

They would normally, but Kings either become bulletproof/roleblock/silence proof or have some other roles added to protect them.

Like in Simpsons I can recall him having other players dedicated to protecting him.

Kings might also be investigation proof. Meaning once we elect him, there might not be a way to check if he is actually town aligned or not.

Some games, there is an election every day phase, but from the way it was written, I think this king might be permanent.

My suggestion would be, if someone really wants to be King, they need to claim fully.

These are all questions that should be answered for us and if they aren't, we should assume "no" or differ to other kingmaker games/more detailed rules.

Reasoning under the assumption you're town, you're slightly paranoid. We're not going to be making any game-breaking decisions on Day 1. If that's possible, the game is broken or we suck. Let's play on the naive side knowing that we don't know but not trying really hard to set up for every possible permutation of possibility just yet.

Reasoning under the assumption you're scum, you're making it hard for a legitimately worthy king from being able to offer his services without fear of being driven to full disclosure. You'd be ensuring a scum king or an outed town king, both bad for the town, good for prospective scum.

Let's take it easy and just pick someone using some sort of line of reasoning using what we KNOW (which is limited). We'll know the realities of kingship well before we make some sort of irreversible mistake. I have that much faith in Arrows. :D

[Astil]

This might make the process a little easier

Volunteers So faR

Astil: No Info given

The Two: No info given

IGMEOY

[The Two]

This might make the process a little easier

Volunteers So faR

Astil: No Info given

The Two: No info given
No info given? What part of "good times and free grog" didn't you understand? :p

[Arrows]

For the sake of answering mechanics based questions.

There won't be daily elections. If the leader were to die, a new one would be chosen, as part of that day phase, before the lynch. Consider it a penalty. Of course, discussion about the lynch can still happen as well, so it shouldn't crush the towns day, but it is another bump on the road.

[EddieFnG]

I seem to remember a kingmaker game (on another forum) where the king had the only vote.

So on day 1 it's pretty damn hard 'cause you have to pick somebody you can trust as a townie, which obviously on day 1, we have no clue.

[Antithesis]

These are all questions that should be answered for us and if they aren't, we should assume "no" or differ to other kingmaker games/more detailed rules.

Reasoning under the assumption you're town, you're slightly paranoid. We're not going to be making any game-breaking decisions on Day 1. If that's possible, the game is broken or we suck. Let's play on the naive side knowing that we don't know but not trying really hard to set up for every possible permutation of possibility just yet.

Reasoning under the assumption you're scum, you're making it hard for a legitimately worthy king from being able to offer his services without fear of being driven to full disclosure. You'd be ensuring a scum king or an outed town king, both bad for the town, good for prospective scum.

Let's take it easy and just pick someone using some sort of line of reasoning using what we KNOW (which is limited). We'll know the realities of kingship well before we make some sort of irreversible mistake. I have that much faith in Arrows. :D

Huh?

I've already claimed to be a Hider, and I am not asking to be made King. Anyone who wants my vote, needs to provide full disclosure, or, aside from that, some very strong hints.

Besides, your argument is inherently flawed. Its mafia, you can't just claim someone is "legitimately worthy" of anything D1 without them disclosing something. To even pretend thats possible is just sillyness.

[Antithesis]

IGMEOY

Fair enough.

I remember Sci Fi mafia, and your ability to spin quite the yarn. :D

[Wrestling Century]

Vote: Wrestling Century

Because I sure do know how to win teh gamez! :p

[Wrestling Century]

Wait, I just thought of something. What if we accidentally elect a scum member? Also, what would a king even do? Would they get any special powers?

[Paws7297]

Wait, I just thought of something. What if we accidentally elect a scum member? Also, what would a king even do? Would they get any special powers?

Did you read anything before you posted? :p

[Wrestling Century]

Did you read anything before you posted? :p

No, I read after. :p Sorry about that.

[Jman2k3]

Sweet write up.

[mjdgoldeneye]

Huh?

I've already claimed to be a Hider, and I am not asking to be made King. Anyone who wants my vote, needs to provide full disclosure, or, aside from that, some very strong hints.

Besides, your argument is inherently flawed. Its mafia, you can't just claim someone is "legitimately worthy" of anything D1 without them disclosing something. To even pretend thats possible is just sillyness.

You seem to be acting intentionally ignorant.

The point is not to purposely seek worthy leaders by forcing them to take part in Suicide Idol. Your tactic scares away potentially powerful leaders or at least forces them to lie by omission.

"I'm an investigator! Can I be king?" "No! Me! If I get elected king, I get a night kill!"

It's ludicrous.

You seem to be in favor of electing someone who is outwardly expendable as king because if they claim, it isn't a big deal. Do you think players are stupid? Who would ASK for such an "honor". It's like asking who wants to be in the front of your single-file battle formation. :p

Yea, it's a team game. However, I think you're going at it in a very odd and very counter-intuitive way.

I would like to request that potential kings NOT fully claim for the sake of getting Anti's vote. I hope that the majority of us willing voters aren't going to look at the job of king as a self-sacrifice.

[Paws7297]

Sweet write up. Off to bed.

*cough*

[mjdgoldeneye]

IGMEOY

We're like minded.

Vote: Astil

You've made some crazy calls and judgments that I've seen, but we're on the same page so far.

[Paws7297]

I'm with Mj. And, Astil for king!

[masterded]

I got no reason to trust someone or want anyone more then anyone else. So for now I am just going with someone I respect.

Vote: Comradebot

[Jman2k3]

*cough*

Don't be jealous. :p

[Wallbanger]

I offer you both chislic AND cheesecake, and there still aren't any votes for me? I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you. And sad. :(

Do I need to throw bacon into the mix? Everything's better with bacon, you know.

[Antithesis]

You seem to be acting intentionally ignorant.

The point is not to purposely seek worthy leaders by forcing them to take part in Suicide Idol. Your tactic scares away potentially powerful leaders or at least forces them to lie by omission.

"I'm an investigator! Can I be king?" "No! Me! If I get elected king, I get a night kill!"

It's ludicrous.

You seem to be in favor of electing someone who is outwardly expendable as king because if they claim, it isn't a big deal. Do you think players are stupid? Who would ASK for such an "honor". It's like asking who wants to be in the front of your single-file battle formation. :p

Yea, it's a team game. However, I think you're going at it in a very odd and very counter-intuitive way.

I would like to request that potential kings NOT fully claim for the sake of getting Anti's vote. I hope that the majority of us willing voters aren't going to look at the job of king as a self-sacrifice.



How would disclaiming before becoming King be any more suicidal than being King?

Its not like if player X claims role Y, does a good job hammering scum, that scum will want them more deaderererer, because, dead is dead.

Arrows has already said what i had assumed... there won't be daily elections.

Ergo, this needs to be an informed decision. Or do you really think we can surmise a "legitimately worthy" candidate without information?

[moon_lit_tears]

I offer you both chislic AND cheesecake, and there still aren't any votes for me? I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you. And sad. :(

Do I need to throw bacon into the mix? Everything's better with bacon, you know.


VOTE boss... Damnit!! I tried, can I atleast have cheesecake? :D

[Paws7297]

Don't be jealous. :p
Hahahaha
I offer you both chislic AND cheesecake, and there still aren't any votes for me? I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you. And sad. :(

Do I need to throw bacon into the mix? Everything's better with bacon, you know.

B-b-bacoooooon.....

Sorry even though I love bacon, my vote won't budge Astil would make a great leader. :p

[Wrestling Century]

Bacon, you say?

Change Vote: Wallbanger

All hail the bacon giver! :p

[praguepride]

I ll e king. maybe if i have ab army of advisors i can put my fearsome piwers of deduction to good use.

and by deduction i mean pullng stuff out of my paranoid ass.

i dont know if id trust derek or two for king. they are scary players especially as scum..
honestly id want a smart player who cant fool me when they are scum.

someone like destiny or mlt who is too honest to trick me.

this way if we nominate a scum king we can figure it out fast :)

then again the only two people i trust at this point is me ;)

[Antithesis]

For the sake of answering mechanics based questions.

There won't be daily elections. If the leader were to die, a new one would be chosen, as part of that day phase, before the lynch. Consider it a penalty. Of course, discussion about the lynch can still happen as well, so it shouldn't crush the towns day, but it is another bump on the road.

You guys should really be more carefull throwing your votes around.

[Wrestling Century]

I ll e king. maybe if i have ab army of advisors i can put my fearsome piwers of deduction to good use.

and by deduction i mean pullng stuff out of my paranoid ass.

i dont know if id trust derek or two for king. they are scary players especially as scum..
honestly id want a smart player who cant fool me when they are scum.

someone like destiny or mlt who is too honest to trick me.

this way if we nominate a scum king we can figure it out fast :)

then again the only two people i trust at this point is me ;)

What kind of post restriction is that?

[praguepride]

What kind of post restriction is that?




the kind where im texting this while catching a bus. id full claim now but there is no.way id.get.it.out before tomorrow between my thick thumbs and an angry wife whom im already late for :D

[Wrestling Century]

the kind where im texting this while catching a bus. id full claim now but there is no.way id.get.it.out before tomorrow between my thick thumbs and an angry wife whom im already late for :D

So you are on a phone. Also, don't full claim just to become king. That would be pretty stupid IMO.

[praguepride]

and for the record, NONE of this is clues or anything remotely hinting at my role.

i dont want a repeat of ripper where my op just happened to coincide with the murderer's choice of weapon xD

[praguepride]

So you are on a phone. Also, don't full claim just to become king. That would be pretty stupid IMO.


meh, my role is pretty weird and not very useful anyway.

in fact... i dont even know how to describe it without copy pasta arrow's ridiculously huge long role pm.

sheesh, it took me two sittings to read through :)

[Wrestling Century]

meh, my role is pretty weird and not very useful anyway.

in fact... i dont even know how to describe it without copy pasta arrow's ridiculously huge long role pm.

sheesh, it took me two sittings to read through :)

Yeah, but I still think that it isn't wise to claim anything on Day 1.

[gonvick]

Let's take it easy and just pick someone using some sort of line of reasoning using what we KNOW (which is limited). We'll know the realities of kingship well before we make some sort of irreversible mistake. I have that much faith in Arrows. :D

So what line of reasoning are you suggesting? Should we just play the odds and hope we don't end up in that approximate 30% range that would have us electing scum?

Reasoning under the assumption you're scum, you're making it hard for a legitimately worthy king from being able to offer his services without fear of being driven to full disclosure. You'd be ensuring a scum king or an outed town king, both bad for the town, good for prospective scum.

And one could just as easily make the case that you're trying to make it easier for scum to be elected king, especially if one happens to be a respected player.


I'm not in favor of a mass day 1 claim fest to try to find a suitable king. But I also don't like choosing without any info either. So I leave it to each individual player to decide if they want the position, and if it's worth giving up anything to gain trust or not. Hopefully along the way we learn enough to make a semi-informed decision.

[Paws7297]

While I agree it can be helpful in keeping from choosing scum, don't claim. It puts you in more danger.
Also aif everyone who wants to be king role claims, we have alot of outted townies whomight have nice abilities floating around for scum to kill.
Don't claim for king.
And vote Astil.

[praguepride]

i would full claim if it would.make people feel better about electing me. im a good guy, dont have a "power" role and im the only one i trust 100% at this point.

given.my track record i can understand why town would want a "cooler" head at the helm.

[Antithesis]

I think MJ missed the finer point, which I didn't want to just blurt out, but here goes.

If scum really thought they would have to fully claim D1 to get elected, they probably wouldn't even submit their name for consideration.

What I would like to avoid is a repeat of Forum Wars, where there was a popularity vote and DJ was elected and it turned out he was scum.

[Paws7297]

So what line of reasoning are you suggesting? Should we just play the odds and hope we don't end up in that approximate 30% range that would have us electing scum?



And one could just as easily make the case that you're trying to make it easier for scum to be elected king, especially if one happens to be a respected player.


I'm not in favor of a mass day 1 claim fest to try to find a suitable king. But I also don't like choosing without any info either. So I leave it to each individual player to decide if they want the position, and if it's worth giving up anything to gain trust or not. Hopefully along the way we learn enough to make a semi-informed decision.
Giving some info might be nice....
Just not full claims and stuffs.....

[praguepride]

well, you guys decide what you want to happen and let now know. im going to bed now.

[Paws7297]

well, you guys decide what you want to happen and let now know. im going to bed now.

Good night Praque.

[Antithesis]

I think MJ missed the finer point, which I didn't want to just blurt out, but here goes.

If scum really thought they would have to fully claim D1 to get elected, they probably wouldn't even submit their name for consideration.

What I would like to avoid is a repeat of Forum Wars, where there was a popularity vote and DJ was elected and it turned out he was scum.

Also should add, if we set the parameters to "does not have a power role / does not go out at night to even nominate themselves"

Even if scum did try to go for it, that would lock them in to a story that most likely would not stay consistent for the entire game.

But throw all that out, you get a scenario where scum can get his buddies to vote and not have to provide details, allowing them to tell any lie they like, not only about themselves, but the King position itself.

:shrug: Its not an either/or choice. There is a happy medium, I just don't feel like arguing with MJ for 48 hours to get him to see common sense.

[praguepride]

Good night Praque.

grrrr...

its PRAGUE!!!! WITH A 'G'

GGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!111111oneoneoneoneone

[Antithesis]

well, you guys decide what you want to happen and let now know. im going to bed now.

Honestly, I'd consider it(voting for you) provided that you promise to be around alot. You are usually pretty active, so i don't think that will be an issue.

I am slightly concerned over the "super long PM"/ not very useful role. That seems a tad contrary, in my experience. But I am not pressing you to explain now.

[Paws7297]

Also should add, if we set the parameters to "does not have a power role / does not go out at night to even nominate themselves"

Even if scum did try to go for it, that would lock them in to a story that most likely would not stay consistent for the entire game.

But throw all that out, you get a scenario where scum can get his buddies to vote and not have to provide details, allowing them to tell any lie they like, not only about themselves, but the King position itself.

:shrug: Its not an either/or choice. There is a happy medium, I just don't feel like arguing with MJ for 48 hours to get him to see common sense.
Eh, true...
grrrr...

its PRAGUE!!!! WITH A 'G'

GGGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!111111oneoneoneoneone
:)
Okay Praque with a 'G'.

[gonvick]

And vote Astil.

Care to make a case for why we should do that?

[Paws7297]

Care to make a case for why we should do that?

Nah. Just joking around a bit. There was suppsed to be a face there.

Trying to be like the people on tv and the signs all over the place and the people who won't stop calling my house 24/7. Ya know like the real election stuff. :o

I kinda trust Astil anyway though.

[ShadowedFlames]

Not going to make any decisions on my end until I've had some sleep. Which should come about now, now that I've beaten Fable III. :p

Also, nice write up, and Daykill: MLT for the heck of it. :eek:

[moon_lit_tears]

Not going to make any decisions on my end until I've had some sleep. Which should come about now, now that I've beaten Fable III. :p

Also, nice write up, and Daykill: MLT for the heck of it. :eek:

Modkilling ShadowedFlames. go to bed. :p

[Paws7297]

Modkilling ShadowedFlames. go to bed. :p

Night1 kill- Moon_lit_teats
You're now triple dead! :p

[BHK1978]

Hi everybody, okay I am going to have to side with Anti on the voting for King. I want someone that we can trust, I do not think we should just go off and vote willy nilly.

[BHK1978]

To add to my post, the urge to vote for Destiny as King is great.

[Arrows]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 2 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye)

Comradebot: 1 (masterded)

Wallbanger: 1 (Wrestling Century)

[Comradebot]

Finally read up...

And I have to say, I'd love to be king, if for no other reason than it'd make me laugh based on my role.

That said, it also may not be in my best interest.

[Jman2k3]

Vote: Comradebot for king.

[JackalBane]

My two cents:

It's day one. As far as we know, this king we choose could 1) be able to vote someone else off, 2) lose their night ability and/or 3) something else that helps/hinders the given king. Hell, it could change based on your character or alignment.

Anything could happen and I suggest we just pick someone who's willing to test it/that we all agree on.

Me personally, I'm somewhere between wanting to test it and wanting to stand back. I'd rather not be the guinea pig, though. :o

[SmartBomb]

My two cents:

It's day one. As far as we know, this king we choose could 1) be able to vote someone else off, 2) lose their night ability and/or 3) something else that helps/hinders the given king. Hell, it could change based on your character or alignment.

Anything could happen and I suggest we just pick someone who's willing to test it/that we all agree on.

Me personally, I'm somewhere between wanting to test it and wanting to stand back. I'd rather not be the guinea pig, though. :o

My two cents:

What about if we elect the mafia as king?

They get control of everything.

And we can't vote them off.

Be careful, guys.

[BHK1978]

Think I know who the Scum are in this game:

1. Antithesis
2. Astil
3. bak42
5. BlueStar
6. Comradebot
7. Crychon
8. derek_b
9. Destiny
10. DragonMack
11. EddieFnG
12. gonvick
13. hellboy2
14. iMac
15. JackalBane
16. Jaded
17. Jman2k3
18. masterded
19. Max Peck
20. mjdgoldeneye
21. Olivier le Fou
22. Paws7297
23. petrija
24. praguepride
25. Rabbitman
26. Sazzita
27. ShadowedFlames
28. SmartBomb
29. Tha Black Phenom
30. The Two
31. TheKenwyne
32. Toasty
33. Wallbanger
34. Wrestling Century
35. Zeel1

So yeah six to eight of these people are Scum. Okay game over...

You will see that I am right at end game.

[Rabbitman]

I vote: EddiefnG to be our leader.

I'm scum and I'm going for the worst possible choice for leader because I'm evil like that. :D

[BHK1978]

I vote: EddiefnG to be our leader.

I'm scum and I'm going for the worst possible choice for leader because I'm evil like that. :D

Why do you believe that Eddie is the worst possible choice for leader?

[Rabbitman]

He's dutch. :eek:

[Rabbitman]

Serious hat on now.


I seem to remember a kingmaker game (on another forum) where the king had the only vote.

So on day 1 it's pretty damn hard 'cause you have to pick somebody you can trust as a townie, which obviously on day 1, we have no clue.


I believe we are thinking of the same game.

I think that almost everyone was vanilla.

Except for the kingmaker, the mafia having a kill and the king themselves.

The kingmaker would select a king each night phase and if the kingmaker was ever killed, a new kingmaker would be randomly selected and that person would then be responsible for selecting a king each night from then on(unless they died to).

In the day phase, the king would have the sole vote. The town usually advised the king but it was his/her decision in the end.

[iMac]

To add to my post, the urge to vote for Destiny as King is great.

I'm iMac and I approve this message.


But yeah, like hullo.

[Comradebot]

I'm iMac and I approve this message.


But yeah, like hullo.

The only problem with that plan?

Destiny is scum. :p

[iMac]

The only problem with that plan?

Destiny is scum. :p

I willing to put up with that for teh lulz!!1!

[praguepride]

I kinda trust Astil anyway though.


Yeah... you should bring that up to the "sci-fi chaos crowd" and see how fart that goes :D

[Comradebot]

Yeah... you should bring that up to the "sci-fi chaos crowd" and see how fart that goes :D

:eek:

[praguepride]

... stupid phone

[TheKenwyne]

Checking in. Never played a Kingmaker game before so I have no clue what to expect - just to confirm what has gone before the King is the only one to be able to vote? Or do we not yet know? It's been a bit confusing for me and I want to get straight what I'm voting for before I do :)

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 2 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Wallbanger: 1 (Wrestling Century)

[EddieFnG]

Did you miss rabbitman's vote for me? :P

In all seriousness, this thread is full with too much joke posting, and we'll never figure out who to trust this way, so I'm gonna go with my gut and say

Vote: Astil

[ShadowedFlames]

Yeah... you should bring that up to the "sci-fi chaos crowd" and see how fart that goes :D

I refuse to trust Astil after that trainwreck of a game.

I'm seriously leaning towards a c-bot vote just because, but I'll let some more voices be heard (and wait till I get home) before voting.

[praguepride]

Hmmmm.... I find it very interesting that people are dropping votes on Astil without any serious consideration.

I smell insider information!

[Dragonmack]

As this is only my second mafia game ever and my first kingmaker, I don't really have a big clue how this goes. So since I know Astil has a better grasp on the playstyle I will vote for him this round

Vote: Astil

[Derek B]

Hi everybody!

As I said in the sign up thread, I'm happy to put myself forward to be king. Now that I've got a role... I'm still happy.

The long and short of it is pretty simple. I'm almost always around, except for this first phase where I'm still going to be out in the middle of nowhere until tomorrow night. In a game this size it seems that almost everyone is going to have an ability of some sort. I'm happy enough to risk losing mine and to stick a great big target on my back as King. And we all know that I'm more than reasonable when it comes to listening to other people's advice and that I'm a good player. I always start with a big target on my back anyways, so putting a crown on top of that means we're not spreading our risk out over a larger number of players. I could keep making reasons, but let it just be known that I would like the job and all the cookies you get for being King. :)

KING VOTE: Derek B

Also... I called dibs and blunderbuss (the precursor to the shotgun) in the sign-up thread so the role is rightfully mine. :p

I woulda posted this hours ago... but the internet cut out for a few hours, making me sad while I tried to repair my DS charger which had an unfortunate incident last night. On the plus side... I've got six level 1, male Treecko up for trade if I ever get online with my DS. :D

[Comradebot]

Hi everybody!

As I said in the sign up thread, I'm happy to put myself forward to be king. Now that I've got a role... I'm still happy.

The long and short of it is pretty simple. I'm almost always around, except for this first phase where I'm still going to be out in the middle of nowhere until tomorrow night. In a game this size it seems that almost everyone is going to have an ability of some sort. I'm happy enough to risk losing mine and to stick a great big target on my back as King. And we all know that I'm more than reasonable when it comes to listening to other people's advice and that I'm a good player. I always start with a big target on my back anyways, so putting a crown on top of that means we're not spreading our risk out over a larger number of players. I could keep making reasons, but let it just be known that I would like the job and all the cookies you get for being King. :)

KING VOTE: Derek B

Also... I called dibs and blunderbuss (the precursor to the shotgun) in the sign-up thread so the role is rightfully mine. :p

I woulda posted this hours ago... but the internet cut out for a few hours, making me sad while I tried to repair my DS charger which had an unfortunate incident last night. On the plus side... I've got six level 1, male Treecko up for trade if I ever get online with my DS. :D

You know what? Every point you just made could be said about myself. I'm typically around, a relatively reasonable fellow, and let's face it: when I'm not scum (like this game, for instance), I tend to die very, very quickly.

That, and I have this:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/CvUFcGHb9vM?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/CvUFcGHb9vM?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 4 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, EddieFnG, DragonMack)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Derek_b: 1 (Derek_b)

Wallbanger: 1 (Wrestling Century)

[EddieFnG]

Comrade, you're also the guy who said it might not be in your best interest earlier, and now you're putting yourself forward again?

[Comradebot]

Comrade, you're also the guy who said it might not be in your best interest earlier, and now you're putting yourself forward again?

It also might be in my best interest.

It's quite the gamble for me, I assure you. Then again, it may be a benefit for me with some luck.

I supposse I could just explain my situation, despite my long standing policy of never ever saying anything about myself for as long as humanly possible.

[Derek B]

You know what? Every point you just made could be said about myself. I'm typically around, a relatively reasonable fellow, and let's face it: when I'm not scum (like this game, for instance), I tend to die very, very quickly.

That, and I have this:

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/CvUFcGHb9vM?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/CvUFcGHb9vM?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

All very true, although you didn't call dibs. :p

But let's face it... you're from Texas and you don't have kings there. I have dual nationality from two countries with roayl families, so I truly understand the pressures that come from being royalty. :p

Seriously though... it'll probably come down to whoever claims first like it has in previous games. I could do that now if anyone really wanted me to but it's always good to get some notes on who is willing to actually throw their hats in the ring. If anyone wanted to assume I was scum then this wouldn't be the first time I'd been so bold as to throw my hat in on D1 as scum... remember the "fun" we all had in Simpsons when Mr T stole the kingship by claiming on D1 after I'd strongly implied I was part of a mason group, which was actually a cult? Fun times.

But more importantly, I'm happy to roleclaim in order to be King. I don't think other people would be so bold, but I'm interested to see who is and isn't, most people are likely to be townies anyways. :)

[EddieFnG]

I'm happy to Change vote: Derek B

'cause he called dibs.

[Comradebot]

All very true, although you didn't call dibs. :p

But let's face it... you're from Texas and you don't have kings there. I have dual nationality from two countries with roayl families, so I truly understand the pressures that come from being royalty. :p

Seriously though... it'll probably come down to whoever claims first like it has in previous games. I could do that now if anyone really wanted me to but it's always good to get some notes on who is willing to actually throw their hats in the ring. If anyone wanted to assume I was scum then this wouldn't be the first time I'd been so bold as to throw my hat in on D1 as scum... remember the "fun" we all had in Simpsons when Mr T stole the kingship by claiming on D1 after I'd strongly implied I was part of a mason group, which was actually a cult? Fun times.

But more importantly, I'm happy to roleclaim in order to be King. I don't think other people would be so bold, but I'm interested to see who is and isn't, most people are likely to be townies anyways. :)

Well, so could I. Again, would all make sense if I did.


And as for King's in Texas... well, let's see... my dad is from Mississippi, which is the birthplace of THE King...

And we (well, not I), just elected Rick Perry to his third consecutive four year term as governor (and that's not even counting the extra two years he got from GW Bush leaving office to be president!). So, he's sort of a king. As in a political leader that is completely and utterly impossible to get rid of until he dies (at this rate).



Besides, we're ELECTING a King. Clearly a democratic process, which both the United States of America AND the former Republic of Texas utilize(d).

Also, Texas was the first nation to enact a homestead exemption. In other words, I cannot have creditor agents seize your primary residence.

[Derek B]

I'm happy to Change vote: Derek B

'cause he called dibs.

Huzzah! In the event of getting to elect some kind of officials to help me out as King, you shall definitely be on the list of candidates. In fact, anyone who votes for me shall be. :)

Well, so could I. Again, would all make sense if I did.


And as for King's in Texas... well, let's see... my dad is from Mississippi, which is the birthplace of THE King...

And we (well, not I), just elected Rick Perry to his third consecutive four year term as governor (and that's not even counting the extra two years he got from GW Bush leaving office to be president!). So, he's sort of a king. As in a political leader that is completely and utterly impossible to get rid of until he dies (at this rate).



Besides, we're ELECTING a King. Clearly a democratic process, which both the United States of America AND the former Republic of Texas utilize(d).

Also, Texas was the first nation to enact a homestead exemption. In other words, I cannot have creditor agents seize your primary residence.

Elvis isn't king of anything in particular, it's like every time The Two tells me I can't declare myself as a country because I don't have enough land on which to sustain people or crops or anything like that.... he's really mean, even when I point out that while I'm in the bath I'm an island nation. :)

And not to get too topical, but I'm sure The Two would strongly consider arguging against the notion of the USA as a democracy. He'd probably put some strong cases against the UK. But that's another argument for another time and place...

... because this is about weeding out who really wants to be king and trying to work out why. Everything else around that is me yanking the collective chains of anyone posting adn reminding people that I'm still here even during my times of hardship in the middle of nowhere, with no-one to keep me warm but my overbreeding pokemon. :p

[Comradebot]

Huzzah! In the event of getting to elect some kind of officials to help me out as King, you shall definitely be on the list of candidates. In fact, anyone who votes for me shall be. :)



Elvis isn't king of anything in particular, it's like every time The Two tells me I can't declare myself as a country because I don't have enough land on which to sustain people or crops or anything like that.... he's really mean, even when I point out that while I'm in the bath I'm an island nation. :)

And not to get too topical, but I'm sure The Two would strongly consider arguging against the notion of the USA as a democracy. He'd probably put some strong cases against the UK. But that's another argument for another time and place...

... because this is about weeding out who really wants to be king and trying to work out why. Everything else around that is me yanking the collective chains of anyone posting adn reminding people that I'm still here even during my times of hardship in the middle of nowhere, with no-one to keep me warm but my overbreeding pokemon. :p

1. The USA and the UK are democracies. Not "true" democracies in the sense that every single individual has a vote to cast on every single issue, but only because that is a logistical impossibility at the national level. The Two or anyone else can feel free to argue that it's not, but in the end he, or anyone else for that matter, is wrong. It isn't something that's "up to interpretation", this isn't some impressionist art exhibit. The people vote on issues, or for representatives that vote on issues. Therefore, it's a democratic government. Maybe neither are the best example, but they ARE democracies. Arguement over.


2. Excuse me?! Elvis Presley is THE KING OF ROCK N' ROLL, which instantly gives him more power than any other two kings combined. Even more power if he has domain over the kind of "rock n' roll" hippies and douchebags continue to believe will "kill Fascism and free the masses, WHOOOOOO!!!", despite it being, well... just music. Fascists with guns will kill hippies with guitars on any given day, I assure you.

[praguepride]

Unless that hippy with a guitar is Elvis, in that case his music will BLOW MINDS!

and leave yucky brain chunks everywhere :p

[Derek B]

1. The USA and the UK are democracies. Not "true" democracies in the sense that every single individual has a vote to cast on every single issue, but only because that is a logistical impossibility at the national level. The Two or anyone else can feel free to argue that it's not, but in the end he, or anyone else for that matter, is wrong. It isn't something that's "up to interpretation", this isn't some impressionist art exhibit. The people vote on issues, or for representatives that vote on issues. Therefore, it's a democratic government. Maybe neither are the best example, but they ARE democracies. Arguement over.


2. Excuse me?! Elvis Presley is THE KING OF ROCK N' ROLL, which instantly gives him more power than any other two kings combined. Even more power if he has domain over the kind of "rock n' roll" hippies and douchebags continue to believe will "kill Fascism and free the masses, WHOOOOOO!!!", despite it being, well... just music. Fascists with guns will kill hippies with guitars on any given day, I assure you.


2. Hippies are funny. :)

1. I think you might be taking some aspects of my jokes a little too seriously, so I shall stop. Especially cos I shouldn't talk for The Two, even if I am just trying to wind up him up from a distance. I bet he's not even out of bed yet, assuming he isn't just sleeping in the armchair again. :p

....

Gonna head offline for the next few hours, might not be back on again tonight cos I'm planning to be out with an old friend tonight. I wonder what direction this democratic monarchy is going to take next? :D

[Derek B]

Unless that hippy with a guitar is Elvis, in that case his music will BLOW MINDS!

and leave yucky brain chunks everywhere :p

Hippie Elvis is very popular among the Zombie-American community, don't be dissing him.

[bak42]

I love how I'm the only person in this thread with the balls to actually be visible.:p

[praguepride]

I'm visible. I'm always visible. I don't think I've ever changed my status.

[Tha Black Phenom]

I offer you both chislic AND cheesecake, and there still aren't any votes for me? I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you. And sad. :(

Do I need to throw bacon into the mix? Everything's better with bacon, you know.

Tempting... as a matter of fact

Vote: Wallbanger

I just can't say no to bacon.

Game looks interesting, sweet write-up and all, I don't "prefer" Kingmaker games but a variation is always appreciable every once in a while. I shouldn't be too active by the way, working full-time and I *should* be sleeping during the day(ergo, right now) but my procrastinating self just keeps on going. Isn't that funny? Procrastinating from going to sleep?

As for who gets to be king, I'm also pretty sure it'll come down to whoever claims first and is trusted. Or momentum really has to shift someone's way due to luck/circumstance.

But it shall not matter anyway who is the king, for I am none other than:

Triple H, Freedom Aligned King of Kings

Kneel. and stuff.

[Destiny]

Vote: derek_b, as I feel that he'd make a competent king. However, I would like to know more about him.

[BHK1978]

I love how I'm the only person in this thread with the balls to actually be visible.:p

You know what? For that I shall Vote: bak42 for King. Because he has the guts to be visible.

[Antithesis]

Assuming the King role gets to communicate with a couple of cohorts, maybe it would actually be better if the King stayed invisible

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 3 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack)

Bak42 1 (BHK1978)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Derek_b: 3 (Derek_b, EddieFnG, Destiny)

Wallbanger: 2 (Wrestling Century, Tha Black Phenom)

[Destiny]

I wonder who would become King if no other votes are placed between now and the deadline.

[BHK1978]

I wonder who would become King if no other votes are placed between now and the deadline.

Maybe they RNG it. Not sure.

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 3 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack)

Bak42 1 (BHK1978)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Derek_b: 3 (Derek_b, EddieFnG, Destiny)

Wallbanger: 2 (Wrestling Century, Tha Black Phenom)


Read the entire post duh! :p

[BHK1978]

Read the entire post duh! :p

Yes but there is a tie in the vote. So how would the tie be broken?

[Tha Black Phenom]

Huh. Won't lie, I missed that part too.

So that means derek and Astil are quite within range of throne contention, slightly more than what I otherwise thought. And just a few more votes could put anyone of the others over the edge.

For now I'm undecided, so I'll stick with the Bacon Party.

[Tha Black Phenom]

Forgot to add maybe we should get some sort of engagement going to decide who will be our rightful king(and understudy.. to the Cerebral Assassin)

Yes but there is a tie in the vote. So how would the tie be broken?

By waiting until the deadline, perhaps? :o

[TheKenwyne]

What we need are some good old fashioned campaign speeches. Tell us (we the town) why we should vote for you! (The swindly politician)

I'm a bit out of the loop on player tendencies here, but are there any major players who haven't spoken up yet and could/should want to stand for King?

[BHK1978]

What we need are some good old fashioned campaign speeches. Tell us (we the town) why we should vote for you! (The swindly politician)

I'm a bit out of the loop on player tendencies here, but are there any major players who haven't spoken up yet and could/should want to stand for King?

I will be honest with you I would not trust C-Bot or Derek B. to be the King. Yes they are both really good players. However, both are very untrustworthy players as well. Out of the big names, if I had to vote on someone Wallbanger would be the person I would trust the most.

However, as of right now my vote shall stay on bak who in my opinion is a good player that never any credit for how good he is.

[Destiny]

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little surprised that mjdoldenee hasn't campaigned to become King.

[BHK1978]

I will be honest with you I would not trust C-Bot or Derek B. to be the King. Yes they are both really good players. However, both are very untrustworthy players as well. Out of the big names, if I had to vote on someone Wallbanger would be the person I would trust the most.

However, as of right now my vote shall stay on bak who in my opinion is a good player that never gets any credit for how good he is.

Because I left out the word gets.

[Antithesis]

I don't have a problem with Astil, personally, but maybe I missed where he gave a hint about himself... and from what i can recall, the votes for him seem like throw aways. C-bot, Derek, and Prague have at least shared a little something.

[BHK1978]

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little surprised that mjdoldenee hasn't campaigned to become King.

And why have you not campaigned to be King? After all, you are Don Destiny.

[Destiny]

I do agree with BHK1798 in that bak42 is a great player who normally flies under the radar.

[praguepride]

Alright, I'm trying reeeaaalll hard not to get paranoid, but I haven't seen a single piece about why I should vote for anyone. No claims, no hints, no vouchers, nadda.

And yet, I see votes pouring in on this person and that person and all I'm thinking is

Scum Group A
Scum Group B

I agree with the others. King should have full disclosure. I want a full claim first before we elect someone, and assurances that the king isn't a vital townie role that might get interferred with by being superceded with kingly duties.

In short:

1) I want to be able to have a King where everyone can easily identify what he's up to at night. So if someone is a gigantic purple elephant, I'd vote for them because if a gigantic purple elephant doesn't show up in the write ups, lynch 'em and get a gigantic flourescent blue ostrich instead.

2) Assurances that they have a minor or passive power. I don't want a cop being king only to find out that his kingly duties prevent him from being a cop.

3) Someone I can trust, if not #1 and #2. Someone like derek_b and astil, I trust that they're good players, but they're equally good as town or scum. Astil was able to win Sci-fi chaos as an OPEN CULT. He was a known cult and people still trusted him. Derek-b is just scary sometimes.

The only three people I trust at mafia are: MLT (who isn't playing), MJD (because every time he's been scum I saw right through it. See dust where for like, 5 day phases I was screaming "MJD=scum" and I was right!...but I wouldn't vote for him because we still have our feud going on) and Destiny (but his absence last training game makes me worried about an AFK king).

SO I'm offering my vote to the person who can convince me, by hook or by crook, that they're trustworthy and have the town's interest at heart.

A leader, a leader dedicated to smiting evil, saving damsels, the whole shebang.

[BHK1978]

Wait a second praquepride, you actually trust Destiny? I know you have been gone for a couple of months but surely you must remember that Destiny is always Scum. Even when he is town...:p

[TheKenwyne]

I will be honest with you I would not trust C-Bot or Derek B. to be the King. Yes they are both really good players. However, both are very untrustworthy players as well. Out of the big names, if I had to vote on someone Wallbanger would be the person I would trust the most.

However, as of right now my vote shall stay on bak who in my opinion is a good player that never any credit for how good he is.

Iiiiinteresting. And yet you yourself, as a relatively experienced player, do not want to be King?

But bak has yet to openly declare he wishes to be King, and I don't think an unwilling King will make a good one. Let's wait for him to offer his stance on the whole politicking thang.

I don't have a problem with Astil, personally, but maybe I missed where he gave a hint about himself... and from what i can recall, the votes for him seem like throw aways. C-bot, Derek, and Prague have at least shared a little something.

It IS Day 1. It could just be people chucking their votes around cos they can. Let's not read too much into it quite yet.

Alright, I'm trying reeeaaalll hard not to get paranoid, but I haven't seen a single piece about why I should vote for anyone. No claims, no hints, no vouchers, nadda.

And yet, I see votes pouring in on this person and that person and all I'm thinking is

Scum Group A
Scum Group B

I agree with the others. King should have full disclosure. I want a full claim first before we elect someone, and assurances that the king isn't a vital townie role that might get interferred with by being superceded with kingly duties.

In short:

1) I want to be able to have a King where everyone can easily identify what he's up to at night. So if someone is a gigantic purple elephant, I'd vote for them because if a gigantic purple elephant doesn't show up in the write ups, lynch 'em and get a gigantic flourescent blue ostrich instead.

2) Assurances that they have a minor or passive power. I don't want a cop being king only to find out that his kingly duties prevent him from being a cop.

3) Someone I can trust, if not #1 and #2. Someone like derek_b and astil, I trust that they're good players, but they're equally good as town or scum. Astil was able to win Sci-fi chaos as an OPEN CULT. He was a known cult and people still trusted him. Derek-b is just scary sometimes.

The only three people I trust at mafia are: MLT (who isn't playing), MJD (because every time he's been scum I saw right through it. See dust where for like, 5 day phases I was screaming "MJD=scum" and I was right!...but I wouldn't vote for him because we still have our feud going on) and Destiny (but his absence last training game makes me worried about an AFK king).

SO I'm offering my vote to the person who can convince me, by hook or by crook, that they're trustworthy and have the town's interest at heart.

A leader, a leader dedicated to smiting evil, saving damsels, the whole shebang.

Though the numbers do fit quite scarily well for two seperate scum groups, it's a bit WIFOM this early - I doubt even the most naive scum would all chuck their votes on one of their own and try to rush him into office, especially since we are unsure of the exact rule of the King.

Other than that well said sir. Are you yourself still interested in said post?

[BHK1978]

Iiiiinteresting. And yet you yourself, as a relatively experienced player, do not want to be King?

Yes but I am not a good player. Depending on the game I can be anywhere from a decent player to a very bad player. So I am not King material.

[TheKenwyne]

Yes but I am not a good player. Depending on the game I can be anywhere from a decent player to a very bad player. So I am not King material.

Fair play. As mentioned before I am not particularly 'in' with the whole Mafia clique so if I over/under rate your perceived ability please feel free to set me straight. :)

[praguepride]

Sure. Although to clarify a couple things


1) I too don't think that scum groups would be so ridiculous as to just expose themselves openly, but then again I have suspicions based on my PM that there are multiple factions with different "causes". Again, given info I (believe) I have, not all of them are evil which makes me think there's mason groups, or Town A and Town B type of things going on, thematic differentiation of townies.

2) My PM looked ridiculously long on my iPhone. Now that I see it on a normal monitor it's only a couple paragraphs.

3) I trust Destiny that Destiny is always scum. Therefore we don't have to waste time wondering about whether he is or not, we can elect/lynch/move on :D

4) Yes, if someone really wants to be King, make their presentation known. If nobody else does and time grows short, I'll do it for fear of electing an unknown and highly dangerous variable like "the big guys" (or as I like to call them, Liars, Inc. :D). Again, no disrepect to them but they tend to lie even as town and I'd would prefer, both thematically and practically, an honest leader.

[EddieFnG]

We've not even gotten to lynching yet, but prague's pretty much asking for everybody to claim before he can make a decision on voting?

'cause there's no such thing as a safeclaim, a fakeclaim, or anything like that?
People are just gonna come right out and claim 'cause you want them to?

Eh, you're kinda funny.

[BHK1978]

Come on Prague I intentionally spelled your name wrong just so you would correct me. And you did not even comment!:mad::D

[BHK1978]

We've not even gotten to lynching yet, but prague's pretty much asking for everybody to claim before he can make a decision on voting?

'cause there's no such thing as a safeclaim, a fakeclaim, or anything like that?
People are just gonna come right out and claim 'cause you want them to?

Eh, you're kinda funny.

This is very true, I mean I think it would be nice to have some sort of idea of what the king can or cannot do. However, if it is known then they become and even bigger target.

Tough call, people are going to vote either way so I guess vote for who is the most trustworthy. And even then it is hard to do because at this stage I trust no one.

[bak42]

What we need are some good old fashioned campaign speeches. Tell us (we the town) why we should vote for you! (The swindly politician)

Why should you vote for me? Because I can insure all of you that I won't break any campaign promises because I'm not going to make any. Plus, I'm vanilla.

[praguepride]

We've not even gotten to lynching yet, but prague's pretty much asking for everybody to claim before he can make a decision on voting?

'cause there's no such thing as a safeclaim, a fakeclaim, or anything like that?
People are just gonna come right out and claim 'cause you want them to?

Eh, you're kinda funny.


I'm just saying right now we have no idea what powers are bestowed to a king, so just blindly electing someone is a recipe for disaster.

Look at the Simpson mafia..scum was mayor, how could town let that happen?

I'm not saying that I'll believe it 100% but a scum fake claiming D1 is far more likely to get found out and lynched later on (if you can even lynch the king, again :confused: who can say what the king can and can't do) then if we blindly elect someone and scum gets an army of minions to gather info for him.

What if being King gave you a list of all the cops or protectors or what not. Even if they get lynched they'll pass that along and whaddya know, 1/2 through the game we've got no investigators, no protectors, and we're running blind.

All I'm saying is that if someone wants to be king, they should be willing to put themselves out in the spotlight for it. Scum hate the spotlight, right? So that should right off the bat weed out at least some of the sneakier scum. And ANYTHING that filters out scum is better then blindly electing random joe schmoe so forces of evil can laugh all the way to the "townie murder" bank :D

[TheKenwyne]

This is very true, I mean I think it would be nice to have some sort of idea of what the king can or cannot do. However, if it is known then they become and even bigger target.

Tough call, people are going to vote either way so I guess vote for who is the most trustworthy. And even then it is hard to do because at this stage I trust no one.

Way to steal my thunder.

I feel we should look for the least obvious but still plausable claim/hint. Any scum player can come out with the Freedom Aligned Vanilla claim, but hopefully we'll have people hinting/claiming more obscure yet still plausable abilities/alignments, and these would be the people to look at electing - simply because the scum most likely won't go for this type of claim for worry of being called BS on it so early.

[ShadowedFlames]

Re: KenWyne's post about experienced players and dreams of kinghood

By what you said, I should be looking to take the throne, as I'm one of the experienced players. I choose not to because of my normal play style, and the fact that right now, I think I am best served not being on the throne. Granted, I'd likely be plainly visible in write-ups, but at this time I'm staying out of the hunt.

What I WILL do, though, is Vote: bak42 for king as I'm a bit leery of giving supreme executive power to one of the more notable players. That's a disaster waiting to happen.

[praguepride]

I'd be willing to support bak42 as long as he promises to be active. He tends to be one of those "I'm active but I don't say anything and stay in the shadows until something forces my hand" kind of players.

I like me Kings right where I can see them :D

[Antithesis]

We've not even gotten to lynching yet, but prague's pretty much asking for everybody to claim before he can make a decision on voting?

'cause there's no such thing as a safeclaim, a fakeclaim, or anything like that?
People are just gonna come right out and claim 'cause you want them to?

Eh, you're kinda funny.

Well, if it was a themed game this would be infinately easier. Just ask for the character claim.

But put aside the claiming thing. Someone wants to nominate themself, what criteria should we use to determine who should be elected? Go by alphabetical order?

They are going to have to provide some kind of info. The debate really is how much... my thinking is this, if scum really believe that they'd have to claim fully (and therefore lie) to get elected D1, they won't even nominate themselves. And if they do, well then they are stuck with that lie from here on.

[BHK1978]

Anti, why are you not pushing for yourself to be King? You claim to be a hider (which is not exactly a power role) and you are proven to be a great town leader.

[Paws7297]

Yeah... you should bring that up to the "sci-fi chaos crowd" and see how fart that goes :D
I was in that game ya know. ;)
My win condition was to slime 10 people and Astil held the game into a couple of extra phases just so I could complete my win condition. (still never did though...)

Come on Prague I intentionally spelled your name wrong just so you would correct me. And you did not even comment!:mad::D
I'm guilty of this too.... :p :D


Also, is it bad when you start having dreams about playing mafia? :confused: Have I gone insane?

[Jaded]

Vote: bak42 - Good player as town but not horrifically scary as scum (sorry, Astil and Derek, no way on earth I want to risk EITHER of you as king.)

`

[BHK1978]

Now with votes behind bak, the paranoid side of me is thinking what if I nominated Scum and Scum votes are now voting on him to be King.

[Paws7297]

Vote: bak42 - Good player as town but not horrifically scary as scum (sorry, Astil and Derek, no way on earth I want to risk EITHER of you as king.)

`

Cough Jaded's Scum. /cough

[Antithesis]

Anti, why are you not pushing for yourself to be King? You claim to be a hider (which is not exactly a power role) and you are proven to be a great town leader.

I disagree, the Hider can be an extremely powerful role (in fact, maybe overpowered) under certain conditions.

Aside from that, I have a history of getting carried away with arguments and such, and a lot of times scum try to goad me as a diversion.

[praguepride]

Now with votes behind bak, the paranoid side of me is thinking what if I nominated Scum and Scum votes are now voting on him to be King.

Well then obviously you'd be scum too and therefore we'd have to lynch you.

Time to go through game and see who's actually won as scum :D

[Dragonmack]

Well, my ability would probably be good for being king, and even though I was scum in the only game I played, I never lied ( which is true :) ) But the fact that I am so new, especially to a larger and more complicated scenario like this probably disqualifies me for any consideration.

[BHK1978]

Well then obviously you'd be scum too and therefore we'd have to lynch you.

Time to go through game and see who's actually won as scum :D

That is it we are going to have to lynch you when you are silenced just like we did in the last game I was in with you.:D

Oh and Jaded is Scum because he only has one post thus far...wait is it to soon for that.:D

[hellboy2]

sorry i haven't joined in yet, my little one has been poorly so, he has been the focus of attention, will read through and get up to date

[Paws7297]

That is it we are going to have to lynch you when you are silenced just like we did in the last game I was in with you.:D

Oh and Jaded is Scum because he only has one post thus far...wait is it to soon for that.:D

No. Not early enough. :cool: Must catch scumded!

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 3 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack)

Bak42: 3 (BHK1978, ShadowedFlames, Jaded)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Derek_b: 3 (Derek_b, EddieFnG, Destiny)

Wallbanger: 2 (Wrestling Century, Tha Black Phenom)

[Paws7297]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 3 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack)

Bak42 3 (BHK1978, ShadowedFlames, Jaded)

Comradebot: 2 (masterded, Jman2k3)

Derek_b: 3 (Derek_b, EddieFnG, Destiny)

Wallbanger: 2 (Wrestling Century, Tha Black Phenom)

You're missing a colon somewhere. :cool: :p

[praguepride]

Vote: Wallbanger

Just because I want to see what happens if there's a three-way tie.

Better no king then scum king, that's what I say :P

[Paws7297]

Vote: Wallbanger

Just because I want to see what happens if there's a three-way tie.

Better no king then scum king, that's what I say :P
That's 4... :eek:

[Antithesis]

Vote: Wallbanger

Just because I want to see what happens if there's a three-way tie.

Better no king then scum king, that's what I say :P

Vote Comradebot

There, 5 way tie.

Seems to me the guys who are serious and want the position should share more info about themselves.

[BHK1978]

Vote Comradebot

There, 5 way tie.

Seems to me the guys who are serious and want the position should share more info about themselves.

Besides bak saying he is vanilla, did anyone of the others give up anything?

[praguepride]

Nope. I still don't trust bak42. I swear he fooled me in a game...

[Derek B]

I will be honest with you I would not trust C-Bot or Derek B. to be the King. Yes they are both really good players. However, both are very untrustworthy players as well. Out of the big names, if I had to vote on someone Wallbanger would be the person I would trust the most.

However, as of right now my vote shall stay on bak who in my opinion is a good player that never any credit for how good he is.

1. LOL at the horrible under-rating of Gallbanger.
2. I don't actually have a second point.... oh well.

I don't have a problem with Astil, personally, but maybe I missed where he gave a hint about himself... and from what i can recall, the votes for him seem like throw aways. C-bot, Derek, and Prague have at least shared a little something.

/nod

I often like the way you think. When I eventually start taking notes on this game once I get home, I'm totally gonna note how worried I should probably be about that. :p

Yes but I am not a good player. Depending on the game I can be anywhere from a decent player to a very bad player. So I am not King material.

Sounds exactly like the kind of people that people often try to hedge their bets on. Rather than risk putting a big name who could maximise the value of the King role, we often end up talking about putting in a less reputable (which isn't to imply less good) player who can then be controlled.

Sometimes the precautions we take as a group in these games is what hurts everyone most of all, as then nothing ever really gets done.

Why should you vote for me? Because I can insure all of you that I won't break any campaign promises because I'm not going to make any. Plus, I'm vanilla.

Quote for future notes...

Cough Jaded's Scum. /cough

No reason for that quote except to break things up a little more. I suggest that anyone who wants to be King votes for themselves. Then as we get closer to deadline time then we can not only see who wants the job, but we can also see where opinions fall.

[praguepride]

Seems to me the guys who are serious and want the position should share more info about themselves.


I have a semi-active night ability. I can choose to go out, or I can choose to stay inside.

I also have a victory condition beyond "kill the evil doers". It's related to the night ability but is easy enough to achieve that I can finish it N1 if I choose to.

How's that for info ;)

[praguepride]

I like derek_b's line of thought:


Change Vote: praguepride

For each vote I'll share a bit more about myself. How's that for incentive :D

[hellboy2]

VOTE BAK42

after reading up to here, and he says he's vanilla, i'm buying it

[Paws7297]

1. LOL at the horrible under-rating of Gallbanger.
2. I don't actually have a second point.... oh well.



/nod

I often like the way you think. When I eventually start taking notes on this game once I get home, I'm totally gonna note how worried I should probably be about that. :p



Sounds exactly like the kind of people that people often try to hedge their bets on. Rather than risk putting a big name who could maximise the value of the King role, we often end up talking about putting in a less reputable (which isn't to imply less good) player who can then be controlled.

Sometimes the precautions we take as a group in these games is what hurts everyone most of all, as then nothing ever really gets done.



Quote for future notes...



No reason for that quote except to break things up a little more. I suggest that anyone who wants to be King votes for themselves. Then as we get closer to deadline time then we can not only see who wants the job, but we can also see where opinions fall.
So, the only time anybody decides to reply to my posts are when they're being used to break a post up more. Nice.

Anyway, I don't trust Bak42 or Derek_b.
I do trust Astil.
I do trust PraQue. Kinda
And Nothing really on wallbanger or C-bot at this point in time.

[BHK1978]

Derek you talk a good game about why we should elect you as King. However, why should I trust you Dr. Cox or the guy who claimed indy when he was the SK.:D

[Toasty]

Vote: Bak42

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 3 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack)

Bak42: 5 (BHK1978, ShadowedFlames, Jaded, Hellboy2, Toasty)

Comradebot: 3 (masterded, Jman2k3, Antithesis)

Derek_b: 3 (Derek_b, EddieFnG, Destiny)

PraguePride: 1 (PraguePride)

Wallbanger: 2 (Wrestling Century, Tha Black Phenom)

[Derek B]

Derek you talk a good game about why we should elect you as King. However, why should I trust you Dr. Cox or the guy who claimed indy when he was the SK.:D

You don't need to trust me, you just need to appreciate that I called dibs. :p

Seriously though, I haven't actually asked anyone to trust me. I'm just trying to figure out who wants the job as King and then once we've had long enough to work that out, see who is serious enough to give out info on themselves to get it.

Personally, I'm willing to give out everything about me to get it. But if I do that now then others will be less willing to even try. When I get on tomorrow morning I'll push the pro-Derek case instead of the pro-candidate case. I find it strange that so many people are actually willing to put votes on people already, especially on people who haven't even voted for themselves. It's weird.

[Toasty]

Gahh, this is so confusing on who I should choose.
I'm going to stick with Bak for now.

[EddieFnG]

I like derek_b's line of thought:


Change Vote: praguepride

For each vote I'll share a bit more about myself. How's that for incentive :D

Change vote: prague

Start sharing.

[Paws7297]

[i] Seriously not trusting the vanilla claim guys. How often do scum with no active ability or no active night ability claim vanilla? Think about it.[/b]

[Derek B]

Gahh, this is so confusing on who I should choose.
I'm going to stick with Bak for now.

Whhhhhhhhyyyy? :p

.........

I'm heading off to the pub. Not likely I'm gonne be on again until tomorrow and I've gotten the last of my many fillings. They may all be little, but I've come to realise that I actually like having sensation in my face, which is something I've been lacking for much of this week. :(

[praguepride]

Change vote: prague

Start sharing.


My night ability and victory condition involves searching for something, like an item, person, or faction.

[praguepride]

I'm heading off to the pub. Not likely I'm gonne be on again until tomorrow and I've gotten the last of my many fillings. They may all be little, but I've come to realise that I actually like having sensation in my face, which is something I've been lacking for much of this week. :(

I just imagine derek with half his face numb trying to drink a pint!

Try to get more in your mouth then on your shirt ;)
Who am I kidding, that's a tall order for him even when he's sober :-P

[Toasty]

My colorful list on the current canidates.

bak
Praguepride
Wallbanger
Comradebot
Astil
DerekB

[praguepride]

You're trusting a vanilla townie claim just after you lost a game where scum claimed vanilla townie?

/facepalm.

[Toasty]

You're trusting a vanilla townie claim just after you lost a game where scum claimed vanilla townie?

/facepalm.

You're right, I don't have reason to believe anyone right now.
Change vote: No vote.

[TheKenwyne]

[i] Seriously not trusting the vanilla claim guys. How often do scum with no active ability or no active night ability claim vanilla? Think about it.[/b]

I said this earlier. Vanilla is such a cop out claim.

[hellboy2]

CHANGE VOTE: PRAGUEPRIDE

seems to be quite honest reading through the thread

[BHK1978]

I am not liking how fast the votes for bak came.

Therefore:

Change Vote: No Vote

[EddieFnG]

My night ability and victory condition involves searching for something, like an item, person, or faction.

Hence your fishing for claims. Unvote

Who's the one offering bacon again?

[Astil]

I am a member of a mason group.

Fred, Freedom Aligned Wannabe Warrior

One of the members of our group can protect me and keep me alive.

That's why I should be king.

[Astil]

Also: work in 15, so Ill be back in 5 hrs or so after that. Ask questions now.

[praguepride]

Dont make fun of me for spelling, back on my iphone.

Until recently my guy was a happy guy, but an unspecified tragedy cost him everything he had, resulting in his current positon, status, occupation etc.

Sorry I cant reveal something beyond fluff but really, its d1. i gotta keep the juicy stuff for when the king race really gets heated.

Truth be told ill probably run out of stuff to say by vote 5 if i dont stretch it out like this ;)

[EddieFnG]

Also: work in 15, so Ill be back in 5 hrs or so after that. Ask questions now.

That's great, considering deadline is in under 5 hours.

[Antithesis]

It is now day phase one. Since this is day one, you will be electing a leader for the town. If you have any questions about a king maker game, feel free to PM me or even post them in the thread. I'm sure some would be more than happy to assist in understanding.

That went on a lot longer than I expected. I apologize.

Let's try this again.

Sees:(

Sorry.

It is now day phase one. Today you are electing your leader by majority decision. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT (I don't know. I guess. Is it 5 hours right now?)

Sigh.

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.



Deadline is tomorrow evening.

[BHK1978]

That's great, considering deadline is in under 5 hours.

I thought we had until Thursday.

[Max Peck]

I'm not voting for anybody cuz well...I don't trust anybody at this point....breaks down like this....


1. Antithesis
2. Astil
3. bak42
4. BHK1978
5. BlueStar
6. Comradebot
7. Crychon
8. derek_b
9. Destiny
10. DragonMack
11. EddieFnG
12. gonvick
13. hellboy2
14. iMac
15. JackalBane
16. Jaded
17. Jman2k3
18. masterded
19. Max Peck
20. mjdgoldeneye
21. Olivier le Fou
22. Paws7297
23. petrija
24. praguepride
25. Rabbitman
26. Sazzita
27. ShadowedFlames
28. SmartBomb
29. Tha Black Phenom
30. The Two
31. TheKenwyne
32. Toasty
33. Wallbanger
34. Wrestling Century
35. Zeel1

Red are scum, Green are not....

[praguepride]

Im sold

vote: astil

it makes my role/ability make more sense.

[EddieFnG]

My bad, I thought it was Thursday GMT :P See ya in 5 hours bud lol

[Astil]

That's great, considering deadline is in under 5 hours.

Way to spin suspicion, guy. Unfortunately you are left with egg on your face. How sad.

[JackalBane]

Vote: praguepride

Question: How many letters are in your characters occupation?

(I love guessing games! :) )

[BHK1978]

Right now I am leaning towards Astil. However, I am not sure I trust his claim. Just because he says that is who he is does not mean it is who he is.

[praguepride]

Vote: praguepride

Question: How many letters are in your characters occupation?

(I love guessing games! :) )


15, although that includes an eight letter adjective.

ill even give you the.initials:

G. S.


Also, if people actually want to see me on the throne, ill stay in the race, but astil is a solid guy and i admit im still pretty rusty.

if you want more info feel free to just ask but I trust astil... as long as hes not fronting a cult.

and if he IS i hope he remembers my what a faithful and helpful servant I was.

[bak42]

I'd be willing to support bak42 as long as he promises to be active. He tends to be one of those "I'm active but I don't say anything and stay in the shadows until something forces my hand" kind of players.

I like me Kings right where I can see them :DWell then, since I've already said that I'm not going to make any campaign promises I guess I'll have to live without your vote.

Nope. I still don't trust bak42. I swear he fooled me in a game...

Are you referring to Dust where I managed to convince the town that I was merely looking for my lost prospecting equipment when in fact I was gearing up to rob the bank?

And if anyone wants more proof of my townieness, in order to win I have to be involved in more scum lynches than my rival, whoever that is.

[praguepride]

One question for astil:


Does your PM indcate that others could join your group?

[bak42]

One question for astil:


Does your PM indcate that others could join your group?

Afraid Astil's fronting another cult?:D

[praguepride]

Afraid Astil's fronting another cult?:D

/nod... that and another thing more personal

[Jman2k3]

Afraid Astil's fronting another cult?:D

He's good at that.

Off to school.

[BHK1978]

He's good at that.

Off to school.

That line is not as good as off to bed...

[Jman2k3]

That line is not as good as off to bed...

When I get ready for bed I'll remember to put it. :p

[Paws7297]

That line is not as good as off to bed...
Lol. Off to school?

[bak42]

He's good at that.

Off to school.

He's definitely better at it than I was in DBZ.

[praguepride]

Off to put on a wig, skintight spandex and fight crime.

[Jman2k3]

Off to put on a wig, skintight spandex and fight crime.

Hit Girl is that you?

[praguepride]

Hit Girl is that you?


if i cant be king i can at least be the most badass 12-year old girl on the planet ;)

[Wrestling Century]

Change Vote: Astil

So your the head of the mason group. Why did you claim? I thought that I told everybody not to claim on Day 1, damn it! (or maybe I just told praguepride that) :p Anyways, since you have an important role (supposedly), then perhaps if you become king you can protect yourself. Plus, we don't have any other really good canidates.

[EddieFnG]

Prague in all honesty, I don't trust you, I think you're pushing way too hard to get the kingdom, and your claim fishing earlier, really makes me think you're scum.

[praguepride]

Prague in all honesty, I don't trust you, I think you're pushing way too hard to get the kingdom, and your claim fishing earlier, really makes me think you're scum.

meh, i was hoping to finally win a popularity contest for once.

what was i thinking :)

[EddieFnG]

.. what?

[Paws7297]

He's good at that.

Off to school.

That line is not as good as off to bed...

Change Vote: Astil

So your the head of the mason group. Why did you claim? I thought that I told everybody not to claim on Day 1, damn it! (or maybe I just told praguepride that) :p Anyways, since you have an important role (supposedly), then perhaps if you become king you can protect yourself. Plus, we don't have any other really good canidates.

Nobody listens to you... :p /Joking. :)

[Paws7297]

Nobody listens to you... :p /Joking. :)

Too many quotes that don't belong!!!! I'm being driven insane!

[mjdgoldeneye]

How would disclaiming before becoming King be any more suicidal than being King?

Its not like if player X claims role Y, does a good job hammering scum, that scum will want them more deaderererer, because, dead is dead.

Arrows has already said what i had assumed... there won't be daily elections.

Ergo, this needs to be an informed decision. Or do you really think we can surmise a "legitimately worthy" candidate without information?

We can easily end up with a worthy leader without information. It's called taking a risk.

We have to hope the bulletproof/PGO townies amongst us are wise enough to campaign for themselves and that we're wise enough (and lucky enough) to vote them in.

So what line of reasoning are you suggesting? Should we just play the odds and hope we don't end up in that approximate 30% range that would have us electing scum?

By reasoning, I meant "He's a good player, so let's make him king." I know we can't figure out who is scum and who is town just yet.

We would have a 70% chance of electing town under your scenario, remember. ;) It's day 1. We're not quite at critical mass yet.

And one could just as easily make the case that you're trying to make it easier for scum to be elected king, especially if one happens to be a respected player.

I'm not in favor of a mass day 1 claim fest to try to find a suitable king. But I also don't like choosing without any info either. So I leave it to each individual player to decide if they want the position, and if it's worth giving up anything to gain trust or not. Hopefully along the way we learn enough to make a semi-informed decision.

All I can say is I'm against giving away too much. I am only going by personal preference. I wouldn't claim to be king, so I'm not going to expect it from others.

I think MJ missed the finer point, which I didn't want to just blurt out, but here goes.

If scum really thought they would have to fully claim D1 to get elected, they probably wouldn't even submit their name for consideration.

What I would like to avoid is a repeat of Forum Wars, where there was a popularity vote and DJ was elected and it turned out he was scum.

That's a clear point.

Also should add, if we set the parameters to "does not have a power role / does not go out at night to even nominate themselves"

Even if scum did try to go for it, that would lock them in to a story that most likely would not stay consistent for the entire game.

But throw all that out, you get a scenario where scum can get his buddies to vote and not have to provide details, allowing them to tell any lie they like, not only about themselves, but the King position itself.

:shrug: Its not an either/or choice. There is a happy medium, I just don't feel like arguing with MJ for 48 hours to get him to see common sense.

When I'm town, I am the harbinger of common sense. Take it or leave it, I'm not budging.

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little surprised that mjdoldenee hasn't campaigned to become King.

I never campaign for king in kingmaker games. I'm not looking to get headhunted. I like the idea of being in charge and I wouldn't deny being elected, but I'm not going to take it out of the hands of others.

I am a member of a mason group.

Fred, Freedom Aligned Wannabe Warrior

One of the members of our group can protect me and keep me alive.

That's why I should be king.

THIS is what I wanted to avoid. It seems that my trust was well placed and I didn't even need a role claim. :cool:

It doesn't seem like he'll have to worry about anything unless/until his protector dies at least.

Vote stands.

[moon_lit_tears]

It is now day phase one. Elect your leader. Have some cake. Get ready for war. You have until 9 PM EST / 2 AM GMT Thursday, November 4th / Friday, November 5th, to reach a majority decision. If you can not reach a majority decision, the person with the most votes will be made leader.

Astil: 4 (Paws7297, mjdgoldeneye, DragonMack, WrestlingCentury)

Bak42: 2 (ShadowedFlames, Jaded)

Comradebot: 3 (masterded, Jman2k3, Antithesis)

Derek_b: 2 (Derek_b, Destiny)

Destiny: 1 (BHK1978)

PraguePride: 3 (PraguePride, Hellboy2, Jackelbane)

Wallbanger: 1 (Tha Black Phenom)

[BHK1978]

You know what?

For now I am going to leave my vote for King on:

Vote: Destiny

Why?

Why not, since he found his flavor he has been a new player!

[mjdgoldeneye]

You know what?

For now I am going to leave my vote for King on:

Vote: Destiny

Why?

Why not, since he found his flavor he has been a new player!

The whole "mason outs himself to be king" thing isn't doing it for you...?

[Wrestling Century]

The whole "mason outs himself to be king" thing isn't doing it for you...?

Yeah. That's pretty suspicious BHK. Oh, what do I know? It's only day one! :p

[BHK1978]

The whole "mason outs himself to be king" thing isn't doing it for you...?

Okay I know you are going to try and logic this, but who is to say he is who he says he is?

[Paws7297]

:rolleyes: Seriously? BHK stop joking around. You and I both know electing Destiny would be disastrous.

[mjdgoldeneye]

Okay I know you are going to try and logic this, but who is to say he is who he says he is?

Um, he is. You know, the guy who had the most votes and then volunteered his role title without being explicitly asked for it and then implicated a third person protector who would be keeping him safe. On day 1. And, he's not an idiot.

Should I make a chart?

If we can't unanimously agree that this is a good idea, we're suffering from some insane mafia paranoia or psychosis.

He claimed he's in a mason group!!! On day 1! Without having to! I already said all of this, but it's really, really critical that you understand it! :p

Can he be lying? Yes, it's a physically possible for someone to type what he did and then submit it to us to read. Is he lying? I'm going to go with "Probably not or I'm just going to stop playing because that's so insanely ballsy that my comparatively feminine nature can not handle the magnitude of cojones-ism". :D

[Tha Black Phenom]

meh, i was hoping to finally win a popularity contest for once.

what was i thinking :)

If it does anything, I trust you.

There is a way Astil could be BSing this, but regardless he's our best bet and I'm not counting on another ploy much.

Change Vote: Astil

[Max Peck]

:rolleyes: Seriously? BHK stop joking around. You and I both know electing Destiny would be disastrous.

Would be worse to elect me.....

[Tha Black Phenom]

:rolleyes: Seriously? BHK stop joking around. You and I both know electing Destiny would be disastrous.

I think it could be a decent move.

Depending on what the king's perks are.

[BHK1978]

Um, he is. You know, the guy who had the most votes and then volunteered his role title without being explicitly asked for it and then implicated a third person protector who would be keeping him safe. On day 1. And, he's not an idiot.

Should I make a chart?

If we can't unanimously agree that this is a good idea, we're suffering from some insane mafia paranoia or psychosis.

He claimed he's in a mason group!!! On day 1! Without having to! I already said all of this, but it's really, really critical that you understand it! :p

Can he be lying? Yes, it's a physically possible for someone to type what he did and then submit it to us to read. Is he lying? I'm going to go with "Probably not or I'm just going to stop playing because that's so insanely ballsy that my comparatively feminine nature can not handle the magnitude of cojones-ism". :D

Yes I know he is not an idiot. However, he has played weird (for lack of a better term) in the past. Like in Undertaker's game, I still do not really understand what the heck he was trying to do in that game.

[Paws7297]

Would be worse to elect me.....
Nah
I think it could be a decent move.

Depending on what the king's perks are.

True but in some cases it wouldn't go to well. Destiny's not a very active person. If he'd be active and stuffs I'd go for it.

[BHK1978]

Nah


True but in some cases it wouldn't go to well. Destiny's not a very active person. If he'd be active and stuffs I'd go for it.

Hey he already has like five more posts than he did in Astil's game. So he is very active this time around.:D

[Paws7297]

Hey he already has like five more posts than he did in Astil's game. So he is very active this time around.:D

We'll see as the game goes on. :p

[Antithesis]

I am a member of a mason group.

Fred, Freedom Aligned Wannabe Warrior

One of the members of our group can protect me and keep me alive.

That's why I should be king.

Vote: Derek_b

I am generally fair and am willing to sacrifice my ego to follow the towns will.

So I s'pose I volunteer.

IGMEOY

We're like minded.

Vote: Astil

You've made some crazy calls and judgments that I've seen, but we're on the same page so far.



We can easily end up with a worthy leader without information. It's called taking a risk.

We have to hope the bulletproof/PGO townies amongst us are wise enough to campaign for themselves and that we're wise enough (and lucky enough) to vote them in.



By reasoning, I meant "He's a good player, so let's make him king." I know we can't figure out who is scum and who is town just yet.

We would have a 70% chance of electing town under your scenario, remember. ;) It's day 1. We're not quite at critical mass yet.



All I can say is I'm against giving away too much. I am only going by personal preference. I wouldn't claim to be king, so I'm not going to expect it from others.



That's a clear point.



When I'm town, I am the harbinger of common sense. Take it or leave it, I'm not budging.



I never campaign for king in kingmaker games. I'm not looking to get headhunted. I like the idea of being in charge and I wouldn't deny being elected, but I'm not going to take it out of the hands of others.



THIS is what I wanted to avoid. It seems that my trust was well placed and I didn't even need a role claim. :cool:

It doesn't seem like he'll have to worry about anything unless/until his protector dies at least.

Vote stands.

Couple of things. Before Astil claimed, you had already voted for him. He had posted three times. First was a joke vote, second was two lines nominating hinself, and third post was IGMEOY after I mentioned full claiming.

You then turn around after he claims and say your trust was well placed despite Astil doing what you had argued against from yesterday.

In a rational universe a harbinger of reason should at least be coherent.

Second thing.

You say, "We can easily end up with a worthy leader without information. It's called taking a risk." You have yet to say what exactly 'worthy' would be. Probably because once you have to define that, then criteria come in to play. Obviously your idea of "worthy" doesn't include good judgement, if you've been railing against full claims for a day and continue to vote for the guy who just claimed fully.

Either that or this is all just you talking out of both sides of your mouth.

Then again who knows, maybe you are a mason too. I'll call you on it though, because if you are, the right play would have been to drop the issue and try to appear distant from Astil, instead of pointing attention at your vote.

If I was scum, and Astil became king, I'd target you tonight for the kill. That is assuming you arent scum.

Who knows though, maybe I am selling you short, and you are actually the PGO... :cool:

[Paws7297]

Couple of things. Before Astil claimed, you had already voted for him. He had posted three times. First was a joke vote, second was two lines nominating hinself, and third post was IGMEOY after I mentioned full claiming.

You then turn around after he claims and say your trust was well placed despite Astil doing what you had argued against from yesterday.

In a rational universe a harbinger of reason should at least be coherent.

Second thing.

You say, "We can easily end up with a worthy leader without information. It's called taking a risk." You have yet to say what exactly 'worthy' would be. Probably because once you have to define that, then criteria come in to play. Obviously your idea of "worthy" doesn't include good judgement, if you've been railing against full claims for a day and continue to vote for the guy who just claimed fully.

Either that or this is all just you talking out of both sides of your mouth.

Then again who knows, maybe you are a mason too. I'll call you on it though, because if you are, the right play would have been to drop the issue and try to appear distant from Astil, instead of pointing attention at your vote.

If I was scum, and Astil became king, I'd target you tonight for the kill. That is assuming you arent scum.

Who knows though, maybe I am selling you short, and you are actually the PGO... :cool:
ANd why would you go and point all this out?

[Paws7297]

ANd why would you go and point all this out?

If he's the pgo you just ruined his whole plan. If he's part of the mason you just as easily could have made it obvious.
Just asking.

[Antithesis]

ANd why would you go and point all this out?

And why would you assume that anything I said was a revelation to scum? Thats one of those Kobe type assumptions.

First thing that occurred to me, and probably half the vets playing was as soon as Astil said he was a Mason, check the voting list....

You are seriously under estimating some scum players if you imagine that they didn't do just that. And then compound that with MJ's love song of a post, followed by another defense of Astil...

My only doubt is whether MJ is doing it on purpose or not

[Antithesis]

If he's the pgo you just ruined his whole plan. If he's part of the mason you just as easily could have made it obvious.
Just asking.

If he really is the PGO, he should have picked someone else to have his little fake mini feud with this game. Everyone knows you don't start an argument as some kind of angle with me.

That said, I doubt he's the PGO.

Then again, me saying he might be may keep him alive a lil longer if he isn't.

Ahh See now Grasshopper. Come and sup at my font of wisdom.

[Destiny]

Change Vote: Destiny, as I agree with BHK1978 that I would make a great king.

[Paws7297]

Change Vote: Destiny, as I agree with BHK1978 that I would make a great king.
Ahahaha Destiny is posting with humour and emotion again! Yay!

[mjdgoldeneye]

Couple of things. Before Astil claimed, you had already voted for him. He had posted three times. First was a joke vote, second was two lines nominating hinself, and third post was IGMEOY after I mentioned full claiming.

You then turn around after he claims and say your trust was well placed despite Astil doing what you had argued against from yesterday.

In a rational universe a harbinger of reason should at least be coherent.

Saying my trust was well placed was sort of supposed to be tongue and cheek. I initially voted for him somewhat arbitrarily and it was to be assumed I was aware of that. It wasn't seriously supposed to be seen as some sort of wise call of judgment. I picked him because I agreed with him. Me saying that was me jokingly saying "See! I was right!" when you and I are both supposed to be aware of the fact that neither of us had any idea what Astil's alignment was prior to him claiming. (You see, I was supporting the idea of choosing with limited information and then I show to have voted for a townie and then I erroneously used that as proof that my strategy works. Ya'll were supposed to see Capt. Logic be blatantly illogical and go "Tee Hee" to yourselves and carry on.)

That's pretty much totally unrelated to him claiming and him claiming doesn't and shouldn't logically have any connection to me voting or not voting for him. I don't exactly see your point.

Because I said claiming was a bad idea, that implies that someone who claims won't get my vote (or wouldn't logically)? That makes no sense whatsoever.

Am I supposed to say "I was going to vote for him, but now that he claimed, I'm going to change my vote! How dare he not follow an unproven player's advice and make his own judgment call! It doesn't matter that he's pretty much a guaranteed townie, people who don't share my philosophy are inherently flawed leaders! Grrrrr!"?

I didn't want people claiming, yes. Where exactly did I imply that claiming automatically made someone a less viable leader? It simply made them a less secure player and I'm not a fan of assuming kingship is a death sentence. Had we elected Astil without him claiming, we'd have the same leader and the scum wouldn't know he'd be protected. Is that not a thoroughly better scenario? We wouldn't be immediately certain he was town, but we could gauge his decisions during the day and, town or not, he wouldn't last especially long if he made decisions out of line.

None of that has any bearing on me voting for him and I'd like an explanation if you can spare one.

Second thing.

You say, "We can easily end up with a worthy leader without information. It's called taking a risk." You have yet to say what exactly 'worthy' would be. Probably because once you have to define that, then criteria come in to play. Obviously your idea of "worthy" doesn't include good judgement, if you've been railing against full claims for a day and continue to vote for the guy who just claimed fully.

I did give some clearly defined examples of what worthy would be. I did it IN THE SENTENCE AFTER THE ONE YOU QUOTED. You're not that daft, man.

I've posted perhaps twice against your philosophy and have a total of 7 posts not counting this one. Most of my posting on the subject is just me responding to responses. If that's "railing", you, Paws, and prague must be laying the fire and brimstone down pretty heavy with your threefold as many posts... :rolleyes:

And, as I say above, you don't seem to have a point. I fail to see how me voting for Astil is in any way contradictory. Why and how does any of that implication make sense? Does him claiming not make him a protected mason? What am I missing here?

Either that or this is all just you talking out of both sides of your mouth.

Then again who knows, maybe you are a mason too. I'll call you on it though, because if you are, the right play would have been to drop the issue and try to appear distant from Astil, instead of pointing attention at your vote.

I'm not a mason with Astil. I don't know why you'd say stuff like that in any case, though. It's not exactly helpful. If you turn out to be right about this stuff, you hurt townies. If you're wrong, it's a waste of words. Why bother? You always do that sort of thing.

If I was scum, and Astil became king, I'd target you tonight for the kill. That is assuming you arent scum.

Who knows though, maybe I am selling you short, and you are actually the PGO... :cool:

The first line sort of ticked me off as it's basically you giving the scum plausible deniability. That second line rectifies it a bit. :cool:

I'm not a PGO, though. I'll admit it. Or am I? I'm not. OR MAYBE...

You know how it is.

[mjdgoldeneye]

ANd why would you go and point all this out?

If he's the pgo you just ruined his whole plan. If he's part of the mason you just as easily could have made it obvious.
Just asking.

At least I know I'm not the only one thinking this stuff.

If he really is the PGO, he should have picked someone else to have his little fake mini feud with this game. Everyone knows you don't start an argument as some kind of angle with me.

That said, I doubt he's the PGO.

Then again, me saying he might be may keep him alive a lil longer if he isn't.

Ahh See now Grasshopper. Come and sup at my font of wisdom.

I have faith in your ability as a player, but you try too hard to make sure we all know exactly how far ahead of the curve you are. You're supposed to KNOW this stuff. Apart from being a mason, you can't exactly TELL us this stuff without it losing a lot of it's sheen. We know that you can see all sorts of layers. Keep them down there and stop tearing up my yard. :D

I'm not sure nearly as many people are looking to be as psychologically crafty as you think. I'm not having a "fake mini feud" with you. I just flat out disagree with you on some things. I ALWAYS disagree with you about something.

If you're as shrewd as you think, you'd know I'm going to argue with stuff I disagree with whether or not it benefits me or not. That's not a positive trait I bear, but it's pretty frontal and obvious.

I don't want to argue. If someone makes a good point, I change my mind. I've acknowledged one of your points as inarguably already.

If you want to keep trying to change my mind on stuff and want to keep rebutting me, you can't really spin it as me trying to run a tactic or distract people. What do you expect at this point from me? :D

I acknowledge you think I'm wrong or that you think I have to be scum or be playing badly or be trying to do something crafty to say what I do, but I say that that's simply what I think. React accordingly.