I Want A* Matches!

[WeeMan]

The title of the topic might seem to be a little ambiguous but it's pretty simple actually, hope to get a lot of responses, especially from the guys that play TEW 2008 longer than me, and are experts, but I'll be thankful for any advice.

I'm currently playing an arcade game with my created federation Wrestling SuperStars Federation [WSSF]. Currently I'm Global, and everything is going great, barring one thing... I have the greatest talents in the world, over 20 guys on my roster are A* popularity in the whole world... but still, many of them don't produce A* or even A matches :( I know that A and A* matches are supposed to be hard to achieve, but I've seen many diaries and stuff when guys get A* matches with guys like Goldberg or Hogan, so guys that are pretty bad/average at best in the ring, but have the popularity...

Can someone help me alter my product, so I get more A and A* matches? Currently I have Mainstream on Key, Comedy on Heavy and everything else on Low... It brings me solid ratings, but solid is not enough now - I need good or great shows... I use wrestlers with all the styles, so I thought that I have to have a little bit of every style in my product, so wrestlers like Super Juniors or Psychopaths don't get booed, but... it doesn't seem to work that well.

So, can someone please help me with my product, so I could get better match ratings? For example, The Rock vs. Steve Austin had 2 matches with each other, B and B+... and it just can't happen, both are international superstars with A* popularity everywhere, good skills especially in brawling... It's A surely, A* preferably :)

Can someone help me with that?

And while I'm on the subject [it's my topic, I'll take advantage of it! :P] I'll ask another thing - why is it that some people just bomb in angles? Certain people, even with A* popularity and entertainment skills can't take part in a good angle - guys like SCSA, Kurt Angle, Kevin Nash... They get B- in angles rated on popularity when they are A* everywhere... And it's only them - every other wrestler can get me an A or A* segment without problems...

So once again, I'm counting on Your help, would appreciate if it was fast, as I want to play my game... NOW! :P I just love the game, it's so deep and addictive... Adam Ryland is the man, forget Ric Flair! :D

[James Casey]

Your product doesn't seem especially conducive to great matches - it's more of an MTV/Crash TV style of product, where the matches are secondary to the rest of the show.

At a guess (and someone will be able to offer detailed advice) upping the Traditional value to at least Medium, if not Heavy, will allow you to get better matches. It may be worth investigating upping Cult or Modern as well, as I have a feeling they place more emphasis on matches... but again, just a guess.

You may also find it easier to limit your roster to a few complimentary types - its rare that a wide but shallow roster will excel, as workers will clash through contrasting styles.

Make sure you're not overdoing your matches - i.e., few gimmick matches, and they should be running 10-20 minutes for your most over guys. Short matches just don't have enough time to build to anything special in most cases, hence why TV matches are rarely memorable. Likewise, longer matches may take too much out of your guys, or they may not have the psychology to make the most of the time available.

[WeeMan]

Your product doesn't seem especially conducive to great matches - it's more of an MTV/Crash TV style of product, where the matches are secondary to the rest of the show.

At a guess (and someone will be able to offer detailed advice) upping the Traditional value to at least Medium, if not Heavy, will allow you to get better matches. It may be worth investigating upping Cult or Modern as well, as I have a feeling they place more emphasis on matches... but again, just a guess.

You may also find it easier to limit your roster to a few complimentary types - its rare that a wide but shallow roster will excel, as workers will clash through contrasting styles.

Make sure you're not overdoing your matches - i.e., few gimmick matches, and they should be running 10-20 minutes for your most over guys. Short matches just don't have enough time to build to anything special in most cases, hence why TV matches are rarely memorable. Likewise, longer matches may take too much out of your guys, or they may not have the psychology to make the most of the time available.

Thanks for Your response.

I guess that what You say makes sense - I'm trying too hard to mix all the styles, and match ratings might hurt a bit...

Could someone try to confirm the information that James Casey provided? Is Traditional that important?

I'd be very thankful for advice on this one, if anyone has questions about my game - ask me, I'll provide You with more detailed info so You could have a better overview of the situation... The fact is that I have a huge amount of A* popularity guys and A and A* matches appear hardly ever... any help is appreciated.

[Self]

A* Popular guys doesn't necessarily mean you should be getting A* match. Not even with great workers. A* matches are rare and unpredictable. You don't 'deserve' to be getting them. I've been playing TEW08 since it came out, and have had a grand total of 2 of them. Neither of which had any A* popularity workers in them... AND I was running a Sports Entertainment promotion. It was luck.

That being said, I think James Casey's onto something. Mainstream and Comedy do strike me as putting focus and emphasis on angles more than matches. I'd definitely try upping Traditional, and perhaps lowering Comedy. I've only seen a few real life matches that I would give 5 stars, and none of them had an abundance of Comedy spots. Undertaker/Shawn (although I'd "only" give that an A) wasn't a laugh riot.

EDIT: Re-reading your above post, it sounds like you actually are getting some A* matches, so I have no clue what you're complaining about.

[The Shape]

Out of interest self, what were those 2 A*s you got? xD

[WeeMan]

I've had 2 A* matches in the history of my game. I also see that there are guys [see TEW 08 diary zone on this forum] that can get A and A* matches with Hogan, Goldberg, Savage... And I want to be able to do it as well :) That's what I'm talking about, I don't expect every match to be A*, but I'd like to have the best possible product...

Thanks for responses, still waiting for more.

[FlameSnoopy]

A* means 99.1% - 100%. It means an INSTANT classic, something you don't see every day, every week or every month. It means something EXTREMELY rare, and that's why it's A*. And I wouldn't complain, I haven't got a single one of them :o

[WeeMan]

I understand that, but even if that's the case - I want more A matches then... I want to have the optimal product that can bring the best out of my super talented and super popular guys.

[Self]

Out of interest self, what were those 2 A*s you got? xD

Both were in CGC games... perhaps the same one. I can't remember.

The first came when I borrowed Dan Stone Jr from TCW for 3 shows. The aim was to Main Event a PPV with a dream "Stone vs DeColt" match, but first, I needed to feed Danny a win, so he could hit the ground running with great momentum right off the bat. I decided to feed him Ryan Powell, who was on the cusp of the Main Event scene, with around B+ popularity. That TV Main Event got A*. No build. No storyline. No titles. No chemistry. No DeColts. Everything just went right on that night and I lucked out.

In case you're interested, I believe the resulting Stone/DeColt dream match got a B+.

The second came after I brought in Sean McFly. I spent a few months building him up, then put him in a feud with reigning Champion (and Corporate tool) Alex DeColt. Alex cheated to retain in the first two matches, and it was Sean's last chance at CGC Last Man Standing. He won the title and got me my second A* match. This one at least had a hot storyline building to it, so I found it less surprising.

[AJ Starr]

I notice the AI has no problem getting A* matches... I ran a sim to 2015 and WWE was getting 2 or 3 a month... TNA would get a few a year... and the Japan promotions would see one or two almost every month... but as the player, getting an A* is nearly impossible.

[The Masked Orange]

I've only ever had one A* match. It was a match with no build, between Primus Allen and Tommy Cornell in TCW, on the T.V show.


A*!, and at that time Primus was a glorified jobber to me (I got bored with him after I gave him a monster push which led to the title, then just jobbed him to the upper midcard).

[Bigpapa42]

I've had 2, both featuring Christian Faith. He was A* popularity and probably around A momentum, but neither match revolved around a storyline. One was with Troy Tornado, who is a very good work but only had about B- popularity at the time, and the other was against Rocky Golden, who is mediocre in the ring but had B+/A popularity. I've had plenty of A* vs A* matches where both guys have great momnentum and it still doesn't happen. It does seem luck - everything has to fall into place. There have been plenty of matches where I thought "this could be an A* match!" and then "only" get an A or B+.

[WeeMan]

I'd kindly like to ask You guys not to hijack this thread and write about Your A* matches, but try to help me, if it's possible...

If You want to talk about A* matches You had, You could create another topic about it, or something...

I don't want to be rude, so sorry if I seem that way.

[lazorbeak]

I'd kindly like to ask You guys not to hijack this thread and write about Your A* matches, but try to help me, if it's possible...

If You want to talk about A* matches You had, You could create another topic about it, or something...

I don't want to be rude, so sorry if I seem that way.

People are hijacking your thread because if you're having ANY A* matches, you don't have a problem. Nobody gets tons of them, so you're asking for a solution to a non-problem.

As far as "why does so-and-so get A* matches all the time" goes, here's the answer: they're playing TEW 2007.

[WeeMan]

Nope, just look in some WCW diary's from TEW 08 - they're getting A's and A*'s with Hogan, Goldberg, Sting, Savage... I'd just like to have it as well, and I'm asking for the product I need to achieve that... So if anyone has any product that could work for me, please help.

[Self]

Tried James Casey's idea yet? If you're looking for product changes, I'd say Traditional is the way to go. You could also PM the writers of those mods and ask what Product settings they use.

[lazorbeak]

Nope, just look in some WCW diary's from TEW 08 - they're getting A's and A*'s with Hogan, Goldberg, Sting, Savage... I'd just like to have it as well, and I'm asking for the product I need to achieve that... So if anyone has any product that could work for me, please help.

Where? I looked in 3 WCW diaries that have been started up in the past few months and found exactly ZERO A* matches. A* matches are tough to get, period. So stop whining about it. You want a "perfect product," go look at one of those old perfect product threads.

[WeeMan]

I'm not whining, I'm just asking for help, sorry if it's too much to ask.

[SWF2K9]

in my game, NOTBPW gets an A* out of johnny bloodstone once a fortnight

[ya_its_me]

Just to answer the question you left me in my dynasty, I pretty much am running modern on high and traditional on medium, sports-entertainment's on medium though I think it still maintains a bit of of the SE feel. And mostly I think I just got lucky on that one or Sting carried Goldberg a bit.

[Bigpapa42]

I'd kindly like to ask You guys not to hijack this thread and write about Your A* matches, but try to help me, if it's possible...

If You want to talk about A* matches You had, You could create another topic about it, or something...

I don't want to be rude, so sorry if I seem that way.

Wasn't trying to hijack the thread to tell stories. Was trying to confirm what others have indicated in that its rare and its random for most promotions you run in TEW2008.

As for help, don't think we can give any. The best advice on the thread is from JC in regards to changing the product to something more conducive to getting an A* match - its PGHW and NOTBPW that have the best chances in the C-V data. Beyond that, there isn't really any secret to it. It just happens.

[pepper2008]

I agree with NOTBPW, its easier to get A*. Then again I insist on developing the popularity and Momentum of your upper midcarders to Main Event. Get better Refs ,Roadagents and Colour (preferably with chemistry with your announce team)

In my game NOTBPW which is at late 2012. I have 3 A* matches in the first year(2008) and have A* 26 on the second year (I have more matches having the maximum allowed TV shows). 40 on the 3rd year with Wrestling Industry at its peak. I still get an A* match at least once a week.

The computer at PGHW seems to get regular A* matches even 3 vs 3

[Thomnipotent]

Match Quality Factors (At Least Some Of Them):

Hot Crowd - The more B- or above segments you have before a match, the more 'stoked' the audience will be. This feeds into match quality.

Worker Skill/Overness - Depending on your product, one will be more important than the other. Both are good to have, of course. Keep an eye out for workers whose skills or overness are developing at an alarming rate as you'll more than likely want to push these guys.

Worker Momentum - Keep an eye on this as it's vastly important. There are a few ways to get momentum going; through stables, storylines, good segments and going over a worker with more momentum. Also, a strong debut segment can make all the difference- in promotions like TCW and SWF, I've managed to bring new guys in at A momentum by putting them in Worker Face Off angles (where two workers face off but get pulled apart by six other random guys); these do well because they only rate the two main workers in question, and by having your debut guy prevent a huge brawl between Christian Faith and Runaway Train, you can pump him full of momentum.

Aux. Staff (refs, announcers, colour, road agents) - Make sure these are some top-of-the-line staff. This is important as poor auxilliary staff can drag segments and matches down.

Chemistry: Also a big one. If two of your top workers have chemistry, get the other factors in line and put them against each other! Manager chemistry and tag chemistry also helps boost matches.


Hope this helps.

[Phantom Stranger]

Yeah, I've had three. High skills (I'm performance based), major momentum for everyone involved, a title on the line which seemed to amp things a bit, and plenty of time for the match to unfold.

Three. Out of a couple thousand.

[Bigpapa42]

I agree with NOTBPW, its easier to get A*. Then again I insist on developing the popularity and Momentum of your upper midcarders to Main Event. Get better Refs ,Roadagents and Colour (preferably with chemistry with your announce team)

In my game NOTBPW which is at late 2012. I have 3 A* matches in the first year(2008) and have A* 26 on the second year (I have more matches having the maximum allowed TV shows). 40 on the 3rd year with Wrestling Industry at its peak. I still get an A* match at least once a week.

The computer at PGHW seems to get regular A* matches even 3 vs 3

This is relatively realistic. I see PGHW as comparable to All Japan Pro Wrestling in the 1990s. They had a ton of amazing 2v2 and 3v3 matches that were amazing and many got 5 stars from The Wrestling Observer.

[pepper2008]

Shuffle some of your workers vs. each other (dont let matches be with ME and upper midcarders). I have Johnny Bloodstone (ME champ) got A* matches with Lassana Masakutsi (who is a midcarder).

I also have A matches with KC Glenn (Lower Mids) vs. El Heroe Mexicano (opener).

Once in my old TCW game, I have an A* match with Joey Minnesota (mids) and David Wayne Newton (lower mids),never rekindled the magic though

[WeeMan]

I'll try to up the modern and traditional, as someone said, hope it will work...

Thanks for advice guys, if anyone has anything else to said [an expert like Derek B for example :)] I'd be thankful.

[James Casey]

I'd just note that TCW in my game have run an A* show... without any A* matches on it. How, I don't know - but they did it.

But RL mods tend towards over-rated workers anyway, so if it seems like your fellow WWE/WCW/TNA/whatever workers are getting multiple A*s, chances are their mod has more over/talented workers than yours.

[Derek B]

A* for matches is set to 99.1+, a higher than normal threshold although the practical differences are nil. You still have the same number in the background. :p

A* for shows is set to 95.1+, the usual number for an A*. So it's entirely possible to get an A* show without A* matches as the numbers don't actually match up. :)

[WeeMan]

Unluckily changing my product didn't make any difference - I've changed my product so I have Mainstream and Traditional on Heavy, Comedy on Medium and the rest on Low. Still, Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker got only a B - a freakin' B! when they are both A* in popularity, and have very good stats...

:(

[James Casey]

Okay, a few more thoughts:

Location is important - holding a show in a a company stronghold will always draw higher ratings than venturing into new areas (case in point, SWF crashing to Cult after hosting consecutive PPVs in Japan and the UK)

Momentum matters - if 'Taker/Michaels at WM had been booked like ---- and they had lost every match for months going into it, no-one would have cared about it

The rest of the show matters - If your show is Opener/Opener, Lower Midcard/Lower Midcard, Midcard/Midcard, Main Eventer/Main Eventer, the fans will be too cooled down to get worked up for the big match

Can you post your most recent card? It may help us identify any glaring errors, at least.

[WeeMan]

It goes like this:

A* Angle
B Match - Kane vs. Triple H
A* Angle
B Match - Saturn vs. Vader
A* Angle
A* Angle
C+ Match - Big Smack Scott vs. Goldberg
A Angle
A* Angle
B Match - Big Show vs. Bruce The Giant
A Angle
A* Angle
B+ Match - Batista vs. The Incredible Hulk
A Angle
A Match - Andre The Giant vs. Nemesis [WTF? Other matches get B's, and match with ANDRE gets an A??]
A* Angle
B Match - Umaga vs. Shao Kahn
A* Angle
B+ Match - Samoa Joe vs. Tazz
A* Angle
B Match - Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker [now that's plain unrealistic and illogical, both guys A* popularity everywhere, good to great skills, great momentum, in a hot storyline, with no bad chemistry notes... B? seriously?]
A* Angle
A Match - Sean McFly vs. Brock Lesnar
A* Angle

Final show rating: A

It's not the shows that I have problems with, because I always somehow manage to pull an A, or B+ at lowest... the problem is with the matches, which are very disappointing, guys that popular, with great momentum, in a hot storyline, with no bad chemistry notes shouldn't get a B note for a match...

So can anybody help me make my matches better?

[pepper2008]

Try losing some of the angles, some of them will lower the next match rating:D I rarely place an angle before the Main Event (unless you need the boost from the angles coz your wrestlers suck in the ring)
blah
blah
blah
Angle
Match (you expect to get the 2nd best)
Main Event

I believe in the hierarchy of matches with low grades at the start and hi-grades at the end

[Derek B]

Factors that influence match ratings

Product
Overness
Match prestige level (Hell in a Cell, for example, has high prestige and can boost a match)
Momentum
Storyline heat
In ring skills (complimentary = better, clashing = bad)
Physical fatigue/general wear and tear
Performance skills (all of them)
Chemistry
Gimmick ratings
Announcing
Crowd level
Previous segment
Previous matches
Happiness
Relationships
Random elements

The random elements can be a major thing. The little snippets of info you get on radio appearances can tell you things that will influence matches. Could be that they both suffer from nerves when they are pushed, could be that they hate working guys bigger or smaller than they are (whenever relevant). There is also a general random element that will affect every match, sometimes adding a small percentage to simulate a better than expected match and sometimes taking a small percentage away for a match that just doesn't click with the crowd.

There are so many factors that go into matches that it is almost impossible to diagnose why one match didn't perform well, especially without being able to see the full stats of the workers in question. I don't know the physical stats of Taker or HBK, but I'd also be willing to bet that they are suffering from a lot of general wear and tear. This will knock off a significant percentage of their match grades over time too.

A* matches are rare. They're meant to be incredibly hard to get because you need guys (generally) who are talented, over and packed with momentum. You need guys in good physical shape, who are a good fit for your promotion, preferably with complimenting styles, in a big gimmick match, with high morale... and you get the picture.

Though generally, I'd aim your product more towards mainstream if you have guys with amazing psychology and overness. You might not get A* matches, but I'd expect a lot of A rated matches. I've had huge success in USPW with guys like Danny Patterson, getting him to A* overness through his menace and putting on strong B/B+ rated matches with my top psychology guys even though he's only really a C+ level brawler himself and they are a similar level, only with great psych. Heck, a C+ over Jeremy Stone managed an A rated match with Patterson and they are far from an ideal combination. With a gimmick match or Jeremy being more over, that's an easy A* for me one day.

[pepper2008]

Dont forget the Wrestling styles, some style complement each other while others dont.

Example:Technician wont work well with psychotic and spot monkey, will work well regular,technicians

[WeeMan]

Any more tips would be greatly appreciated - what I had today is 2 guys with A* overness everywhere, A* momentum, both Entertainers with very good skills... and they pull a B+. Watzup wit dat? :]

[Phantom Stranger]

Any more tips would be greatly appreciated - what I had today is 2 guys with A* overness everywhere, A* momentum, both Entertainers with very good skills... and they pull a B+. Watzup wit dat? :]

At a rough guess, the crowd weren't as keyed as you'd hope at the time. Did they have a storyline going? What was its heat?

[Bigpapa42]

Any more tips would be greatly appreciated - what I had today is 2 guys with A* overness everywhere, A* momentum, both Entertainers with very good skills... and they pull a B+. Watzup wit dat? :]

I don't think there's really any more tips to give. You cannot make A* matches happen. You can put the pieces in place - popular workers, good momentum, complimentary styles, a hot storyline, good chemistry if possible, even the best possible road agent et al - and it won't guarantee anything. Even when those pieces are in place, everything else on the show affects that match - the other matches, the angles, the crowd, the location, all of it.

[WeeMan]

I understand that and I'm happy about it - it is more fun the way it is. The problem is, often my main event is between 2 A* popularity and momentum guys in a hot storyline with good skills, styles, chemistry... and they pull off a B+ while some other match with guys with B+ popularity and momentum, a little better skills, a little lower momentum gets an A... It's weird, considering that my product makes me rater much more on popularity than performance... so if anyone has any tips, I'd really be thankful - I know there is no way to get A* all the time, I just want a product that might help me get the best ratings of matches possible...

I understand that and I'm happy about it - it is more fun the way it is. The problem is, often my main event is between 2 A* popularity and momentum guys in a hot storyline with good skills, styles, chemistry... and they pull off a B+ while some other match with guys with B+ popularity and momentum, a little better skills, a little lower momentum gets an A...

[Phantom Stranger]

It's weird, considering that my product makes me rater much more on popularity than performance...

The WWE rates much more highly on popularity than performance, but if you look at the matches that get the highest acclaim they tend to have better workers in them.

You can make Kane and Show as over as it gets, give them both as much momentum as it gets, have them collide and the result will still not be a ***** match. Neither one of those guys are bad wrestlers, they're good; they're not great.

[WeeMan]

Yeah, but is that the case in TEW? It's not the real world, it's programmed some way...

Plus, I think You didn't read my post - most of the guys DO have good to great stats but they still fail to produce A and A* matches.

[Self]

Honestly Weeman, I don't think there's anything you can do. You're doing everything to the top level. It's not like you're competing with another company. It's not like if you fail to get A*'s you're going to lose the game. You're winning. More than most of the people on these boards it sounds like. Can't you be happy with that?

It's been made pretty clear that A* pop + A* momentum + A* storyline + A* gimmick + great skills doesn't necessarily mean A* match. The game isn't wrong. You're not doing anything wrong. You are getting the best results possible.

[Phantom Stranger]

Yeah, but is that the case in TEW? It's not the real world, it's programmed some way...

From experience? Yes, it pretty much is.

Plus, I think You didn't read my post - most of the guys DO have good to great stats but they still fail to produce A and A* matches.

I did read your post. And I noticed something.

often my main event is between 2 A* popularity and momentum guys in a hot storyline with good skills, styles, chemistry... and they pull off a B+ while some other match with guys with B+ popularity and momentum, a little better skills, a little lower momentum gets an A...

Now there are two things to note here. One is what I bolded.

The other... is the A usually your semi-main? 'Cause yeah, it wouldn't drag an A* down, but putting on something better just before your main event will bug the crowd when the main doesn't live up to it.

[WeeMan]

Sometimes it is, I try to always put 3 awesome matches on every show - the opener, the semi main event, and the main event. I try to make the main event the best possible.

Self: I know, sorry if it sounds like I'm complaining - I'm really not, the game is awesome and I have lots of fun with it, there are just some things I have yet to discover or understand, just thought that I COULD do better with my match ratings.