TEW2010 Developer's Journal Discussion

[crayon]

Okay, forgive me if I'm way off, but I was just thinking about the regeneration feature and thought "wait a minute, couldn't this be used without the "hey that's so-and-so's picture" aspect of it?"

As in, you could create a whole bunch of imaginary nobodies with random pictures you pulled from anywhere, and set them as deceased when the gameworld begins.. and then if it works how i'd hope, your randomly generated workers in the future are going to have these unknown people's pictures.

A good way to ensure that (maybe) everybody is generated with a picture, but also doesn't break 'reality" by recycling pictures of people that players may recognise

[SWF Fan]

Loving the latest feature :)

[Day_Dreamer]

Okay, forgive me if I'm way off, but I was just thinking about the regeneration feature and thought "wait a minute, couldn't this be used without the "hey that's so-and-so's picture" aspect of it?"

As in, you could create a whole bunch of imaginary nobodies with random pictures you pulled from anywhere, and set them as deceased when the gameworld begins.. and then if it works how i'd hope, your randomly generated workers in the future are going to have these unknown people's pictures.

A good way to ensure that (maybe) everybody is generated with a picture, but also doesn't break 'reality" by recycling pictures of people that players may recognise

Can't you do that now by using the future debut dates??

[GDE71]

Sticky Auto-Push = Great time saver. I like this feature alot.


This

X3




Really helps for smaller feds for sure. I've never played a cult or higher fed, but I can see it really helping there to.


Will be much easier to keep someone pushed as a Road Agent when the game wants them to be a Manager and then you have no Road Agent.

This one is a great one for me.....

[Ping von Erich]

*ahem*




YAAAAAAAY!!!!!


That is all ;)

This. :D

[djthefunkchris]

I don't know about anyone else, but I have purposely ignored the autopush because of not wanting to hit all the non-wrestler's everytime I auto-push. So I would wait months, sometimes up to a whole year before doing it, just so I could keep focused on my game.

With the "Forced Push" option, I might even do the autopush after every other show... instead of purposely waiting, or just hitting one here and there.

[Hive]

I don't know about anyone else, but I have purposely ignored the autopush because of not wanting to hit all the non-wrestler's everytime I auto-push. So I would wait months, sometimes up to a whole year before doing it, just so I could keep focused on my game.

Same here. Good feature.

[TeemuFoundation]

I believe what you meant was...

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn145/high-flyer/Batista/batistaentrancesparx.jpg

YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

[praguepride]

I knew I was missing something :D

[crayon]

Can't you do that now by using the future debut dates??

Erm, sure, I guess you could. Except it would completely negate the point of using randomly generated workers -- y'know, since it wouldn't be randomly generated ;)

[LoganRodzen]

Love it! I'm definitely one of the people tired of switching people after auto-pushing the roster. My best road agent wants to be a personality? My B- referee wants to be an authority figure? INSANE! No longer have to take the time switching people back. It wasn't a HUGE deal for me, considering I'm almost always a local / small / regional promotion, so it's not as if there's 15 non-workers that need switching. Still, this saves time and I love time-savers. :)

[praguepride]

I'm excited because I was pushing for auto-push exemptions in '07 and then in '08 I became frustrated in that I could make them exempt once but had to keep doing it over and over again, and I use the auto-pusher like mad because I'm always losing workers/hiring new ones/pushing them to the moon :D

I'm happy because once again Adam shows that he listens to his fan base.

[djthefunkchris]

I'm excited because I was pushing for auto-push exemptions in '07 and then in '08 I became frustrated in that I could make them exempt once but had to keep doing it over and over again, and I use the auto-pusher like mad because I'm always losing workers/hiring new ones/pushing them to the moon :D

I'm happy because once again Adam shows that he listens to his fan base.

Definately going to be a great feature for running smaller promotions. One of the main reasons I get upset when playing them has nothing to do with their leaving, and having to replace them, as much as just having to redo the whole roster everytime I have a good change-over. I will definately be doing my local to global (or try) promotion with this additional feature making it go more smoothly.

[cappyboy]

I believe what you meant was...

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn145/high-flyer/Batista/batistaentrancesparx.jpg

YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Man, I hate when he does that. I get why he does but it makes him look so silly in my mind.

[crayon]

Batista should get some Ex-lax. It'll fix that right up.

[D-Lyrium]

Okay, forgive me if I'm way off, but I was just thinking about the regeneration feature and thought "wait a minute, couldn't this be used without the "hey that's so-and-so's picture" aspect of it?"

As in, you could create a whole bunch of imaginary nobodies with random pictures you pulled from anywhere, and set them as deceased when the gameworld begins.. and then if it works how i'd hope, your randomly generated workers in the future are going to have these unknown people's pictures.

A good way to ensure that (maybe) everybody is generated with a picture, but also doesn't break 'reality" by recycling pictures of people that players may recognise

You're way off, and forgiven. ;)

Adam said it works the same as in WMMA: So I'd assume that when a worker dies or retires (from the business, not just the ring), a new worker is generated along the same lines as the departing worker (i.e, if the former worker was a heavyweight American brawler, the new guy will be too), his picture is used, and stats are generated based on the old guy's strengths and weaknesses.

It's not a case of "We'll store this retired guy's picture and apply it to a randomly generated guy later on", like you're suggesting. Although that would be interesting too if checks were made to ensure pictures were only dolled out to workers of the same size and ethnicity.

It's more a case of "We'll create a new worker based on the old one and have them debut in a few weeks/months". Completely separate, I'd imagine, to the more traditional randomly generated workers. So in your scenario, with a load of pre-added dead guys, they'd already be dead so the regeneration wouldn't occur. You could set them all to be so crippled and useless that they have no choice but to retire within weeks, that'd work. But then their regenerations would turn up at roughly the same time, I'd imagine... so it wouldn't be quite as useful.

[Candyman]

#24: Sneaking Written Deals

!!!

This was one of the top two or three features I wanted most, and based on how often it comes up on the suggestion board, I'm not alone. If this is #24, I'm excited to see what Adam has in store for us to peak interest right before the release.

[The Bus]

Sneaking written deals is simply great. That's the way it's in real life so why not have it in TEW. And again Adam is listening to the suggestions.

The dirty tricks coming into play is great! Now the wars will be more real, not just a ratings battle.

[dvdWarrior]

Sneaky written deals. Nice feature. I appreciate it.

[crayon]

One of the two big contract changes/additions i was hoping for, so whoo-hoo :) I also second that its great how it comes into play with dirty tricks.

so if the worker in question has no relationships within your promotion, what do you guys think will happen? default yes, default no, or random?

[King Chono]

This is a good feature for Japan. Realistically NOAH and AJPW would only be considered Cult in terms of current popularity and what not, but pretty much all of their guys are under written deals. Most of the guys have friends on the roster, or in the case of Giant Baba or Mitsuharu Misawa, the entire roster would have been loyal or friendship with them.

[FINisher]

Loving the sneaky written addition as it makes money actually matter and the user stats come into play aswell. :) One of the better journal entries thus far.

[Gigas]

awesome. I suggested earlier in this thread that it'd be cool if the user skills could play a roll in signing guys at cult level and it kinda does.

I love this addition.

[Donners]

Glad to see there is a bit more flexibility in the contract system, but I was really hoping for something that would implement TNA's contract system, where workers are tied to the company, but can work for promotions approved by TNA (ie not WWE or, for a time, RoH).

[Waghlon]

Im officially happy :)

[crayon]

Glad to see there is a bit more flexibility in the contract system, but I was really hoping for something that would implement TNA's contract system, where workers are tied to the company, but can work for promotions approved by TNA (ie not WWE or, for a time, RoH).

Should still be at least either one or two or fifty or a thousand more journal entries before it's released, so keep those fingers crossed and it may still happen :)

[praguepride]

One of the two big contract changes/additions i was hoping for, so whoo-hoo :) I also second that its great how it comes into play with dirty tricks.

so if the worker in question has no relationships within your promotion, what do you guys think will happen? default yes, default no, or random?

Well, they have to pass the three checks, so in that case my guess is it'd be a RNG for the hidden destiny stuff.

Cool feature, definitely. Now you can actually play DaVE (if you're good enough) and get the signings that they had.

[FlameSnoopy]

Loving the sneaky written addition as it makes money actually matter and the user stats come into play aswell. :) One of the better journal entries thus far.

Exactly.

[Remianen]

Loving the sneaky written addition as it makes money actually matter and the user stats come into play aswell. :) One of the better journal entries thus far.

There were people who felt the user characteristics were 'fluff' when that feature was announced. Then again, there were people who believed the earth was flat so I guess it stands to reason.

By the time the game's set for release, some folks are going to see how key and vital to gameplay those user characteristics are. They all have a place in '10, even if that place isn't immediately 'omg obvious'.

[Moe Hunter]

"Sneaky Written Contracts" is a BRILLIANT addition. So well planned out and implemented. I can't wait to see it in action.

Earlier today I was thinking "should me and Whitey re-set our gameworld for 2010, going back to start out as Cult, or do we continue from our Global positions?" as our 2007 game (we're slack, we know) is in December 09 and it might make sense to translate it over.

Seeing this fantastic new addition of strategy for Cult promotions being potentially able to steal away workers to exclusivity at that level... Wow. I wonder if maybe if you pass the three checks by enough of a margin, will we be able to sign away some stars that might normally be "too big" for a Cult promotion?

[justtxyank]

It's great that we can sign written contracts as cult promotions now. But what I'm wondering is whether there will be any sort of tests the promotion will have to pass in order to pull it off? It will be silly if just any cult promotion with no money, a terrible lockerroom and no momentum could sign a guy.

Just in case the sarcasm wasn't dripping enough, I wasn't being serious Adam.

[praguepride]

Cue derek_b's catch phrase:

"Doesn't anyone ready the Dev blog?"


That's our Derek! ;)

[Phantom Stranger]

Cue derek_b's catch phrase:

"Doesn't anyone ready the Dev blog?"


That's our Derek! ;)

Read his white text, and recall that he's the one talking about reading it all yesterday.

[praguepride]

*facepalm*

that's why I made it all sitcom-y. I was adding more sarcasm to the sarcasm pile. I'll admit he almost got me. I had a flame post written and ready to go before I realized there was more to the post.

Way to no-sell my joke, Phantom ;)

[Phantom Stranger]

*facepalm*

that's why I made it all sitcom-y. I was adding more sarcasm to the sarcasm pile. I'll admit he almost got me. I had a flame post written and ready to go before I realized there was more to the post.

Way to no-sell my joke, Phantom ;)

I may've missed your own white text. :) More seriously, I missed that you'd spotted it.

Ah, well, shows the risks of this one, eh?

[justtxyank]

I may've missed your own white text. :) More seriously, I missed that you'd spotted it.

Ah, well, shows the risks of this one, eh?

Even if you miss the white text, I think the fact that I specifically mention all three of the criteria from Adam's blog should be a clue. :)

[Ping von Erich]

The way we feel reading each one of Adam's updates must be the way all of Beethoven's fans felt on his internet message board when he was writing his fifth symphony.












What?

[SWIFT]

With these great and game changing features coming out does anyone else get that feeling that's like a...feature draft? With roughly a hundred major features and a number of minor ones that it's like "Maybe what I suggested might get drafted to TEW2010."

Oh and "Sneaking Written Deals" and "Predator Signing" are my favorites so far. SWD will really help with Japanese promotions especially. You can really see the game world coming to life with each new feature. Not that the game world was dead in TEW 2008, just not as active and lively as it's going to be.

C-Verse is gonna be saucy with these features, I tell you what.

[SasoreGatame]

re: Today's feature w/cult feds offering written deals.

The $7,000,000 thing is a bit ridiculous and will totally rape people trying to prevent feds like ROH from being raided. I mean, it's a safe bet that none of the indy promotions today have that kind of financial stability, with PWG possibly being the lone exception. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but the feature sounded great until that.

[Gigas]

re: Today's feature w/cult feds offering written deals.

The $7,000,000 thing is a bit ridiculous and will totally rape people trying to prevent feds like ROH from being raided. I mean, it's a safe bet that none of the indy promotions today have that kind of financial stability, with PWG possibly being the lone exception. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but the feature sounded great until that.


and ROH is a cult sized fed? Indy feds are cult sized?

[Bigpapa42]

re: Today's feature w/cult feds offering written deals.

The $7,000,000 thing is a bit ridiculous and will totally rape people trying to prevent feds like ROH from being raided. I mean, it's a safe bet that none of the indy promotions today have that kind of financial stability, with PWG possibly being the lone exception. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but the feature sounded great until that.

Actually, that's one of the aspects I like most. I know a lot of people wanted ways for cult promotions to be able to land workers on signed deals, but there has to be some limitations to that, to prevent it from being an easy cheat. And these three criteria seem like a great way to do that. The money aspect means that not every cult promotion will be able to land those written deals, even if the other criteria are in place. And I think it is realistic - why would a worker tie themselves down to a promotion that doesn't have the financial stability to be able to honor that deal?

Does it mean this feature benefits the "larger" cult promotions than the "smaller" ones? I think so. Its doubtful that most promotions who are just barely cult would have the finances to make it work, where as ones who have been at cult for a long time or just dropped down from national are more likely to.

Is this realistic? I think so. Has ROH been able to effectively prevent having its workers stolen so far? Not really. Consider what it would have taken for ROH to tie Bryan Danielson to an exclusive, guaranteed contact, considering how much money he could make by being able to work for multiple promotion.

If promotion relationships are not massively changed, it might still be possible to get agreements with the bigger promotions to keep them from raiding your roster.

[Jennie Bomb]

This is a pretty sweet new feature. I think $7m might be a bit high (I think $3-5m would have been a bit better), but I'll save judgment until I've played it.

[Derek B]

Actually, that's one of the aspects I like most. I know a lot of people wanted ways for cult promotions to be able to land workers on signed deals, but there has to be some limitations to that, to prevent it from being an easy cheat. And these three criteria seem like a great way to do that. The money aspect means that not every cult promotion will be able to land those written deals, even if the other criteria are in place. And I think it is realistic - why would a worker tie themselves down to a promotion that doesn't have the financial stability to be able to honor that deal?

Does it mean this feature benefits the "larger" cult promotions than the "smaller" ones? I think so. Its doubtful that most promotions who are just barely cult would have the finances to make it work, where as ones who have been at cult for a long time or just dropped down from national are more likely to.

Is this realistic? I think so. Has ROH been able to effectively prevent having its workers stolen so far? Not really. Consider what it would have taken for ROH to tie Bryan Danielson to an exclusive, guaranteed contact, considering how much money he could make by being able to work for multiple promotion.

If promotion relationships are not massively changed, it might still be possible to get agreements with the bigger promotions to keep them from raiding your roster.

This post pretty much nails everything on the head so if anyone has any questions then look no further than this. :)

[Remianen]

re: Today's feature w/cult feds offering written deals.

The $7,000,000 thing is a bit ridiculous and will totally rape people trying to prevent feds like ROH from being raided. I mean, it's a safe bet that none of the indy promotions today have that kind of financial stability, with PWG possibly being the lone exception. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but the feature sounded great until that.

Name three ROH workers who are signed to written deals right now. G'head, I'll wait. *cue Jeopardy theme*

The feature isn't intended to make it commonplace or easy for cult level promotions to lock up workers. If that were the case, what would be the major benefit for hitting National again? If you want to 'prevent feds like ROH from being raided', set their workers' contracts at the DB level before the start of the game. Besides the fact that doing so wouldn't be the least bit realistic, it's not surprising at all. Many folks seem to only like 'realism' when it suits their desires. But don't expect this feature to do it for you. Promotions who are financial stable and viable, hot, and who have positive backstage scenes, will find workers more willing to restrict themselves to only working for them.

This is a pretty sweet new feature. I think $7m might be a bit high (I think $3-5m would have been a bit better), but I'll save judgment until I've played it.

Safe course of action. $7m isn't as much as folks seem to think it is. If you've been running your promotion responsibly at Regional, you'll get to Cult with a war chest that might be around half that amount (or more). So the cult level shock wouldn't faze you at all. From there, it would only require a handful of changes to streamline for the increased costs of Cult. By the time you see National on the horizon, you'll be able to get your core workers locked up exclusively. A lot of things have to fall in your favor but that's to be expected.

National is supposed to be a big deal. This feature preserves that while also giving the exceptional a reward for being just that. No worker is going to cast their lot with you when you're living hand to mouth, three missed gates from homelessn....errr, bankruptcy. It's basically something to shoot for, not a substitute for National level.

[Wallbanger]

I like this as a way to better prepare one for the cult-to-national transition. First thing I thought when I saw this is, "now NOTBPW has a way to hang on to Jeremy and Dan Jr. and even possibly get Duane back". I always felt it became much too common in 08 for them to leave at the end of their contracts, an overcorrection of NOTBPW being 'easy mode' in 07.

[Remianen]

I like this as a way to better prepare one for the cult-to-national transition. First thing I thought when I saw this is, "now NOTBPW has a way to hang on to Jeremy and Dan Jr. and even possibly get Duane back". I always felt it became much too common in 08 for them to leave at the end of their contracts, an overcorrection of NOTBPW being 'easy mode' in 07.

Wallbanger is wise.

Now I won't have to set Jeremy, Junior, and Sean's contracts to maximum (6 year?) lengths before starting a game. It always bothered me when Sean would bail since it's really hard for me to imagine that occurring "in reality". Wife is the booker, Lucy's in kindergarten or first grade, I just can't see Sean being away from the fam for long periods of time (like Japanese tours and TCW or SWF's schedule).

[Historian]

Name three ROH workers who are signed to written deals right now. G'head, I'll wait. *cue Jeopardy theme*

While off the top of my head, I can only think of one that I know for sure has a written deal: Austin Aries, I know for a fact that ROH has written contracts, just not the same style of written deal as WWE. ROH's written contracts are not exclusive deals, they are deals that guarantee them the first crack at the individuals who have them. Meaning, if PWG wanted to book Austin Aries, he would have to make his ROH dates first. Also, it affects their ability to get signed by both WWE and TNA. I don't remember how it works for sure, but there are provisions to keep their written talent from signing with WWE, that's why both Nigel and Danielson did not re-sign their ROH written contracts and were just working your standard pay per appearance deals.

The 7 million in the bank is a good thing, in my opinion. It means you actually have to manage your money effectively to sign written deals, because it SHOULD be really hard for a Cult level promotion to sign talent to written deals, because if they sign a written deal with you they are putting off going to a bigger fed, as well as limiting themselves to just your company, no Japan dates, no Mexico dates, just you. Which limits their ability for global exposure at the time, as well as their ability to make money.

Also, this seems to be a provision that will help SWF and TCW keep talent when/if they drop to Cult. In most of the games I've played, one of them ends up dropping, and then as contracts start expiring their talent can be poached. This provision at least gives them the opportunity to resign some of their big talent to exclusive written deals.

Those are my two cents.

[lazorbeak]

Also, this seems to be a provision that will help SWF and TCW keep talent when/if they drop to Cult. In most of the games I've played, one of them ends up dropping, and then as contracts start expiring their talent can be poached. This provision at least gives them the opportunity to resign some of their big talent to exclusive written deals.

I doubt it, since unless momentum works significantly differently than the old system, a drop to cult causes a pretty serious hit, and it only gets worse for a promotion like SWF that sees their TV deals start to evaporate. "What's that? We're not a national promotion any more? We're not on TV? Where do I sign?!"

[The Masked Orange]

Like the new feature. It will penalise NYCW for being stuck in a 30-year rut.


ECHO... Echo... echo...

[Historian]

I doubt it, since unless momentum works significantly differently than the old system, a drop to cult causes a pretty serious hit, and it only gets worse for a promotion like SWF that sees their TV deals start to evaporate. "What's that? We're not a national promotion any more? We're not on TV? Where do I sign?!"

I did not say it would be easy, just that I think this provision is there. As, normally when you drop to Cult, you don't lose your written guys immediately, they have a while to go before their contract runs out. In that time, you can get back your momentum and be going strong, or at least better than you were when you dropped, and make a play at some of your guys.

Do I think the majority of the roster will stay? No.

I just think part of this feature is to address the drop to Cult, and them losing most of their roster before they can climb back up to National. Most of the roster won't take a written deal, but they might be able to get one or two or three. For instance...

If TCW dropped to Cult from National, and four months later they are doing well, they have a lot of momentum, and perhaps are even on the cusp of re-entering the National scene, Wolf Hawkins' contract comes up. Now, in previous games because they are at Cult, they could only get him to a PPA deal... But now, with this provision, they might be able to resign him to his written deal.

[Blackman]

Force push on Jed High ftw!

[Remianen]

While off the top of my head, I can only think of one that I know for sure has a written deal: Austin Aries, I know for a fact that ROH has written contracts, just not the same style of written deal as WWE. ROH's written contracts are not exclusive deals, they are deals that guarantee them the first crack at the individuals who have them. Meaning, if PWG wanted to book Austin Aries, he would have to make his ROH dates first. Also, it affects their ability to get signed by both WWE and TNA. I don't remember how it works for sure, but there are provisions to keep their written talent from signing with WWE, that's why both Nigel and Danielson did not re-sign their ROH written contracts and were just working your standard pay per appearance deals.

That's a 'right of first refusal' type of deal. That's not what 'written deals' are currently considered when a reference is made to them. Written deal = exclusive. I didn't think I had to spell that out but there it is. ROH and TNA's contract setups that allow workers to take other bookings, unless they're structured as subcontracts (i.e. PWG would go to TNA and ask them if they can use AJ Styles and if permitted, PWG would pay TNA and TNA would then pay AJ), are not exclusive. Probably just semantics but it is an important distinction to make. Adding a non-exclusive exclusive contract type to TEW probably isn't in the cards.

[alden]

I have heard alot of people confuse "writen" contracts and what remi is refering to. The only american company that gives most of it workers writen is wwe. You have your angle's in tna but not even guys like nash......foley.....and the main eventers have writen contracts as nash does do indepent dates alot. I don't even see hogan doing a writen as i don't see him giving up the hulkamania thing.

[CrookedRainJr]

As cool as cult promotions being able to potentially get written contracts is, does anybody else think the seven million requirement seems a little.... high? If they have that much money, seems like they are probably national at least.

[Phantom Stranger]

As cool as cult promotions being able to potentially get written contracts is, does anybody else think the seven million requirement seems a little.... high? If they have that much money, seems like they are probably national at least.

Or recently fallen. Or fallen-and-can't-peak again (six-years-into-game SWF being a common example).

Whatever the case, they're at the top of the Cult ladder for certain.

[crayon]

As cool as cult promotions being able to potentially get written contracts is, does anybody else think the seven million requirement seems a little.... high? If they have that much money, seems like they are probably national at least.

I haven't really had enough experience with cult to have a personal opinion, but from what others are saying, 7 million seems to be a figure that shows your cult promotion is either top tier compared to other cults or has some really good business sense behind it. Both of which, if correct, make a good argument for the kind of promotion a worker might be interested signing a written with.

I agree it does sound like a lot, but then I also handle my in-game finances completely recklessly, so I can't really speak :P

[jjohnson105]

Is there any way TCW and SWF could have a working female division?

[Phantom Stranger]

Is there any way TCW and SWF could have a working female division?

It's achievable with work - I occasionally ponder a TCW women's division for the diary, but haven't gone for it yet.

I'm not sure we'll see either have it by 2010, and to be honest it's a question for a different thread...

[Vladamire Dracos]

That's a 'right of first refusal' type of deal. That's not what 'written deals' are currently considered when a reference is made to them. Written deal = exclusive. I didn't think I had to spell that out but there it is. ROH and TNA's contract setups that allow workers to take other bookings, unless they're structured as subcontracts (i.e. PWG would go to TNA and ask them if they can use AJ Styles and if permitted, PWG would pay TNA and TNA would then pay AJ), are not exclusive. Probably just semantics but it is an important distinction to make. Adding a non-exclusive exclusive contract type to TEW probably isn't in the cards.

From my understanding from what I've read and the promoters I've talked to, that's exactly how almost all of TNA's contacts work, with the few notable exceptions (Angle, Sting, etc.).

[thatoneguy]

I have heard alot of people confuse "writen" contracts and what remi is refering to. The only american company that gives most of it workers writen is wwe. You have your angle's in tna but not even guys like nash......foley.....and the main eventers have writen contracts as nash does do indepent dates alot. I don't even see hogan doing a writen as i don't see him giving up the hulkamania thing.

WWE wrestlers can work with almost any promotion if they want. They aren't employees, they're...I think the wording was independent contractors. Regardless, while they get paid every month, they can work any shows they want if they so choose.

[MrOnu]

Or recently fallen. Or fallen-and-can't-peak again (six-years-into-game SWF being a common example).

Whatever the case, they're at the top of the Cult ladder for certain.

Promotion momentum could be an issue to hand out written contracts though. At least for the first couple of months of the drop down.

[alden]

WWE wrestlers can work with almost any promotion if they want. They aren't employees, they're...I think the wording was independent contractors. Regardless, while they get paid every month, they can work any shows they want if they so choose.

I can not think of a single wwe full time wrestler *that is the important one remember, wrestler* who can pick and choose what company they wrestle for. Can triple h decide to one day work a roh show because he wants to? Can chris jericho up and contact chikira *cheap plug* and work a few shows? Nope, they all have writen contract that make them exclusive to wwe....fcw......or any other development company wwe might own. Certine times people like carlito are allowed to work for other companys *his fathers in this case* and guys like lawler who are not active wrestlers in the wwe take indy bookings.....but for the most part they can't. But back to the subject...........

I think 7 mil is a little low in my opinion. Look at the starting capital for uspw in 08.....they are what 5 mil.......you can pull in around 200k a month...so that is 10 month and you get the 7 mil mark......easly done......I think the other two are going to be the fun part......having a locker room they want to be in will be intresting.

[The-619]

This is an awesome feature, just what I wanted.

[TeemuFoundation]

I must say I find it a little weird that the booker gets to tell the workers to end the match with a sick bump, as something like that is usually discussed and agreed by the workers in the match, not the booker. But that's not to say this bothers me at all, since it's entirely optional.

[crayon]

Sick Bumps, hell yeah!

i would have liked to have an editable list of Sick Bumps to choose from, but I can see how that might get a bit cumbersome, so for now I guess I'll be happy with what we've all got back :)

[FINisher]

#25: Sick Bumps

YES! My WEXXV will never be the same again. Hello injury list! :cool:

[djthefunkchris]

Sick Bumps, hell yeah!

i would have liked to have an editable list of Sick Bumps to choose from, but I can see how that might get a bit cumbersome, so for now I guess I'll be happy with what we've all got back :)

Just make it up, lol, like the rest of the match. Remember, the other feature is going to tell us how it went, so that's something to work with anyways:)

I was really hoping for some game specific's on things like Regions and such. Perhaps they are staying the same? Either way, it would be nice to know.

[crayon]

I must say I find it a little weird that the booker gets to tell the workers to end the match with a sick bump, as something like that is usually discussed and agreed by the workers in the match, not the booker. But that's not to say this bothers me at all, since it's entirely optional.

Hmm, really? I don't moonlight as a booker in real life or anything, but a sick bump seems to me like something you wouldn't want workers just pulling out of their asses without consulting you.

[TeemuFoundation]

Hmm, really? I don't moonlight as a booker in real life or anything, but a sick bump seems to me like something you wouldn't want workers just pulling out of their asses without consulting you.
Mick Foley did in the Hell in a Cell match and it pissed Vince off. Vince would have never agreed to it, since the bumps were beyond stupid.

Courageous but stupid.

[Mr T Jobs To Me]

Sick Bumps! I can't wait for someone to cop a 'tude!

[djthefunkchris]

Mick Foley did in the Hell in a Cell match and it pissed Vince off. Vince would have never agreed to it, since the bumps were beyond stupid.

Courageous but stupid.

However, we have other options for the road agent, that's not really a concern of the booker either...

I'm going to say, I like it.... No matter if we decide or the worker's decide to upon themselves, lol.

[crayon]

Mick Foley did in the Hell in a Cell match and it pissed Vince off. Vince would have never agreed to it, since the bumps were beyond stupid.

Courageous but stupid.

But is that common practice? And even if it is, does that mean that bookers never ask workers to take a sick bump for a match? Or that sick bumps are never thought out beforehand?

There has to be some kind of precedence for it surely

[TeemuFoundation]

But is that common practice? And even if it is, does that mean that bookers never ask workers to take a sick bump for a match? Or that sick bumps are never thought out beforehand?

There has to be some kind of precedence for it surely
It wouldn't make any sense for the booker to downright order one of their workers to take a potentially life-threatning sick bump that could even end their in-ring career or at least significantly shorten it. But then again, it's TEW and it's all about You being the man in charge so I don't have a problem with this addition. I just don't see myself using it.

[Derek B]

It wouldn't make any sense for the booker to downright order one of their workers to take a potentially life-threatning sick bump that could even end their in-ring career or at least significantly shorten it. But then again, it's TEW and it's all about You being the man in charge so I don't have a problem with this addition. I just don't see myself using it.

Don't forget to read the entire post, it isn't all poems about space cats you know! :)

Workers can refuse to take sick bumps, based on personality and situation.

[crayon]

Using sick bumps will also be another tool in a bookers chest to help avoid catching a repeated match penalty, if they've got it turned on.

"Crap we're on our fifth match. How can I top the last one? Throw one of them off a balcony covered in chocolate sauce onto Rosie O'Donnell !"

[TeemuFoundation]

Don't forget to read the entire post, it isn't all poems about space cats you know! :)
I understood that and I don't have a problem with the feature itself. I was just answering crayon's question. My point was the idea of a booker downright telling a worker to take sick bump in the match is just disturbing to me. Granted, they can refuse, but a competent booker wouldn't even suggest that. The safety of the workers must come first, because they are the ones who draw the crowds and if they cripple themselves taking a sick bump, they won't be able to work to draw in the money.

So, I would never suggest a sick bump. But, like I said, it's all about You being in control. :)

[crayon]

I understood that and I don't have a problem with the feature itself. I was just answering crayon's question. My point was the idea of a booker downright telling a worker to take sick bump in the match is just disturbing to me. Granted, they can refuse, but a competent booker wouldn't even suggest that. The safety of the workers must come first, because they are the ones who draw the crowds and if they cripple themselves taking a sick bump, they won't be able to work to draw in the money.

So, I would never suggest a sick bump. But, like I said, it's all about You being in control. :)

Hey, it's a sleazy business. And my sleazy alter-ego would totally ask a worker to take a sick bump, but only if they were on a PPA, of course :P

[TeemuFoundation]

Hey, it's a sleazy business. And my sleazy alter-ego would totally ask a worker to take a sick bump, but only if they were on a PPA, of course :P
It IS a sleazy business, gotcha. :P

[Rathen4]

Awesome feature, will be using it as much as possible just for laughs!

[Day_Dreamer]

Boy, between the kenny deaths and now the sick bumps, the life expectancy seems to be on its way down.

[UkWrestleFan]

Yes!!! I'm sure I suggested something similar to the sick bumps. Great feature, love it. Can't wait for this game.

[praguepride]

@Teemu: You're right for a promotion like the WWE that has to maintain a certain level of respectability and liability for its workers.

But if you were running a garbage indy fed, I'm sure the book would be like: "You, jump off a roof onto your opponent who's on the table covered in light tubes. You, ride this motorcycle through a ring of fire and into the side of that house...."


I have a feeling that this is going to be product setting based, where unrisky products/tv networks/PPV will through a fit if you have people diving off of balconies or scaffolding.

And while the Foley match was improved, since then the WWE has had some sick bumps (namely with Jeff Hardy) and I would be surprised to hear that all of those were his idea (although it wouldn't surprise me, him being a spot monkey and all :D) and that somewhere along the way a booker wasn't like "Hey, want to Swanton Bomb off the top of a ladder?"

[gazwefc83]

Glad sick bumps are back, foley and funk here we go

[Thriller]

But if you were running a garbage indy fed, I'm sure the book would be like: "You, jump off a roof onto your opponent who's on the table covered in light tubes. You, ride this motorcycle through a ring of fire and into the side of that house...."

People working for a garbage company are probably insane enough that they don't even need to be told. :p But yeah, booker's will often ask their wrestlers to take things a step further because it's a big show or whatever.

[wrestlingfan#1]

#25 Sick Bumps


:D one of my first suggestions for the game :D Now I really can't wait for 2010!!! Thank you Adam and the TEW crew.

[MitchHedberg]

I really overused sick bumps in EWR. I have a good feeling that that's going to be the case this time around, too. I love it. :D

[BurningHamster]

Yes! Sick bumps!

Very happy to see this feature making a comeback.

[Vladamire Dracos]

Don't think of it as asking them to do a "sick bump" or something specific like a shooting star press to the outside, but asking the worker to end the match with a big finish of some sort and letting the workers and/or road agent work out the specifics.

Edit: Erm, yeah, like Thriller said. :p

[praguepride]

a worker can be asked to perform a highly risky and spectacular dive during a match

Just thought I'd point out that Sick Bumps aren't necessarily related to the ending, just saying that sometime between start and end, do something crazy ;D

[Self]

Don't think of it as asking them to do a "sick bump" or something specific like a shooting star press to the outside, but asking the worker to end the match with a big finish of some sort and letting the workers and/or road agent work out the specifics.

A shooting star to an opponent outside isn't something I'd consider a sick bump. Being told to MISS a shooting star to the outside... That is a sick bump!

I'd occasionally use this feature.

[BurningHamster]

Just thought I'd point out that Sick Bumps aren't necessarily related to the ending, just saying that sometime between start and end, do something crazy ;D

It's sensible for them to happen towards the end though, you know, because of that whole high risk of injury thing?

I once saw a match from Japan, was either FMW or W*ING and Kintaro Kanemura did a cage dive early in the match, blew out his knee and continued the match HOPPING because he couldn't walk.

[Vladamire Dracos]

A shooting star to an opponent outside isn't something I'd consider a sick bump. Being told to MISS a shooting star to the outside... That is a sick bump!

I'd occasionally use this feature.

Depends on the promotion and their product, in a lucha or modern product, nah, but in a more "PG" type? ;)

[D.Moort]

jesus. i had to do a rollback for my computer. completely forgot about the troubles i might have to go through with this. i dont even have TEW installed anymore, nevermind the license. am i pretty much screwed?

[justtxyank]

It's sensible for them to happen towards the end though, you know, because of that whole high risk of injury thing?

I once saw a match from Japan, was either FMW or W*ING and Kintaro Kanemura did a cage dive early in the match, blew out his knee and continued the match HOPPING because he couldn't walk.

I always thought a booking mistake that was made by companies (namely WCW) is they never sold the "high risk" aspect of high risk moves. To really sell how crazy the luchadores were, they should have had guys miss high risk moves and sell an injury throughout a match. Not just, "Oh he missed the frog splash, he has a stomach now for 10 seconds!"

[justtxyank]

Love every feature thus far.

I'm an insurance salesman, and TEW 2010 is my idea. :)

[Self]

Depends on the promotion and their product, in a lucha or modern product, nah, but in a more "PG" type? ;)

Not really. A shooting star to the outside isn't a 'bump' if someone catches you. It's not really all that dangerous if you have the athleticism to rotate all the way and the guy you're landing on knows how to catch you. I'd use 'All Out Match' to symbolise that kind of move

A sick bump is SICK. It's like Shane O Mac jumping off the titan tron. It's like Jeff Hardy swantoning off a gigatic ladder through 3 tables. It's like Mick Foley going off of the Cell.

[shamelessposer]

jesus. i had to do a rollback for my computer. completely forgot about the troubles i might have to go through with this. i dont even have TEW installed anymore, nevermind the license. am i pretty much screwed?

This is the wrong forum. Ask your question in the Tech Support forum.

[bak42]

Hey, it's a sleazy business. And my sleazy alter-ego would totally ask a worker to take a sick bump, but only if they were on a PPA, of course :P

Heck, my sleazy alter-ego would ask a worker on a talent trade to do a sick bump.:D

[Jennie Bomb]

Heck, my sleazy alter-ego would ask a worker on a talent trade to do a sick bump.:D

Only on the last appearance they have agreed, of course. :D

[BuddyGarner]

What would a sick bump for BSC be? A wardrobe malfunction?

Now Ben Williams can live up to his nickname!

[Phantom Stranger]

I understood that and I don't have a problem with the feature itself. I was just answering crayon's question. My point was the idea of a booker downright telling a worker to take sick bump in the match is just disturbing to me. Granted, they can refuse, but a competent booker wouldn't even suggest that.

Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.

"Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?"

[lovestruck420]

Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.

"Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?"

Very true actually. I would more assign it with them asking him in WCW to do the Elbow drop to the outside constantly. May not look very sick, but onto a concrete floor with no padding can mess you up.

[Phantom Stranger]

Very true actually. I would more assign it with them asking him in WCW to do the Elbow drop to the outside constantly. May not look very sick, but onto a concrete floor with no padding can mess you up.

True, though the Nestea plunge is the one he eventually insisted on holding onto for special occasions - showing the 'refusal' part of the feature... ;)

[praguepride]

Yeah, my guess is it'll be a combo of personality & style.

So psycho workers and/or naive workers will probably accept more. I really hope naive workers are naive in that sense


"Don't worry. Falling off the top of a steel cage onto those tables...you'll be fine."

"oh...ok..."

[Cold Cobra]

Nice to see the return of the Sick Bump. Brings back memories...

[The Final Countdown]

With TEW08 being my first experience with a Ryland sim since EWR, I was surprised at the fact that there wasn't a 'Sick Bump' option in the road agent notes. Glad to see it coming back, and it should be neat to see how personalities affect who will or won't be willing to take the bumps.

[TeemuFoundation]

Not really. A shooting star to the outside isn't a 'bump' if someone catches you. It's not really all that dangerous if you have the athleticism to rotate all the way and the guy you're landing on knows how to catch you. I'd use 'All Out Match' to symbolise that kind of move

A sick bump is SICK. It's like Shane O Mac jumping off the titan tron. It's like Jeff Hardy swantoning off a gigatic ladder through 3 tables. It's like Mick Foley going off of the Cell.
Of those three, only Foley jumping off the top of the Cell is what I would classify as a "sick bump". Shane's jumps were glorified mattress bumps and a Swanton off the top of a ladder is something I could do. A recent example could be Foley getting Speared by Edge through the flaming table at WrestleMania 22. I might suggest that as a sick bump.
Foley's own career kinda challenges you on that.

"Mick, that huge leap into the guardrail popped the crowd, so we'll just do it around the loop, OK?"
Hardly a sick bump. I was talking specifically talking about sick bumps.

[FlameSnoopy]

Nice to see the return of the Sick Bump. Brings back memories...

Agree. I loved the old sick bumps feature in EWR, used to do it on my main events in my local promotions ladder matches.. Oh the times..

[Phantom Stranger]

Hardly a sick bump. I was talking specifically talking about sick bumps.

If we're talking about bumps that seriously increase the potential for injury, I suggest you pop over to Have A Nice Day, reread the relevant section, and reconsider. When he tried to get a career-ending injury it was one of the moves he returned to - which sounds like a sick bump to me.

[Self]

Of those three, only Foley jumping off the top of the Cell is what I would classify as a "sick bump". Shane's jumps were glorified mattress bumps and a Swanton off the top of a ladder is something I could do. A recent example could be Foley getting Speared by Edge through the flaming table at WrestleMania 22. I might suggest that as a sick bump.

The mattress bump I'll give you. The Swanton I won't. I'd wager most people on this board could 'do' the swanton, but that doesn't stop it from being painful. I could take the spear through the flaming table. Does that make it any less painful or risky? No.

Kind of a pointless argument (but a fun one I'm sure we could go on with for hours) It's a good feature. I'd be very tempted to start an indy deathmatch fed and have every single match contain a sick bump. Mmm. Bloodthirsty.

[Adam Ryland]

Please stop the Teemu vs. Everyone Else argument, it's been going on for three pages now and is pointless.

[falling_star]

Sick Bump FTW

[praguepride]

Self, I'll PM you some ideas I just had.
edit: I just realized. In 2010 we're not just going to bump a thread, we're going to sick bump threads :D

[crayon]

To really sell how crazy the luchadores were, they should have had guys miss high risk moves and sell an injury throughout a match. Not just, "Oh he missed the frog splash, he has a stomach now for 10 seconds!"

I would hope that he also has a stomach outside of the 10 seconds following a missed frog splash, to be honest. Because wrestling without a stomach really is crazy!

[praguepride]

I'd like to hear the announcers sell that

"OH MY GOD! He landed so hard is stomach popped out his mouth!"

That'd be hilarious for a place like RoH, have a guy who's "organs" kept popping out of place :D

Kind of like a comedy undertaker character, where the undead aspect is played for laughs.

[Sigilistic]

Wow...now I can get really sadistic with my SWF games. Piss me off and I'll have you take a sick bump while jobbing to Big Smack Scott.

But in all seriousness, very awesome addition.

[praguepride]

Wow...now I can get really sadistic with my SWF games. Piss me off and I'll have you take a sick bump while jobbing to Big Smack Scott.

That would be a funny road agent note though.

"Joe Jobber died in the ring, but there was still a lack of selling."

edit: I'd mark out hard if the C-verse is updated where Big Smack Scott becomes an "internet sensation" and "goes viral" going up to A* popularity in the US

SOLELY BECAUSE WE CAN'T STOP TALKING ABOUT HIM ON THESE FORUMS!

[DreamGoddessLindsey]

I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.

So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.

[Adam Ryland]

I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one)

No, they haven't. A TEW written deal is full-time employment and a monthly pay cheque regardless of activity, it is not just a deal that involves some degree of exclusivity. ROH have never done anything like that.

[LFC_chris]

I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.

So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.

USPW start with $5m tbf IIRC. I think that'd maybe be something mote like a better figure, but I can understand why it's high. It's something I've wanted to see though - I don't think 'size' itself should be an obstacle in signing written deals - if the money's there it should be possible.

I wouldn't know about ROH or whatever, but workers should'nt be willing to sign written deals with a company that doesn't have either national exposure or loads of money as it wouldn't make sense on their part.

[RayW]

I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.

So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.

But isn't that the idea? Only a cult promotion in an extremely good financial situation would, in the real world, be able to offer someone a written deal (in regards to what TEW considers a written deal).

Why would someone agree to an exclusivly written deal to a promotion that isn't popular enough that it isn't a household name, and might not be able to actually see his contract out due to financial promblems somewhere down the line, especially if at the time of signing the contract they only have $1,000,000. ONE MILLION DOLLARS?! In business terms, even with todays economical climate, that isn't a lot. Not at all. For these wrestlers (yes, even in game), this is there only real career path, and why risk everything they have, or could have, to join a company that isn't that wealthy?

[praguepride]

Especially when you consider that you need to actually PAY them that amount.

So if a guy gets a written deal for $10,000 a month for two years, that's $240,000 for that one guy.

If we use your $1,000,000 example, 1/4 of the companies finances are now tied up in a single person.

$10 mil seems reasonable because it's definitely something that's going to be hard to achieve, otherwise every cult promotion will start signing written deals which is not realistic.

[DreamGoddessLindsey]

But isn't that the idea? Only a cult promotion in an extremely good financial situation would, in the real world, be able to offer someone a written deal (in regards to what TEW considers a written deal).

Why would someone agree to an exclusivly written deal to a promotion that isn't popular enough that it isn't a household name, and might not be able to actually see his contract out due to financial promblems somewhere down the line, especially if at the time of signing the contract they only have $1,000,000. ONE MILLION DOLLARS?! In business terms, even with todays economical climate, that isn't a lot. Not at all. For these wrestlers (yes, even in game), this is there only real career path, and why risk everything they have, or could have, to join a company that isn't that wealthy?

You overlook the fact that the game uses much smaller amounts of money than the real world. Do you think Triple H works for $30,000 a month? No, he has a multi-million dollar deal, probably at least $100,000 or more a month. That means all the money amounts are downscaled for playability purposes.

$1,000,000 is way more than enough to hire people up to $10,000 or so per month, maybe even $15,000. In fact, it may even be cheaper than the combined pay per appearance amounts.

Honestly, I think the amount of money shouldn't be a factor. The owner restrictions on contract amounts should cover all the bases, and if someone is stupid enough to offer too many expensive contracts (like Heyman did late in ECW's life), then they go bankrupt out of stupidity.

Basically, I'd like to see it more like WMMA2. Even the smallest promotions can get exclusive deals, but you have to be careful not to overstep your financial means. Make it a matter of management rather than arbitrary limits. Put the challenge into the hands of the players to manage the finances instead of putting limits on things. I would just rather see more flexibility.

The only thing this could be used for is for National promotions who fall to Cult despite being profitable, so they can still keep their top talent. For promotions starting at Cult or below, the $7,000,000 requirement will likely never be fulfilled.

Sorry, this is meant as constructive criticism. I think think the amount is far too arbitrary and pulled out of thin air and way too high. $1,000,000 would make more sense, as that is a good healthy place for a Cult promotion to be if they are actually doing well.

[randomfreeze]

How do we know the money system works the same? Maybe it's even easier to make money in this version than '08. You keep saying that seven mil is an arbitrary number when you don't even know how the the financial system works. I think Adam deserves a little more respect than to say he's pulling numbers out of his ass here.

[Phantom Stranger]

Basically, I'd like to see it more like WMMA2. Even the smallest promotions can get exclusive deals, but you have to be careful not to overstep your financial means.

Exclusive does not mean written.

Just ask 21CW.

[franticloser]

just to clarify, with sick bumps and who makes them up, the booker usually will have finishes and major spots he wants for each match, he is open to suggestions from the workers, and they are free to say no or suggest something different but yes it is up to the booker if he wants them or not

[Bigpapa42]

You overlook the fact that the game uses much smaller amounts of money than the real world. Do you think Triple H works for $30,000 a month? No, he has a multi-million dollar deal, probably at least $100,000 or more a month. That means all the money amounts are downscaled for playability purposes.

$1,000,000 is way more than enough to hire people up to $10,000 or so per month, maybe even $15,000. In fact, it may even be cheaper than the combined pay per appearance amounts.

Honestly, I think the amount of money shouldn't be a factor. The owner restrictions on contract amounts should cover all the bases, and if someone is stupid enough to offer too many expensive contracts (like Heyman did late in ECW's life), then they go bankrupt out of stupidity.

Basically, I'd like to see it more like WMMA2. Even the smallest promotions can get exclusive deals, but you have to be careful not to overstep your financial means. Make it a matter of management rather than arbitrary limits. Put the challenge into the hands of the players to manage the finances instead of putting limits on things. I would just rather see more flexibility.

The only thing this could be used for is for National promotions who fall to Cult despite being profitable, so they can still keep their top talent. For promotions starting at Cult or below, the $7,000,000 requirement will likely never be fulfilled.

Sorry, this is meant as constructive criticism. I think think the amount is far too arbitrary and pulled out of thin air and way too high. $1,000,000 would make more sense, as that is a good healthy place for a Cult promotion to be if they are actually doing well.

If there are no financial restrictions, it makes it far too easy for any cult promotion to land written deals. So it basically becomes a cheat, and there really isn't as much reason to keep trying to grow to national anymore.

Its a bit tough to compare between MMA and TEW as the two businesses are not the same. An exclusive deal in MMA still means you are only paying that fighter when they fight. In wrestling, you are paying regardless of whether they step into the ring at all or not.

If you want to look at numbers, $1m is very low. As PP points out, you have signed the worker to a guaranteed contract and are therefore on the hook for that money. If its only $1m, you have commited a significant portion of your current money to that one worker. And look at it from the worker's perspective - are they really going to be enticed to sign a written contract (thereby giving up the option of working for other promotions and making money that way) when you may lack the ability to honor that contract?

I think having a decently-high financial level required is important as it makes landing those written contracts possible, but not necessarily likely. Which is realistic. Almost no promotions of that size have exclusive guaranteed contracts in reality, so why should it be easy and simple in the game?

Randomfreeze also has a good point - we do not know how the financial model for the new game will be laid out. But looking at 2008, there are four cult promotions that start with $5m. Out of six (by my quick count) promotions that start at Cult. So 2/3 of the promotions that start at Cult could be at that $7m level within a reasonable amount of time. Based on the 2008 financial model, $7m for a cult level promotion to be considered strong and stable doesn't seem unreasonable at all.

[Donners]

I hope that sick bumps will help to increase the feeling of a difference between hardcore and normal promotions. I find that they play very much the same, but if the fans of the former want sick bumps, then it requires a bit more thought as to wrestler and match types.

[darthsiddus2]

I hope that sick bumps will help to increase the feeling of a difference between hardcore and normal promotions. I find that they play very much the same, but if the fans of the former want sick bumps, then it requires a bit more thought as to wrestler and match types.

I think the diary writers will be able to tell the difference *wink*

[LoganRodzen]

Not really sure why people are getting so uptight over the cult written-deals feature and the money restriction. You always need excess cash in the bank... it doesn't matter if you're a janitor or a wrestling promotion. I wouldn't consider signing people to written deals until it's financially possible regardless of a restriction. If workers get stolen, so be it. Make new stars... that's the point of the game. :p

Honestly, I think the amount of money shouldn't be a factor. The owner restrictions on contract amounts should cover all the bases, and if someone is stupid enough to offer too many expensive contracts (like Heyman did late in ECW's life), then they go bankrupt out of stupidity.

I'm pretty sure at the time Heyman felt he was just 'risking it all' for that bigger pay out in the end that never came. I wouldn't say it was stupidity... just wishful thinking gone awry. :rolleyes:

[Donners]

I think the diary writers will be able to tell the difference *wink*

Oh, indeed, but while using your imagination is certainly good, it would be nice for the different styles to have a real gameplay distinction, especially for casual players. I think the game's flexibility can be its downfall in some respects - since the player can add so many new match types and customise the promotion style so much, the game doesn't always seem to know what to expect.

[CrookedRainJr]

Sick bumps being back is a very cool touch.

I remember in the early EWRs my brothers and I would jokingly always try to get Farouq to take a sick bump and he'd always refuse. We knew he would never do it; We would jokingly try all the time.

As mentioned already, definitely separates hardcore matches from promotion to promotion.

[praguepride]

The only thing this could be used for is for National promotions who fall to Cult despite being profitable, so they can still keep their top talent. For promotions starting at Cult or below, the $7,000,000 requirement will likely never be fulfilled.

Actually, this might be the main point of this feature, not for rising feds to get a deal but National+ feds that drop to cult will still be able to extend written contracts and not get all their talent stolen because they were forced to sign PPA's for a couple months.

[Donners]

I would have thought that if a National promotion fell a level, and weren't able to bounce straight back up, their momentum would be very low - so low that they would not qualify for the feature.

[falling_star]

Actually, this might be the main point of this feature, not for rising feds to get a deal but National+ feds that drop to cult will still be able to extend written contracts and not get all their talent stolen because they were forced to sign PPA's for a couple months.

I agree; it always bugged me that TCW and SWF fell to Cult (usually on ther path to International/Global), and then their talent would end-up working in USPW and SWF, or USPW and TCW.

Personally, I think the amount should be lowered to allow true Cult feds to utilize it better; I think anywhere from 3-5 million is more than enough. Given that the owners personality factors into written deals for Cult feds, an owner who is driven to succeed at all costs might sign some not-so-smart written deals because he is sure that they will come out ahead because of it. Rather than just thinking about the situation NOW, the logic would consider the present and possible impact on the future.

Heyman, for example, was so sure that ECW would succeed in rising to levels more comparable with WWF and WCW (or at least he needed to look that way to the boys) that he overextended himself with the thought the product would continue to grow and generate more income to pay these deals.

[DreamGoddessLindsey]

I agree; it always bugged me that TCW and SWF fell to Cult (usually on ther path to International/Global), and then their talent would end-up working in USPW and SWF, or USPW and TCW.

Personally, I think the amount should be lowered to allow true Cult feds to utilize it better; I think anywhere from 3-5 million is more than enough. Given that the owners personality factors into written deals for Cult feds, an owner who is driven to succeed at all costs might sign some not-so-smart written deals because he is sure that they will come out ahead because of it. Rather than just thinking about the situation NOW, the logic would consider the present and possible impact on the future.

Heyman, for example, was so sure that ECW would succeed in rising to levels more comparable with WWF and WCW (or at least he needed to look that way to the boys) that he overextended himself with the thought the product would continue to grow and generate more income to pay these deals.

Not to mention most people consider TNA Cult sized, and TNA is bleeding money. With this, TNA still wouldn't qualify for Written deals, even though most of their talent are signed to Written contracts.

[Remianen]

I don't think the "Sneaking Written Deals" are going to take place hardly ever if at all. The $7,000,000 requirement is a bit over-the-top I think. I seem to recall ROH having one or two Written deals at various times (Bryan Danielson used to have one) and they have nowhere near $7,000,000. I have never seen a Cult promotion get to that high amount of money either. Hell, starting National promotions in most databases (including TCW in the default database) only have $10,000,000.

So unless the amount is lowered to something more reasonable like $1,000,000, this feature will probably never take place.

You're wrong. See, you're falling into the same trap everyone else does. If people ran their Cult level promotions like they run their 0/0/0 local promotion, they'd have 7 mil by mid-Cult (do it and see). But no, most people do a bumrush to Regional/Cult trying to get to National ASAP. So saying something is 'impossible' or 'will never take place' just because "everyone" plays a certain way, is myopic and well, wrong.

And Adam's right. Danielson's never been exclusive to ROH.

Not to mention most people consider TNA Cult sized, and TNA is bleeding money. With this, TNA still wouldn't qualify for Written deals, even though most of their talent are signed to Written contracts.

So lemme get this straight. You think TNA is Cult and 'bleeding money'? How long have they been bleeding money? Eventually the body runs out of blood but TNA hasn't (and won't). Why is that exactly? TNA in TEW terms would be Cult sized with an International or Global sized bank balance due to Panda so your comparison is fatally flawed. There's also no way in TEW for a promotion's worker's contracts to be subsidized by their network (like Spike does for Angle & Sting's deals).

I can tell you unequivocally that if you run your promotion responsibly and keep your books balanced, you can have 7 mil by mid to late Cult (assuming the economy/industry doesn't spend too much time in the crapper). But nobody wants to do that so you're probably right, it'll mainly be used most by fallen SWF/TCW types of promotions. That doesn't mean 7 mil is 'impossible' or 'too high'. It means every Tom, Dick, and Troy Winner isn't going to be able to lock up the top of their card just because they're Cult. 1 mil would be complete Monty Haul (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=monty%20haul). If that's the number, you might as well just give written deals to Cult promotions outright. Even 5SSW can hit a mil by Cult and they start with a few onerous written deals on their books. 21CW starts with what, 2.5 mil at low Cult? 4.5 is doable before National if they actually ran their shows in a sensible fashion. The difference is, it'll take you longer to get to National because you have to be conservative in your approach (and the UK sucks for that in TEW).

The feature is meant to make it possible to achieve, not a gimme. There are several folks here who can tell you it's possible to get to 7 mil in cash before National (foolinc would be one, I'd imagine).

[djthefunkchris]

I think the bigger question is going to be, at least for me, what is going to be the rules for House shows. Are they staying the same (must be on written contract), or will we have a way to replicate the old days with regional promotions being able to capitalize on house show income? Will making the promotions Cult end up being the work around? Etc.

[Enkay]

I think the bigger question is going to be, at least for me, what is going to be the rules for House shows. Are they staying the same (must be on written contract), or will we have a way to replicate the old days with regional promotions being able to capitalize on house show income? Will making the promotions Cult end up being the work around? Etc.

Well, what I did in a recent game while playing CZCW was I just put a few weekly events on my schedule, for Thursdays Fridays and Saturdays. They're pretty much the equivalent of a house show, so long as too many of your workers aren't under contract to other bigger promotions.

The extra booking work is the only downside, but if you don't mind that, then its a good way to expand faster and get some sizable income flowing.

[Adam Ryland]

Please stop arguing about the seven million figure - it's ridiculous that people are comparing that figure to what real promotions have (the finances are nothing alike) or how the figure is "too high" \ "impossible" for the game (firstly none of you have any idea what the finances are like in TEW2010, and secondly do you not think that maybe we test these figures to see how they work???). Testing shows that the figure works well, and if it turns out that it's unpopular once it's released it's a very easy alteration.

[Sons of Kohral]

Daddy's angry... :(

Anyway, sick bumps are... well... sick. Will definitely help in my dream for an ultra hardcore, backyard garbage fed. Rooftop of Mom's Garage Match, here we come!

[sebsplex]

So many great features announced already, especially mod-focussed ones. I'm really looking forward to getting my hands on the editor this year, especially with so much added influence on shaping how the world expands.

On the latest features though. I love the idea of cult promotions being in a position to offer written deals instead of this being an editor-exclusive phenomonen (sp?) and being able to book sick bump spots adds some much welcome additional ability to shape matches. Now at least they won't be restricted to the realms of imagination and diaries. I wonder if Cornell and RDJ would have agreed to the sick scaffold bump I had them take in my old HGC diary?

[cappyboy]

You know with some of the stuff that's been done to offer context to various eras, I wonder if the definition of what a sick bump is will be era specific. Like for instance, Snuka's legendary Superfly off the cage. While it's been topped time and again in the years since then, it would have been regarded as insanely sick at the time. And I imagine the top rope moves we consider routine now might have been viewed as sick back in the WW2 era. I know I don't remember having ever seen any in old clips until you get into the 70's.

[James Casey]

That would tie in with eras, at a guess - and could even be defined by the company's own risk rating. The big 'sick bump of the year' spot(s) in WWE tend to occur during the MITB matches. Ladder assisted SSPs to the floor, Hardy's Swantons from '30 foot' up and that dive onto Edge through the ladder... All those equate to sick bumps by WWE standards, but in CZW (or WEXXV) they'd be big but not sick.

I wonder for myself whether sick = big, or whether a gimmick match could end gorily without necessarily being ultra-dangerous. Cactus Jack famously getting tied up so badly in barbed wire ring ropes that the match had to be stopped was pretty sick. A similar finish could be done off a bump, but in terms of sick = spectacular, not so much...

[Historian]

You overlook the fact that the game uses much smaller amounts of money than the real world. Do you think Triple H works for $30,000 a month? No, he has a multi-million dollar deal, probably at least $100,000 or more a month. That means all the money amounts are downscaled for playability purposes.


This is the only part of your post that really concerns me. Actually, the game uses a rather inflated economical scale in most aspects.

No independent referee gets paid $1,000 per appearance like I have seen Jay Fair ask for. Your majority of Independent wrestlers are not getting the $600 and $700 salaries that I've seen low-level independent guys such as Eddie Howard or DC Rayne ask for. Your standard Independent wrestler gets paid much less. So, with that said, most of the money being paid out by the Pay-Per-Appearance deals is much larger than it would be in real wrestling, so everything is actually adjusted rather nicely. In TEW, companies pay more money, but they also have more money in the bank than your real life company of the corresponding size.

The TEW scale is actually rather close in terms of national contracts. Occasionally it dips onto the higher side, I feel, but for the most part, it's damn near close. I do not know everyone's individual contracts or anything, but I remember reading or hearing, Ric Flair speak of his contract in WWE where he was getting paid around 400,000 a year guaranteed. He also mentioned that his salary was very large, especially since he was not doing a lot of wrestling. Chris Jericho, in his book "A Lion's Tale" mentions that he was guaranteed 165,000 a year. The top level people in WCW, at Jericho's time, had salaries guarenteed of $750,000 a year, and when he signed his first WWE Contract, it was for a guaranteed $450,000 a year, with incentives and bonuses (also courtesy of his book). Jericho was also brought in with the purpose of being a main event star. If you take Jericho's guaranteed salary and divide it by 12, you get 37,500 a month, awfully close to a 30,000 a month deal. I also remember Bret Hart's deal with WCW was worth over 1 million a year guaranteed, and that was considered unbelievably high.

In regards to Triple H's deal, his contract is worth a considerable amount of money [I do not know the exact figures] at the base level. But his guarentee, I'm willing to bet, is not over $100,000 per month, because that would mean he is guaranteed to make $1,200,000 a year. The bulk of Triple H's money comes from his Pay Per View bonus' and his merchandise cuts. If Triple H is guaranteed to make over $1,200,000 a year, I would be very surprised. I'm more apt to believe that with all the extra incentives he makes over a million a year, but not just on his base guarantee.

Those are my two cents :)

P.Ss: Sorry this might be a little late or out-dated, I have been away for the weekend... And, I think the sick bump feature is a very good addition, I'm glad to see it back. It's nice to have in the arsenal of road agent notes.

I think the 7. mil bank is just fine with me. It should be nay-impossible for a Cult level promotion to lock up talent in long-term written deals.

[mike b]

This is the only part of your post that really concerns me. Actually, the game uses a rather inflated economical scale in most aspects.

No independent referee gets paid $1,000 per appearance like I have seen Jay Fair ask for. Your majority of Independent wrestlers are not getting the $600 and $700 salaries that I've seen low-level independent guys such as Eddie Howard or DC Rayne ask for. Your standard Independent wrestler gets paid much less. So, with that said, most of the money being paid out by the Pay-Per-Appearance deals is much larger than it would be in real wrestling, so everything is actually adjusted rather nicely. In TEW, companies pay more money, but they also have more money in the bank than your real life company of the corresponding size.

The TEW scale is actually rather close in terms of national contracts. Occasionally it dips onto the higher side, I feel, but for the most part, it's damn near close. I do not know everyone's individual contracts or anything, but I remember reading or hearing, Ric Flair speak of his contract in WWE where he was getting paid around 400,000 a year guaranteed. He also mentioned that his salary was very large, especially since he was not doing a lot of wrestling. Chris Jericho, in his book "A Lion's Tale" mentions that he was guaranteed 165,000 a year. The top level people in WCW, at Jericho's time, had salaries guarenteed of $750,000 a year, and when he signed his first WWE Contract, it was for a guaranteed $450,000 a year, with incentives and bonuses (also courtesy of his book). Jericho was also brought in with the purpose of being a main event star. If you take Jericho's guaranteed salary and divide it by 12, you get 37,500 a month, awfully close to a 30,000 a month deal. I also remember Bret Hart's deal with WCW was worth over 1 million a year guaranteed, and that was considered unbelievably high.

In regards to Triple H's deal, his contract is worth a considerable amount of money [I do not know the exact figures] at the base level. But his guarentee, I'm willing to bet, is not over $100,000 per month, because that would mean he is guaranteed to make $1,200,000 a year. The bulk of Triple H's money comes from his Pay Per View bonus' and his merchandise cuts. If Triple H is guaranteed to make over $1,200,000 a year, I would be very surprised. I'm more apt to believe that with all the extra incentives he makes over a million a year, but not just on his base guarantee.

Those are my two cents :)

P.Ss: Sorry this might be a little late or out-dated, I have been away for the weekend... And, I think the sick bump feature is a very good addition, I'm glad to see it back. It's nice to have in the arsenal of road agent notes.

I think the 7. mil bank is just fine with me. It should be nay-impossible for a Cult level promotion to lock up talent in long-term written deals.

Actualy HHH makes over 2 million a year

http://wwecharacters.blogspot.com/2007/04/wwe-wrestler-salaries.html

[Comradebot]

Actualy HHH makes over 2 million a year

http://wwecharacters.blogspot.com/2007/04/wwe-wrestler-salaries.html

I think that 2 mill is achieved thanks to his cut of merchandise/ppv money, and no clue if it includes all the other perks listed next to it. The article kind of alludes to that being the case. I don't believe he makes two million dollars a year, PLUS a cut of merchandise and/or PPV sales.

[crayon]

Loove the new booking statistics split. Should make good for giving AI promotions their own personality, such as "oh man, how do these guys wind up booking this monkey crap?".

Wonder how well it'll be able to simulate the wwe crapfests which managed to stop me watching them several years ago :P

[King Chono]

I enjoyed Adam's example of Russo. Before I even finished the paragraph that's who I thought of. This will be a great feature, Shohei Baba is someone I'd use an example for the opposite, only puro fans and Dave Meltzer really give him any credit, but he was probably the best booker on the planet from 1988-his death in 1999, but it's also unlikely he would have been hired anywhere else in the world had he left AJPW. This feature will really allow more realistic historical mods, as if every other feature Adam's announced doesn't do this already.

[1PWfan]

I'm a fan of this one too- I tend to prefer the smaller features that enrich the universe, rather than changine it.

[The-619]

Loove the new booking statistics split. Should make good for giving AI promotions their own personality, such as "oh man, how do these guys wind up booking this monkey crap?".

Wonder how well it'll be able to simulate the wwe crapfests which managed to stop me watching them several years ago :P

Exactly, I'm interested to see how the WWE will go as they certainly don't have much skill on their booking team atm. Everytime I play as another company in a real world mod, WWE seems to do really well everytime, like put on B+ to A shows and I just don't think that's realistic.

[James Casey]

In TEW terms it is realistic. The company will use its biggest draws to get big ratings as any SE fed should.

[Apupunchau@optonline]

I think I'm finally beginning to have a problem with the world "realistic" I think people should just say "as I see it". The problem with "realistic" is its always colored by how you feel realism should be. WWE is getting B+ and A rated shows in game because the AI is playing to its strengths (ie star power). Now you may not like WWE shows but WWE sells out arenas world wide and is raking in the dough hand over fist so they must be putting on damn good shows to be a global dominating company. So saying its not "realistic" for WWE to be getting B+ and A shows in game while their real world situation seems to prove that they are doing quite well seems a little off some how.

[Remianen]

Loove the new booking statistics split. Should make good for giving AI promotions their own personality, such as "oh man, how do these guys wind up booking this monkey crap?".

Wonder how well it'll be able to simulate the wwe crapfests which managed to stop me watching them several years ago :P

Exactly, I'm interested to see how the WWE will go as they certainly don't have much skill on their booking team atm. Everytime I play as another company in a real world mod, WWE seems to do really well everytime, like put on B+ to A shows and I just don't think that's realistic.

That's going to come down to the modmaker. But, I would expect that many modmakers won't even pay attention to this feature and have everyone except Russo, Steph (since she's usually set as the booker in many mods), Heyman, and maybe Bischoff, Sapolsky, and Mantell, with base values in these stats.

I think I'm finally beginning to have a problem with the world "realistic" I think people should just say "as I see it". The problem with "realistic" is its always colored by how you feel realism should be. WWE is getting B+ and A rated shows in game because the AI is playing to its strengths (ie star power). Now you may not like WWE shows but WWE sells out arenas world wide and is raking in the dough hand over fist so they must be putting on damn good shows to be a global dominating company. So saying its not "realistic" for WWE to be getting B+ and A shows in game while their real world situation seems to prove that they are doing quite well seems a little off some how.

Actually Apu, that's not really correct. TEW can't simulate stick in the mud fanbases. Think about it. WWE could semi-main a PPV with Hornswaggle and their core fans wouldn't think anything of it. No matter how bad they are product wise (and they've been very bad for various stretches in the past), their fanbase remains....because they're WWE. They're not going to fall by their own actions, someone will have to BEAT them because their 'base' (in political terms) is fixed. That's like saying just because something is the biggest name, that automatically makes it 'better'.

I look at them the same as Microsoft years ago. Remember ME? Now, if MS had competition when that OS came out, it would've/could've ruined them, yes? But they didn't, so it didn't.

[The Bus]

I think I'm finally beginning to have a problem with the world "realistic" I think people should just say "as I see it". The problem with "realistic" is its always colored by how you feel realism should be. WWE is getting B+ and A rated shows in game because the AI is playing to its strengths (ie star power). Now you may not like WWE shows but WWE sells out arenas world wide and is raking in the dough hand over fist so they must be putting on damn good shows to be a global dominating company. So saying its not "realistic" for WWE to be getting B+ and A shows in game while their real world situation seems to prove that they are doing quite well seems a little off some how.

That came up to my mind too, they appeal to their targeted crowd. Now they focus to the families with their PG-13 and "real" wrestling fans see this as crap. I don't like the product myself, but hey money talks! Wrestling is in no sort of boom period in real life. So they make the most out of the situation by appealing to the younger fans and get more families and merchandise sales. WWE hopes they will stay as fans for a long time and bring in money in the longer time span. This all makes sense business-wise, but as smark it sucks.

WWE is about making money, not about being a great wrestling promotion!

Back to the topic, I like the separation of a stat in this new entry. All these little streams are building a big ass river!

[Genadi]

Chris Jericho, in his book "A Lion's Tale" mentions that he was guaranteed 165,000 a year. The top level people in WCW, at Jericho's time, had salaries guarenteed of $750,000 a year, and when he signed his first WWE Contract, it was for a guaranteed $450,000 a year, with incentives and bonuses (also courtesy of his book). Jericho was also brought in with the purpose of being a main event star. If you take Jericho's guaranteed salary and divide it by 12, you get 37,500 a month, awfully close to a 30,000 a month deal. I also remember Bret Hart's deal with WCW was worth over 1 million a year guaranteed, and that was considered unbelievably high.

WWE contracts included incentives for performance, WCW's didn't. WWE guys I'm pretty sure to this day are on the same type of contracts where the higher up on the card they are on the biggest PPVs the more they make.

On topic - Sick bumps back in is awesome, the latest booking stat splt feature is heaven for mod makers to. It seems Adam is trying to make mod making easier and more accesible. I'd love to see the days of old return when there were literally 4 or 5 RL mods for every year from the early 90's upwards. Some of the scenarios some people came up with back then gave the game extra legs.

[Regis]

Back to the topic, I like the separation of a stat in this new entry. All these little streams are building a big ass river!

Oh my God! There's going to be an ass river, big or otherwise?

[djthefunkchris]

Actually Apu, that's not really correct. TEW can't simulate stick in the mud fanbases. Think about it. WWE could semi-main a PPV with Hornswaggle and their core fans wouldn't think anything of it. No matter how bad they are product wise (and they've been very bad for various stretches in the past), their fanbase remains....because they're WWE. They're not going to fall by their own actions, someone will have to BEAT them because their 'base' (in political terms) is fixed. That's like saying just because something is the biggest name, that automatically makes it 'better'.

I look at them the same as Microsoft years ago. Remember ME? Now, if MS had competition when that OS came out, it would've/could've ruined them, yes? But they didn't, so it didn't.

This is just an opinion, no matter how "sure" you are of this. I would tend to agree with you, but that would just be my opinion as well. You've stated other opinions that I think I agree with more then this one though:

I remember a few times you pointed out what WWE fans are concerned about, and that WWE does a good job of making sure they are satisfied. Your conclusion is that WWE fans aren't really wrestling fans, but more like soap opera fans (or maybe that's my conclusion, lol). I think of it more as a circus.

For what they do, they do great with it. Sports Entertainment is the "key" here though. You ussually look at things from an entirely different perspective, so far as to compare with much smaller "hardcore" type promotions, that are entirely different in their "Key" features (TEW speak).


On topic... I'm not blown away by this feature, but I can definately see the appeal here. So far there is not one feature I have seen, that won't change the game as we know it. Although I might not be blown away by some of them, they are really game-world changing features... for the better. I can't wait to get here sometime in the morning to see what the next feature is, and I don't remember being this into 2008 (although I thought I was very into it at the time).

[Tempest Kane]

WWE has lost 9million weekly viewers over the last decade... Im not sure how you would call that a fixed base...

[Phantom Stranger]

WWE has lost 9million weekly viewers over the last decade... Im not sure how you would call that a fixed base...

Because very few TV shows last a decade in the first place?

[PeterHilton]

#26: Booking Skill & Reputation

Both values can alter over time, based on performance and situation

I'll be interested to see what in-game events alter these numbers.

Using Adam's example, how many piss poor shows would Russo have to book before his rep matches his skill level.

[Vladamire Dracos]

Personally, I'd love, instead of getting letter grades for each (I.E. Booking Skill C+, Booking Reputation D) if both entries were represented by a unique title that represented them combined. For example, A booker might have Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation F-, but if you looked at him in-game, it would simply tell you he is considered an "Unknown Booker", meanwhile, looking at a guy with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D might tell you that he is considered an "Underrated Booker". If their Respect stat was also connected with it (and the Respect stat was negatively effected for failed Dirty Tricks), it could even be used to paint a semi-accurate portrayal of the bookers personality as seen by others in the game world (a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D, and Respect E- might be given the title "Badboy", while a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D, and Respect B- might get "Respected Bookerman"). Adam could even get creative with it, a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D+, and Respect B might get the title "Dangerously" or a guy with Booking Skill D-, Booking Reputation B, and Respect D- might get called "Russoriffic!"

Well, it's just an idea. :p

In any case, I LOVE this feature and the control it'll give us over how the AI operates. If I ever get around to fulfilling the idea of westernizing and wrestle-izing the "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" this tool will be a great help with guys like Lü Bu, Dong Zhuo, the lesser lords that show up early in the story like Gongsun Zan, and the Yellow Turban leaders.

[BurningHamster]

Another good update, booking skill and booking reputation is another of many little improvements that has me interested. I can definately see how it can be used.

I am assuming that booker reputation moves slowly, they would have to be booking things consistently below their reputation for it to continually decrease or consistently above for it to continually increase? That's my best guess anyway.

[djthefunkchris]

Personally, I'd love, instead of getting letter grades for each (I.E. Booking Skill C+, Booking Reputation D) if both entries were represented by a unique title that represented them combined. For example, A booker might have Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation F-, but if you looked at him in-game, it would simply tell you he is considered an "Unknown Booker", meanwhile, looking at a guy with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D might tell you that he is considered an "Underrated Booker". If their Respect stat was also connected with it (and the Respect stat was negatively effected for failed Dirty Tricks), it could even be used to paint a semi-accurate portrayal of the bookers personality as seen by others in the game world (a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D, and Respect E- might be given the title "Badboy", while a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D, and Respect B- might get "Respected Bookerman"). Adam could even get creative with it, a booker with Booking Skill A*, Booking Reputation D+, and Respect B might get the title "Dangerously" or a guy with Booking Skill D-, Booking Reputation B, and Respect D- might get called "Russoriffic!"

Well, it's just an idea. :p

In any case, I LOVE this feature and the control it'll give us over how the AI operates. If I ever get around to fulfilling the idea of westernizing and wrestle-izing the "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" this tool will be a great help with guys like Lü Bu, Dong Zhuo, the lesser lords that show up early in the story like Gongsun Zan, and the Yellow Turban leaders.

I think I like your idea. I haven't made up my mind, keep re-reading it, for some reason not easy for me to fully understand or something.

If I'm getting the main points right, what your saying bassically is if someone has a High reputation, but an actual low booking rating, you would get something like "Over-rated" or vice versa, "Under-rated". Where both stats would result in a certain understanding of the character, instead of just looking them up by stats. Someone that comes highly recommended, might not be all that great (for example), but since they have this huge reputation, they are highly recommended. Adds a bit of mystery, and I think I like this idea. As long as the mod has controll, perhaps even in game editor can help with it (or for those wanting to see for sure without going in and out of the game). I don't know... I think I got what your saying though.

[crayon]

I quite like the idea as well.. I'm not certain about the example titles nor how many there need to be, but I like the idea that when it comes to choosing a booker, you most likely wouldn't be able to pinpoint their talent as specifically to a letter grade, so you'd have a handful of people who are let's just say "really good" and it'd be a bit of crapshoot as to who's better.

But then again, that also takes out any sense of seeing a booker improve, which would be fun for stat junkies. Likely other things I'm not taking into account as well.

[Gigas]

If we can see a wrestlers pinpointed to a grade, why not the bookers?

[James Casey]

Why does it bother? All bookers are your rivals - you don't employ them for their booking skill.

[crayon]

If we can see a wrestlers pinpointed to a grade, why not the bookers?

There's not really any good answer for or against it I can give you. Just for me, telling a good booker seems a bit more abstract than whether or not someone has good mat skills/can cut a a promo/etc.. A wrestler you can see everything they do on display right in front of you, but a booker, you only see the end results (well, unless you actually work with them.. then you could pinpoint them to a "grade" as such); end results which have a lot of extraneous factors to them... also, wrestlers need the detailed grading from a gameplay perspective precisely so the whole game doesn't feel like a crapshoot (counter to what I was suggesting about bookers)

tl;dr I have no problem with bookers being graded just like wrestlers, but I also like the idea of them having more abstract grading, at least in theory

J. Casey is also quite right, though. At the end of the day, unless there's some new feature coming it's only the AI which is going to be hiring/firing them, so it doesn't make a whole of of difference either way

[Wrestling Century]

Woo Hoo! This game just keeps getting better, doesn't it! :D :cool:

[praguepride]

In any case, I LOVE this feature and the control it'll give us over how the AI operates. If I ever get around to fulfilling the idea of westernizing and wrestle-izing the "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" this tool will be a great help with guys like Lü Bu, Dong Zhuo, the lesser lords that show up early in the story like Gongsun Zan, and the Yellow Turban leaders.

On a side note, the new Red Cliff stars Cao Cao :D I want to see it for all that Rot3k action but the finacee has no interest in Chinese history :(

Anyway, I'd say I dislike that idea. Titles are only in the game as existing for popularity and even then I think it's a bit of a waste. There's so many different combinations that it'd get silly because you wouldn't need the game to translate it.

For example, you see a guy with high booking reputation but low booking stat, maybe that's overrated, maybe that's a good booker in a bit of a slump, or maybe he's just really good at marketing?

I'd rather come up with my own terms then have the game tell me "oh, he's a badass, he's overrated, he's underrated, blah blah blah".

Speaking of which, I'm HIGHLY curious who in the C-verse is "over/under" rated. I mean it'd be cheap for every single person to just have the same grade for rep and booking, so I'm curious who in the c-verse has the split. Maybe Joey Poison is low booking because his rep is in the toilet but his ideas are really good, meanwhile Joel Bryant and/or Sam Keith are highly overrated, and the "elections" fiasco was justifiably dumped on Keith's shoulders :D

[Donners]

If we can see a wrestlers pinpointed to a grade, why not the bookers?

Because wrestlers' skills are on display. Bookers' skills are not so evident. Russo got blamed for a lot of the problems with TNA, yet it was when other members of the creative team were cleared out, and Russo took charge, that the product improved significantly.

I can see real-world mods being even less attractive with this feature, unfortunately.

[TeemuFoundation]

Because wrestlers' skills are on display. Bookers' skills are not so evident. Russo got blamed for a lot of the problems with TNA, yet it was when other members of the creative team were cleared out, and Russo took charge, that the product improved significantly.

I can see real-world mods being even less attractive with this feature, unfortunately.
Don't blame the features, blame the mod makers who don't understand the features and misuse them.

[Jennie Bomb]

Don't blame the features, blame the mod makers who don't understand the features and misuse them.

I agree, to a point. But then, there are always situations in which there is no clear answer. I mean, there's usually debate about how the sizes of TNA and RoH should be represented in different mods, for example. Perhaps more than any stat in the game, the booking stats are going to be difficult to reach a consensus on. I mean... take Gabe Sapolsky for example. How would you represent his stats? Within the internet wrestling bubble, Sapolsky is revered by many as a booking God. Yet, outside of this small bubble, representing a minority of wrestling fans, he's pretty much entirely unknown. Which of these different opinions would represent his booking reputation?

Then you'd have to consider his booking stat. How do you measure what makes a good booker? Can someone who has never booked a commercially successful promotion be rated highly, no matter how critically acclaimed his shows are?And even if you were willing to give him a high score for his creative vision, how much would you have to deduct for the flaws in his booking, such as the tendency of him to burn out live crowds and thus hurt main event scores under the TEW rating system?

[Adam Ryland]

I agree, to a point. But then, there are always situations in which there is no clear answer. I mean, there's usually debate about how the sizes of TNA and RoH should be represented in different mods, for example. Perhaps more than any stat in the game, the booking stats are going to be difficult to reach a consensus on. I mean... take Gabe Sapolsky for example. How would you represent his stats? Within the internet wrestling bubble, Sapolsky is revered by many as a booking God. Yet, outside of this small bubble, representing a minority of wrestling fans, he's pretty much entirely unknown. Which of these different opinions would represent his booking reputation?

Then you'd have to consider his booking stat. How do you measure what makes a good booker? Can someone who has never booked a commercially successful promotion be rated highly, no matter how critically acclaimed his shows are?And even if you were willing to give him a high score for his creative vision, how much would you have to deduct for the flaws in his booking, such as the tendency of him to burn out live crowds and thus hurt main event scores under the TEW rating system?

Reputation impacts who will hire him - you clearly want Gabe working for promotions the size of ROH, so he would get a low-to-mid rating.

Skill primarily impacts signings (he is generally accepted to have a good eye for talent) and match making (he doesn't have a reputation for stupid decisions in this area) so he would get an "above competent" rating at least, with it increasing based on the specific mod maker's opinion of how good he is.

I think your post is a perfect example of exactly why there are so many debates - people have this tendency to bring up all sorts of issues that are completely irrelevant. If you stick to what the journal entry stated was relevant factors, rating someone like Gabe is actually very simple. It's only when you start asking questions about "creative vision" and "burning out crowds" - factors that you seem to have plucked out of thin air based on assumptions as they weren't mentioned anywhere else - that you start causing yourself problems.

[Self]

#27: Comedy Matches

A fairly quick addition to explain, there is now a seventh Match Style in TEW2010, Comedy. This works primarily on Entertainment factors, and is really only suited for promotions that have a heavy element of Comedy in their product.

YES!!!!!

This could be the straw that breaks my camel's back and convinces me that this game is something I must buy. I really like this feature.

[TeemuFoundation]

PWG, here I come!

[SWF Fan]

PWG, here I come!

Instantly I felt that this could be the thing that really makes CHIKARA a fun place for me to play as and could really open up the Japanese market if I was to start a promotion like DDT or one like that with the comedy aspect :)

[Waghlon]

Its finally possible to book a Hornswoggle match without looking like an idiot*!


(*actually you will still look like an idiot)

[crayon]

I can get down with the comedy matches... will finally give me enough reason to use that Comedy product setting.

Also a question about the booker's reputation.. does the kind of reputation a promotion is looking for in a booker directly correllate to their overness? Such as (keeping it simple), a promotion is 70% all across america, will they then be trying to find a booker with 70% or above rep?

Or does it correlate to promotion size (i.e. international/cult/regional/etc), and if so, what are the cut-offs?

Or is it something much more complicated altogether?

Just asking so I can try to match up ideal potential candiates with their respective promotions best.

[alden]

Are there any feds in the c-verse that have a high comedy factor? With out looking at it i can't think of one......even uspw is medium. I think this will be perfect for something like ddt.........no longer will monkey vs ladder be unrunable lol.

[Blackman]

I think in the '97 database, SWF had high comedy. :)

[crayon]

I wonder if comedy gimmicks have any part of this. Because I have pretty much neglected that type of gimmick completely in my database

[mike b]

This feature will be good for those who wish to play a fed such as Glow in DOTT Orr maybe even BOSC in in c verse. But i have a mean hunch they will not be around in 2010

[Moe Hunter]

Fantastico!

I've always wanted to have a truly comedy-oriented product (stuff like the Big Show / Kane technical wizardry, Ebessan, Delirious, Jericho when he's let loose...), but outside of writing my own angles, I never really felt it. Especially in 08 I found that putting Comedy into my product negatively impacted the overall style I wanted without really giving me much in return.

Now, things are looking up :)

[TeemuFoundation]

Its finally possible to book a Hornswoggle match without looking like an idiot!
No.

[James Casey]

My first thought on seeing this was CHIKARA. I'm definitely pleased to fianlyl see this make a formal appearance in TEW, as there's been a few times when I've wondered if some of my entertaining but relatively untalented workers could get a good match rating from a Dude Love/Oewn Hart-esque clash.

[Self]

Babes of Sin City has Heavy Comedy. I can't imagine you'd stray much from Eye Candy matches, but one or two Comedy fights per card with the right girls would be nice variety. CGC also has Heavy Comedy. Again, for the most part you'd stick to typical DeColt ass-kickings, but throwing one of two Comedy matches with Whippy & Co would spice things up.

Those are probably my two favourite promotions, so I'm loving this. I'm not interested in a full-on full-time comedy promotion, but I like variety, and a comedy match is good for that.

[praguepride]

I'm shocked that Self isn't marking out for comedy matches in his FCK diary :eek:

[Self]

I'm shocked that Self isn't marking out for comedy matches in his FCK diary :eek:

I'm marking out all across the board, I just didn't feel the need to make a cheap plug :D Regardless, I seriously doubt I'll ever play FCK on TEW2010. It seems like too much effort to convert the database over just for my little vanity project.

[Comradebot]

I'll say it now:

"The Alpha Norwegian" Bam Bam Johansson vs. 12 midgets

[FlameSnoopy]

Cool, fun, awesome, exciting little addition, I like it!

[Sydewayz]

There are some filters that I wish they would add to the roster and/or the competitor booking screen and/or talk to worker:

1. A filter for seeing who has not been booked recently--eg has not appeared in 1 week, 2 weeks, 3 weeks, greater than 4 weeks. seems stupid but I get annoyed with having to manually having to scroll down to see who is upset with not having appeared--especially when my roster size reaches 3 brands.

2. A happiness filter in the talk to worker screen. I know you should care to talk to all your workers on a regular basis--but sometimes one forgets. I sometimes end up tanking a persons career by accident (having them lose in a series of TV matches-and realizing that I have been picking on them) just because they are not in my current ppv plans. can also tie in with # 1--although I would prefer to know before I get them angry by not booking them.

3. A size filter in the competitor booking screen would be perfect. I dislike finding out that a competitor is ineligible to win the cruiserweight title after the match has already taken place.

That would be a start. The other thing I miss is having a booking team...Having different perspectives about titles and pushes often gave me new ideas for what to do to prevent the matches to become formulaic...

[Astil]

The Smackster finally has a role in my SWF! Great new addition

[Wrestling Century]

Yes! Now I can make a Super Fun Bouncy House match! Although I don't really know how the competitors could get hurt! :D

[The Masked Orange]

Finally, Joe Sexy Vs. BSS Vs. Kurt Laramee will be able to headline the supreme challenge!

[Wrestling Century]

Finally, Joe Sexy Vs. BSS Vs. Kurt Laramee will be able to headline the supreme challenge!

I wouldn't try that! This a comedy match, not a "losers that can't get a push" match! :D

[BuddyGarner]

What stats are comedy matches primarily going to be based on?

How is this going to be different than say a low intensity, low danger product, with a key feature of comedy? I guess in feds that have high amounts of intensity and danger and you want to say hey, lower the intensity and danger of the match and grade it more on charisma, star quality, and popularity.

Also, this really needs to tie in to the AI using non-wrestlers as wrestlers occassionally. As non-wrestlers would be one of the primary benefits of comedy matches(to reduce the crowd crapping all over non-wrestlers).

[Self]

What stats are comedy matches primarily going to be based on?

How is this going to be different than say a low intensity, low danger product, with a key feature of comedy? I guess in feds that have high amounts of intensity and danger and you want to say hey, lower the intensity and danger of the match and grade it more on charisma, star quality, and popularity.

I would figure they're balanced the exact same way as 'Eye Candy' matches, but instead of Sex Appeal they use Charisma, and instead of being effected by the Risque element in your product, they'll use Comedy. Just a wild theory.

Again, Dirt Sheet will reveal all, I expect.

[Phantom Stranger]

How is this going to be different than say a low intensity, low danger product, with a key feature of comedy?

This is like asking 'How are hardcore deathmatches different than a high intensity, high danger product with a key feature of cult?'.

It's not different. It's an addition to help simulate that kind of promotion.

Look at CHIKARA - for all its presentation, there are comedy CHIKARA matches and there are serious CHIKARA matches. Some of these will be standard, but now some can be comedy.

[Karl_Kitsch]

Comedy matches are going to be great for USPW and WLW, too. Happy Elwood is begging to be a comedy superstar and I always pictured WLW as having a little bit of Osaka Pro in it's DNA. Hell, Lucha Libre even has comedy matches, so maybe one of the Mexican promotions will start using comedy to gain an advantage...

[Historian]

While I probably will not use comedy matches all that frequently, it's nice to have them in the game. For instance, if I was playing a real world-mod, Comedy matches would be great for Santino...

My C-Verse based games probably won't lend themselves to using comedy matches, but who knows... Maybe now that they are there, I'll use them every now and then.

[dvdWarrior]

Comedy Matches - Great feature. Comedy matches aren't my thing, and I doubt my promotion would ever use them, but still it's great to have the option, and it's a definite plus for other, more comedy-based promotions.

Sneaking Written Deals and Booking Skill & Reputation - Two really brilliant features here. Between the two of them, I'll be able to create my promotion, as well as quite a few of my characters, perfectly as I've envisioned them, and I can't wait for that. These are two more of my favorite new features.

Good to see Sick Bumps making their return to the series as well. Throw in the ability to edit the User Character's previous title history, and TEW2010 just might be reasonably close to perfect.

[crayon]

It's a bit delayed, but I'd just like to say that I hope Narratives allow you to set a narrative which isn't directly linked to something happening in the gameworld.. just on the off-chance that what I consider noteworthy isn't something that can tied to it (assuming it works like that), or maybe if I just want to add some backstory to the era etc

[sebsplex]

Comedy Matches :)

Whilst I probably won't book too many myself, there's a certain promotion in the GDS-Verse that's going to benefit from this option as well as I imagine will CHIKARA in real-world mods... and maybe even the WWE. Lords knows I can't wait to book another fake Donald Trump match on RAW!

[Ping von Erich]

USPW, BSC, EWA and SWF all just got a little more fun to play.

Comedy matches = win.

[Wrestling Century]

USPW, BSC, EWA and SWF all just got a little more fun to play.

Comedy matches = win.

Do not forget WLW! :p

[EricAdams]

Name three ROH workers who are signed to written deals right now. G'head, I'll wait. *cue Jeopardy theme*


I know I'm way late on this but just so you know, Tyler Black, the Briscoes, Davey Richards and Erick Stevens are all signed. Dragon and Nigel were but didn't renew. The more you know.

Sick bumps and comedy matches are great. Comedy especially cause I always though a CHIKARA-ish fed in the C-Verse would be fun to book.

[sprinklefurball]

I wonder if it would be possible to make a comedy match with importance any higher than very low.

[The Celt]

I'm not sure that Davey Richards in signed to ROH, I only know that he turned down WWE twice according to himself.

[Regis]

I wonder if it would be possible to make a comedy match with importance any higher than very low.

I'm not sure about ones based on reality, but in a Comedy fed you could have a comedy match with a higher importance. Y'know, you've got your big star, they have their ridiculous signature match, the fans love it and it's more awesome than any other comedy match just because it's got pedigree, that sort of thing.

[crayon]

Invisible Hand Grenade / Blowup Doll Canadian Destroyer Match definitely smells like major importance to me :)

[Phantom Stranger]

I know I'm way late on this but just so you know, Tyler Black, the Briscoes, Davey Richards and Erick Stevens are all signed. Dragon and Nigel were but didn't renew. The more you know.

Sick bumps and comedy matches are great. Comedy especially cause I always though a CHIKARA-ish fed in the C-Verse would be fun to book.

Considering Davey works for every other Indy I can think of, that's not a written in TEW terms.

[Comradebot]

So...

I wonder if we'll be able to have comedy matches that end with sick bumps?

[foolinc]

I know I'm way late on this but just so you know, Tyler Black, the Briscoes, Davey Richards and Erick Stevens are all signed. Dragon and Nigel were but didn't renew. The more you know.

Sick bumps and comedy matches are great. Comedy especially cause I always though a CHIKARA-ish fed in the C-Verse would be fun to book.

That promotion you are looking for is called Rapid Pro Wrestling.

[Remianen]

Don't blame the features, blame the mod makers who don't understand the features and misuse them.

Bingo.

I know I'm way late on this but just so you know, Tyler Black, the Briscoes, Davey Richards and Erick Stevens are all signed. Dragon and Nigel were but didn't renew. The more you know.

Might wanna read the thread further. None of those workers were exclusive to ROH during their deals. Not.a.single.one. 'Written deal' is 'exclusive. You only work for us'.

I'd say Comedy matches will come in handy on occasion for any promotion with Comedy at Medium or higher. It's a change of pace kinda thing.

[djthefunkchris]

I'd say Comedy matches will come in handy on occasion for any promotion with Comedy at Medium or higher. It's a change of pace kinda thing.

It's specifically for my Midget Wrestling promotions and divisions.;)

[The Chosen One]

AWESOME! One of my suggestions... the entertainment based match... makes it into the game.

Personally, I'm probably gonna end creating my own match with that match style though as my original thought, was to conceive a match style that was basically "WORK THE CROWD" with the volume turned all the way up... in other words maybe the wrestling itself would be crap, but the story being told in the ring would be fantastic, therefore Entertainment skills would be used more than anything else...

Some point over the course of the thread it became about Comedy matches being added to the next game

[sitebender]

I can't wait for the new game. In my TEW2K8 it is 2025 and I've been unemployed for 10 years. I would start a new game, and I have started a new game, but I always feel like I've played through it before, so what's the point. Then I go back to the game that keeps going...

[Scorpio3060]

21CW, CGC and SWF will all benefit from comedy matches. It should also breathe new life into several under used "wrestlers".

[D16NJD16]

Adam referenced comedy matches being added the 7th match style. What are the other 6th? Anyone know?

[Phantom Stranger]

Adam referenced comedy matches being added the 7th match style. What are the other 6th? Anyone know?

Regular, Brawling, Hardcore, Technical, High Spots, and... something?

[Vladamire Dracos]

Can't wait to recreate the Resthold Battle Royal and Musical Chairs Deathmatch that NWWA/Doa Pro Wrestling had on their 75 hour show. :)

D1, the other match types from TEW08 are: Regular, Brawl, High Spot, Tech, Hardcore, and Eye Candy.

[Nedew]

Regular, Brawling, Hardcore, Technical, High Spots, and... something?

Eye Candy?

[Thystone]

Eye candy as in- girls wrestling in pudding for no particular reason, aside from being half-naked in pudding.

Has Pureso (sp?) ever been used as a match type? I thought I'd seen it as some stage, but apparently not

[Adam Ryland]

Has Pureso (sp?) ever been used as a match type? I thought I'd seen it as some stage, but apparently not

Puro matches are down to the competitors not the specific type of match, so there's no need for it to have its own category.

[Gigas]

The smart auto push is nice for those of us that like to start our own small feds.

[Donners]

Don't blame the features, blame the mod makers who don't understand the features and misuse them.

Oh I do, absolutely. I often cite comparisons to the default data to try to explain the problems with a mod. All to no avail, unfortunately.

The smart auto push is nice for those of us that like to start our own small feds.

Actually, I get the impression that it is there to inform the AI's signing policies, rather than to help the user's fed.

[1PWfan]

I love this feature. I play a lot of small companies, and it irritates me no end that I can't actually make new stars since I only run a few regions. With this, I can finally get guys like Bradford Peverell and Nicky Champion to main event NYCW shows.

[James Casey]

Agreed. And assuming that this ties into predator hiring, you might have NYCW stealing your midcarder to main event for them because he's only a step above a bum in Cali, but three steps above in NY.

I'd be interested to know if this affects the player auto-push - or is it already taken into account with player feds?

[UkWrestleFan]

Regarding the 'Comedy Match' feature, is it likely that workers will now have some additional stats that may give us an extra piece of information on a wrestlers top line for 'Comedy' or something similar?

[sheepy]

Hopefully this'll also come into affect with the advance booking feature. It always gets me when I have a small promotion and book a home made star in a match.

Eg, playing as PSW I pushed Lead Belly to C- pop in tri state but he was still only at E+ throughout the rest of America. Advanced booking him give an E+ but advance booking Tank Bradley gives a D- because despite me jobbing his ass he's got that pop over the rest of the USA which I haven't yet got my hands on to destroy. Hopefully this new feature will also take the 5% calculation into account.

[Apupunchau@optonline]

This is it. This is the feature that has finally pushed me over the edge. I was always going to buy the game, because invariably the new editions just get better and better. But the Smart Push for regional feds (because I usually play small feds) is by far my favorite addition to the game thus far.

[Hive]

This is it. This is the feature that has finally pushed me over the edge. I was always going to buy the game, because invariably the new editions just get better and better. But the Smart Push for regional feds (because I usually play small feds) is by far my favorite addition to the game thus far.

While I don't play those feds myself, it has been bugging me and I think this is an awesome addition as well. Good job.

[praguepride]

Interesting, awesome feature but I wonder if it can't be expanded upon even more.

I wonder if maybe it should be weighted by promotion popularity first and foremost.

For example, if you're 50% of in Region A, 25% over in Region B, and 10% over in the rest of the US, from what I read it will still just average them all together.

BUT shouldn't it weight Region A a bit heavier because that's where the promotion is heavier while the rest of the US which just barely makes that 5% should barely be a blip on the radar.

/shrug. Either way, it's definitely a step in the right direction. I love playing local feds and the auto-pusher would irritate me because the stars I'd built up from F- -> E popularity in my region would still be pushed beneath people with a flat F, F+ or E- across the board. It meant that non-local workers would almost always be underpushed when in fact they were the stars of my show :D

[The Celt]

Praise Jehovah, we finally have smark auto push. Time to dance all night long.

[scorpion]

just got caught up on several entries.

"Sticky auto push" my favorite addition so far and corrects my biggest annoyance with TEW over the years

"Sick bumps" not a fan, but as its said, then i don't have to use them. Hopefully like all facets of the game they will be greatly improved over the EWR version which was basically a cheap way to bump your match ratings.

[Self]

Interesting, awesome feature but I wonder if it can't be expanded upon even more.

I wonder if maybe it should be weighted by promotion popularity first and foremost.

For example, if you're 50% of in Region A, 25% over in Region B, and 10% over in the rest of the US, from what I read it will still just average them all together.

BUT shouldn't it weight Region A a bit heavier because that's where the promotion is heavier while the rest of the US which just barely makes that 5% should barely be a blip on the radar.

But why would you in that situation? Why would you have 50% popularity in one region, and 10% in all the others in the US? The only time I can think of is at Cult (is 50% in one region enough to hit cult?) when you're trying to build towards a National audience. In which case, wrestlers who are popular all across the US are FAR more important than dudes who are stars in just one area.

This sounds like a perfectly good solution. I never give too much credence to 'push', but for those who do, this should do the job.

[doctorjones]

I really like the smart auto push feature for my C-Verse 75 games! I always do pushes manually in '75, because there are always regional stars that are not very over nationally. Examples being Alasi Tua in my WIW game, who is C- over in Hawaii, but gets pushed to Midcarder because of his national overness. Or Johnny Buy Tucker in mt AAFW game, who's B over in South East, but pushed as a Midcarder because of his national popularity.

Overall, I will appreciate this feature for the time it's going to save me.

[Apupunchau@optonline]

Here's a bizarre example of why this will be useful for me. I have a starter fed I hired only guys with F- overness in the US one of the guys that always gets hired is Mark Smart who although he's F- in most places has an F+ in two regions I never work in. After a year I have Cal Sanders, Thomas Morgan, Stretch the Chicken Boy and My User Character all up to D- in my home region but they are still F- all over the US. Now Mark Smart is up to E in my home region but because he's F+ in two other regions, technically he's more over across the board then the four other workers are and he always pushes as a Main Eventer. Now since his F+ in two regions I don't have any overness in won't be counted as heavily maybe my real Main Eventers can all be pushed as Main Eventers.

This will also help me with CZCW when I have Frankie Perez three grades higher than Donnie J in 2 regions that I work in but he still only pushes as a Upper Midcarder because all the other guys are have better US overness across the board.

Color me super duper excited.

[Self]

It'll help for my BSC game. I hire AAA girls as occasional jobbers but they get auto-pushed higher than my BSC regulars who are far more over in the South West (the only place I run). Not that the auto-push matters too much. It calls Britney Hollywood a Midcarder, but I book her like a Main Eventer regardless. It calls Golden Delicious a Main Eventer, but she's still lucky to get booked to do a job, so to me it's a purely cosmetic feature... but a damned fine one.

EDIT: I fully expect the Dirt Sheet to make a fool of me for this way of thinking.

[Remianen]

EDIT: I fully expect the Dirt Sheet to make a fool of me for this way of thinking.

*nod*

And I can't see how anyone would actually want 'additional stats' when the ones we already have aren't understood, in large part. The existing stats work fine for defining who works best in a comedy match. You don't need a 'comedy' stat for that. If that's the case, let's add a 'sick bump' stat too.

The existing stat framework will speak to you and tell you who does well in a comedy match. Do you really need Whippy, Chris Morrisette, Jumbo Jackson, et al to have a specific stat to tell you they have the skillset matrix to pull off a comedy match?

[praguepride]

Who suggested that we need a comedy stat? I thought it'd be pretty obvious it's the Entertainment skills bundled together....

[BurningHamster]

Who suggested that we need a comedy stat? I thought it'd be pretty obvious it's the Entertainment skills bundled together....

Hmm, which to me is a little problematic unless it maybe also takes into account (heavily) the comedy performance aspect. I am against new stats but, to give real world examples, guys like Stone Cold would have very high entertainment stats but would not really be considered as good comedy workers. On the other hand someone like Ebessan/Ebetaro/Kikutaro/whatever he calls himself these days also should have good entertainment stats (but not as good as Austin) but is the master of the modern comedy match and has pretty much made his career based on comedy.

Similar with midget workers of the past, most were not known for being super charismatic but the way they wrestled was a comedy-oriented style. A modern example is Colt Cabana who freely admits to watching old midget matches in order to lift comedy spots he can use in his own matches.

Also I am a little unsure of how the rating system with comedy being set as part of the product will work now I think about it a bit. Mainly because I am still hoping for bit of an overhaul of product as I never seem to be able to narrow it down to be the exact product I want.

[Wrestling Century]

It looks like we can simulate the old territorial days a little bit better!

[eayragt]

I think people are missing the main gain in this feature. It makes managing a Regional fed's roster easier, but the real impact is on AI rosters. I know I already re-push "regional" stars, but now the AI will do the same, which will allow home-grown stars to be pushed appropriately in regional feds, even if the AI brings in some wrestlers who are known across the country (but not so much in the home region). This should allow the AI to develop their own stars better.

[praguepride]

See, I'd disagree that there's a comedy skill, it's part of the entertainment package.

If you take a serious look at the "comedy" in wrestling, there's very very little "original" work. Most of it is age old bits that have been repackaged into a wrestling feel. You can catch most "comedy spots" from a Three Stooges marathon :D

BUT we still find them funny because of the charisma & acting of the workers involved.

I remember people talking about the Rock's "pie" sketch. It really wasn't that funny if you just wrote it down.

"You like pie? Or maybe you like strudle?" :rolleyes:

But the Rock's charisma sold it far better then one could possibly have imagined. And I'd disagree that Stone Cold would've been a bad comedy worker, he just never had the opportunity. His push wasn't comedic but what about his earlier work in WCW?

I'd say Charisma & acting = comedy in the wrestling world and is a best approximation in the C-verse. I'd say most comedic bits are pre-written via road agents, bookers, and writers, so the wrestler needs to be able to "sell it" to the crowd.

[randomfreeze]

Haven't said just "cool feature" in here yet, but regarding smart auto push...cool feature.

[BurningHamster]

See, I'd disagree that there's a comedy skill, it's part of the entertainment package.

If you take a serious look at the "comedy" in wrestling, there's very very little "original" work. Most of it is age old bits that have been repackaged into a wrestling feel. You can catch most "comedy spots" from a Three Stooges marathon :D

BUT we still find them funny because of the charisma & acting of the workers involved.

I remember people talking about the Rock's "pie" sketch. It really wasn't that funny if you just wrote it down.

"You like pie? Or maybe you like strudle?" :rolleyes:

But the Rock's charisma sold it far better then one could possibly have imagined. And I'd disagree that Stone Cold would've been a bad comedy worker, he just never had the opportunity. His push wasn't comedic but what about his earlier work in WCW?

I'd say Charisma & acting = comedy in the wrestling world and is a best approximation in the C-verse. I'd say most comedic bits are pre-written via road agents, bookers, and writers, so the wrestler needs to be able to "sell it" to the crowd.

I'm not saying someone like Stone Cold can't be funny, but I guess push and gimmick does to a degree factor into how comedy matches work.

Thing is, sketches are not comedy matches. Comedy matches are, I agree, largely dependent upon acting and charisma as they are based largely on physical comedy but that does not mean everyone who is good at acting and charisma can work a good comedy match. I don't think there is necessarily the need for a specific "comedy" stat but if there was a way for the comedy performance stat to somehow be worked into how well a worker performs in a comedy match that would in my mind probably be the closest approximation.

I really don't think road agents/writers/bookers have much role to play in putting together a comedy match as all the best comedy workers are generally in the indies putting their own matches together.

[Kainlock]

Stone Cold was hilarious when he was with Angle and Vince. That stuff was golden.

Plus remember the first few times fo "What".

[Derek B]

For anyone who cares, the smart autopush feature is one of my personal favourites. I've been angling for it for aaaages since I tend to start a lot of small games and the regular autopush has always been rubbish for that. This feature is great for territorial style datasets but ultimately, can be used for any small promtion in the history of ever. Which makes me exceptionally happy. :D