The Official TNA Discussion Thread

[The Final Countdown]

Yeah, let's try to steer this back on topic...

I haven't seen the PPV, but I have been thoroughly unimpressed with Flair in TNA so far. He just seems like he's completely disinterested in everything that's going on, and if that holds true, I have major concerns about his apparent involvement with AJ.

While I'm at it: I know plenty have said it already, but Sean Morley beating Christopher Daniels is just an atrocious decision as far as I'm concerned.

[PeterHilton]

I haven't seen the PPV, but I have been thoroughly unimpressed with Flair in TNA so far. He just seems like he's completely disinterested in everything that's going on, and if that holds true, I have major concerns about his apparent involvement with AJ.



He was actually pretty good during the swerve.

[Self]

Glanced at the Impact spoilers. Saw there was no MCMG or Generation Me... or any relevant X-division stuff. Gave up on TNA. Maybe I'll give it another go in a few months time once the Hogan/Bischoff era has settled into it's stride.

EDIT: Apparently they're shooting 4 Impacts over 3 nights, so it's possible they'll tape some stuff I'll be interested in on the other nights. Also heard of a Generation Me & Amazing Red vs MCMG & Brian Kendrick match... which sounds like fun.

[Condors]

I am going to watch impact but it may be the last one for a while. I was enjoying tna prior to hogan joining. I was looking forward to hogan not wrestling. I like watching MCMG, beer money, team 3d, I like matt morgan, hernandez, samoa joe, kurt angle. I can be entertained by a mick foley or kevin nash interview. I want more raven! I will probally watch the "Orlando Screwjob" 5 times on dvr in suspended belief, as nobody in TNA can be that stupid.

[dvdWarrior]

Found this on YouTube if ya'll haven't seen it. I think it's at least a little interesting. Wrestling with a studio audience...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jAIe58DveY

My apologies if this is old news...

:o

[brashleyholland]

Found this on YouTube if ya'll haven't seen it. I think it's at least a little interesting. Wrestling with a studio audience...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jAIe58DveY

My apologies if this is old news...

:o

Ok, I understand the no swearing, no gang signs etc. I said in a previous post that it's essential that they have control of their product and don't have 'smart' fans spoiling the flow of things intentionally. I still stand by that.

...BUT...after watching that video, it seems like they were trying to say that the fans had a specific role, that being to "help tell a story". This I don't agree with.

It's the performers job to get people to like/loath them. If people genuinly aren't doing it, then it's the performers who are to blame for not being good enough at what they do.

I can absolutly understand them not wanting fans to chant "You're on drugs" to Jeff Hardy, or make light of Scott Hall's problems etc. If it isn't part of the story, then it's irrelevent. However, from what that guy said (at least how it came across to me) was that they don't want the crowd chanting "boring" or "we want wrestling" etc during taping.

If that is the case, then whats the point? Isn't the yardstick for how good something is how well it goes over with the crowd? How are TNA supposed to know what is going down well if they are coercing the crowd into desired responses? I can only assume that they don't care.

TNA Staffer 1: Hmm, people keep chanting boring in this guy's matches. The crowd really doesn't like him and he sucks the atmosphere out of the building. We should probably think about taking him off TV for a while or dropping him altogether.

TNA Staffer 2: Nah, we'll just tell the fans not to chant boring during his matches and to cheer him instead. They have to help us tell the story and he *is* supposed to be the good guy after all. If they don't like it they can leave, it's not like they're paying.

It's certainly a novel way of getting a desired response out of a crowd.

[BHK1978]

This is the same thing that they used to do in WCW when it filmed at Disney. They told you who and when to cheer.

[SaySo]

Is Time Warner or whatever it is called running TNA now?

[Hyde Hill]

I am going to watch impact but it may be the last one for a while. I was enjoying tna prior to hogan joining. I was looking forward to hogan not wrestling. I like watching MCMG, beer money, team 3d, I like matt morgan, hernandez, samoa joe, kurt angle. I can be entertained by a mick foley or kevin nash interview. I want more raven! I will probally watch the "Orlando Screwjob" 5 times on dvr in suspended belief, as nobody in TNA can be that stupid.

On a side note it is funny that they are calling it that as TNA has already previously used that monniker for a Jarrett win in their early Orlando stages.

[Basmat01]

Yer well thats what you get then you have a sound stage that can only fit 1000 people in it your gunna hear all the little chants and stuff

Most of the chants only sound like 10 people are chanting them anyways

[brashleyholland]

This is the same thing that they used to do in WCW when it filmed at Disney. They told you who and when to cheer.

Thats the kind of thing that would make me just up and leave. Especially if I hadn't had to pay.

Maybe it's being blown out of proportion though. From the looks of things nobody actually left. The biggest complaints on that video seemed to be some whiny whispers from a couple of teenagers. "Why would you bring your kids!" "This is getting like the WWE!"

I guess you get what you pay for...at the same time I think it entirely removes the point of going to watch a live wrestling show. Maybe they'll get their way and the hardcore fans will stop attending, allowing them to fill the place with kids who'll cheer when they hold up a sign telling them to do so :-p

[Basmat01]

Did WSX and CCW have fake crowds? Most looked alittle bit TOO good looking to be wrestling fans :p

[Moe Hunter]

WSX had completely fake crowds.

As for having a crowd full of kids - Kiwi Pro Wresling's current show has that - they invite Wellington schools to come along. No adults besides teachers and the occasional parent. Honestly everything sucks about the show except that the actual wrestling is okay. The crowd is definitely the second worst thing about it, the first being their pathetic commentary team.

I have no interest in watching any wrestling show that just has an audience of 5-10 year olds. It's really off-putting.

[Nedew]

To lift the mood a little...

I love Angle's face on this :D

http://www.tnawrestling.com/media/k2/galleries/1692/IMG_5329.jpg

[jindr3k]

Anyone know if Genesis is being screened in the UK? The TNA ppvs always got shown on Bravo 2 the wednesday night afterwards but I can't see anything in the listings for the rest of this week !?!?

[Gouge]

Anyone know if Genesis is being screened in the UK? The TNA ppvs always got shown on Bravo 2 the wednesday night afterwards but I can't see anything in the listings for the rest of this week !?!?

I'm not from the UK so I may be wrong on this, but I read something about them being taken off Bravo and put on another station that has far less subscribers. I don't recall the name off the top of my head.

[The Shape]

http://www.wrestling-radio.com/feed_news-14419-Update_on_TNA_PPV's_in_the_UK__Announcement_to_be_ .php is all I can find on it, says it's on something called BT Vision? :confused:

[Nedew]

http://www.wrestling-radio.com/feed_news-14419-Update_on_TNA_PPV's_in_the_UK__Announcement_to_be_ .php is all I can find on it, says it's on something called BT Vision? :confused:

Yeah, it's a bit like BBC's iPlayer, but it's a pay service and is available online/through your telly. I wish they'd just kept it all on Virgin1 :(

[Moe Hunter]

As always I'm behind on my viewing, so I've just seen the 1/14 show.

Generation Me are really talented, but I agree that they look super plain. Not just their build and skin tone, but their faces just don't look like they belong on TV... it's hard to explain. Definitely want to see more matches from them, and the Guns are always awesome.

Daniels is really good on the mic. Very natural. Funny to see how much smaller than Morley he is though. Morley outright sucked in that promo - just had NO substance whatsoever. Without being able to mention specifically the type of movies he makes, not having any direction of actually recruiting any Knockouts to star in them... Just nothing at all. And the stupid sleazey laugh after every half sentence, combined with shots of women in the crowd looking indifferent or *slightly* put off.

Only one minor problem with Daniels delivery, is in his "movie pitch" he refers to Morley as a "fast-talking sleazebag"... Except Daniels talks *way* faster than Morley.

AJ vs Tomko wasn't exactly a good match, and then half of it they spent cutting away to other crap going on. They barely spent any time putting over the match in progess on commentary. Doesn't make much sense for how excited Bischoff was about "having a Main Event".

I really don't like how they have those feud summary packages that just exist outside of any live interviews. We should have had Tomko talking to Borash or Bubba the Lame-o Lovesponge and giving his reasons why he did it. All the Tara vs ODB comments should have had some live actions instead of these random soundbytes played over replay footage.


Tomorrow, on to watching Genesis!

[sebsplex]

Yeah, it's a bit like BBC's iPlayer, but it's a pay service and is available online/through your telly. I wish they'd just kept it all on Virgin1 :(

Yeah, it's all sorts of stupid to have it solely on BT Vision. It's almost like paying someone NOT to show it :p

Hopefully further arrangements are still being considered.

[The Final Countdown]

From the Observer website:

Keep in mind the history of Eric Bischoff and WCW when these stories break....

However, Awesome Kong allegedly attacked Bubba the Love Sponge over his remarks about Haiti last night in Orlando. Kong had done a fund raising effort over the weekend for earthquake victims.
Kong was then sent home by the promotion.

This morning on Bubba's show, Hulk Hogan was guest and Hogan brought up how Kong "beat the hell" out of Bubba last night. Bubba said he didn't want to talk about it, but then did talk about it, describing it as a "sucker punch."

I really hope this is true. That guy is in serious need of a good pounding. (and I'm not saying that because of his Haiti comments; we don't need to get back into that again. The guy is just annoying in general.)

[brashleyholland]

However, Awesome Kong allegedly attacked Bubba the Love Sponge over his remarks about Haiti last night in Orlando. Kong had done a fund raising effort over the weekend for earthquake victims.
Kong was then sent home by the promotion.

This morning on Bubba's show, Hulk Hogan was guest and Hogan brought up how Kong "beat the hell" out of Bubba last night. Bubba said he didn't want to talk about it, but then did talk about it, describing it as a "sucker punch."

There is somthing about knowing that Bubba got his clock cleaned by a 270lb woman which reassures me that there are some things that are still right with the world :)

[PeterHilton]

From the Observer website:



I really hope this is true. That guy is in serious need of a good pounding. (and I'm not saying that because of his Haiti comments; we don't need to get back into that again. The guy is just annoying in general.)

Ewwwwww....this has Russo-rific "work shoot" written all over it..

he takes a true life event and turns it into a storyline that onyl a small part of the viewing audience will understand.

The part that understands knows its fake so they dont care; that part that don't understand end up confused so it all falls flat.

Just like what he tried to do recently with JJ's return and apologizing to Kurt

dammit...

[brashleyholland]

Something funny I just noticed...TNA are still advertising Bobby Lashley for the UK tour, including a Jan 30th event in Laaaandan, when Bobby will be busy grinding out some scrub at Strikeforce: Miami.

'Card Subject To Change' is all well and good, but knowingly advertising a fighter who won't be appearing is a bit of a stretch. If anyone wants a refund after the show, there's your reason! :D

From TNA's official website: http://www.tnawrestling.com/live-events/item/1478-1/30-london-uk

SATURDAY, JANUARY 30: LONDON, ENGLAND
See TNA Wrestling live at the Wembley Arena in London, England, on Saturday, January 23 [TYPO], start time 7:30pm. Appearing live will be Bobby Lashley, Olympic Gold Medalist Kurt Angle and members of the Main Event Mafia, “The Phenomenal” AJ Styles, Team 3D, Suicide, The British Invasion, Awesome Kong, Beer Money, Inc., and more to be announced! Tickets are on sale now at www.gigsandtours.com

[Nedew]

"members of the Main Event Mafia" too. So, that'll be Steiner and... yeah, Steiner :p

[sebsplex]

Ewwwwww....this has Russo-rific "work shoot" written all over it..

he takes a true life event and turns it into a storyline that onyl a small part of the viewing audience will understand.

The part that understands knows its fake so they dont care; that part that don't understand end up confused so it all falls flat.

Just like what he tried to do recently with JJ's return and apologizing to Kurt

dammit...

It smells of a Russo work-shoot... will it have any sort of point or pay-off? Who knows.

[Remianen]

Putting this here just in case....

Heh, I'm Haitian myself. Just that I've always expected people here and there to not care and I was even surprised to an extent so many people are willing to come together and actually look at the situation. Got me grateful to say the least. In some parts at this point, some medias try to make a quick buck by putting disheartening clips and photos on the front page, but either way that I guess that gets people helpin out.

The simple thing is, if you're not gonna care, don't proclaim it at... this time. I thought that was common sense, and he should expect any beatdown to come his way lol. The problem about people who like to speak their mind is they don't put no consideration into the aftermath, what may come out of it and how people can react. There's even tact ways of saying you wouldn't wanna help the country. I've read such through other forums and I've come to acceptance.

Voodoo? lol...

I saw this exact same thing for Katrina. In fact, I SAID some borderline offensive things to family members, once they got up here. This one is no different. I was born & raised in Brooklyn, NY. I've got tons of Haitian friends. It's one thing to say something to friends or in the company of people who know you're helping and not just trying to stir up stuff. A Rush Limbaugh or Glenn Beck can say something because only their audience or fanbases actually care what they think (so most folks don't even hear it). But Bubba's in a bad position in that he's on national television now and has to work with people outside of his little bubble. Thus when he says something offensive (to some), he has to be willing to face the music (or guard his grill, as the case may be :p).

Kia's a big sweetie but everyone has their limits. *shrug*

[dcxbox]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTd--qhRZ-s

he has a point thought. this is a free show, its not an outside of the impact zone show. this is a tv show in a sound stage in a theme park.

[SaySo]

Source: NoDQ.com


A fan that regularly attends the TNA Impact tapings sent out this message:

Hey guys. I'm one of the hardcore TNA fans who you see regularly on iMPACT! and TNA PPV. You probably recognize me as the guy who wears a shirt and tie to the shows.

I've seen a lot of posts claiming that the biggest thing wrong with TNA right now is us, the loyal fans in the iMPACT! Zone.

I'd like to give you a little perspective on things. There is a group of about 12-20 of us who are at every show we can attend (Collectively known as the "Crucial Crew", which is why you see us throw up the 'c' hand signal). And we DO NOT like the direction this company is going. Therefore, we express our displeasure in hopes that management will listen. Why? Because we LOVE TNA, and will not stand idly by while it gets raped by Hogan and his boys. If we were season ticket holders for a sports team, this would be expected, would it not?

Last night at Genesis was a major event in the growing war between the TNA loyalists and the Hoganites. I can tell you that very real battle lines are being drawn within the organization, and the conflict will get a lot worse.

Again, we LOVE TNA. So when a man who built his career and reputation on WWF Sports Entertainment comes in, changes the things that make TNA unique and basically tells us that the TNA model is broken and that "the smart marks in the front" (read Hogan's IGN interview) don't matter, aren't representative of mainstream America and so should be ignored- Yeah, we're gonna be pissed.

Last night was remarkable in that for the first time ever a TNA producer came down into the pit where we stand, grabbed my friend by the shirt and actually threatened to ban us from the building if we didn't stop with the "vulgarity and the negativity". From reports, this heat came directly from "Dixie and Terry who were pissed that we didn't put Morely over during his match with Daniels. Are you kidding? This happened during the Pope v Wolfe match, and totally killed the crowd. If you were wondering why the crowd was so dead during what was a great wrestling match, that's why.

Here's the thing though... We've become friends with a lot of the wrestlers, and they all love our energy, enthusiasm and passion, and have and continue to support us. The production crew, who takes heat directly from the top, HATE us, most likely because they are all afraid for their jobs.

Also, all of the Bubba Army idiots and other Hogan marks are now in the iMPACT! Zone and act like the complete tools they are. Oh, but THEY don't get scolded like 5-year olds, even though they are the most offensive people there.

I saw hundreds of people walk out on the show last night, something i've NEVER seen at a PPV. Things are getting weird. Hopefully, Bischoff and Russo are smart enough to use this tension to create compelling TV, but from my perspective, it seems like TNA is dying right before my eyes.

Want some compelling TV? Wait until the entire pit revolts and empties into the ring on live TV. The way things are going, this is not altogether inconceivable.

Rest assured, the Crucial Crew will fight to the end for the TNA we know and love!

[brashleyholland]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xbx2dq_tna-director-of-production-steve-sm_webcam

he has a point thought. this is a free show, its not an outside of the impact zone show. this is a tv show in a sound stage in a theme park.

Thats great, if it is being used to irradicate bad language or fans intentionally disrupting the flow of the show with 'insider' chants etc.

But if they are telling fans they cannot boo something that they don't like...how does that benefit them in the long run?

You judge a performer and their performance on how well it goes over with the crowd...if the crowd isn't allowed to say 'This sucks', where is the impetus to change it?

Take Morley for example. They're pushing him as a good guy, but people don't like him as a good guy and think he is performing poorly. However, they are told to cheer him because he is a good guy. Does that mean we're stuck watching him until they decide otherwise?

If thats how they want it, fine. They might as well go the whole hog and have production staff with 'CHEER' and 'JEER' signs held up. It's very hypocritical to profess that you are 'giving the fans what they want' while telling them how to behave at your TV tapings.

[Hyde Hill]

On the video he sounds more reasonable then the excerpts have made it sound. I get the whole no cursing etc part and that is not a problem and the help tell the story is understandable but you just can't tell a crowd who to like or dislike or what to say or not to say. Having said that sometimes the Impact crowd really ads to the show but they sometimes detract from it as well, but in all I liked the greater interaction feel it had/has instead of the generic WWE stuff.

Wonder what they will do once they become a paying crowd though (,if ever,) as then TNA has no/less right to instruct them.

Edit: Agree with the post above me. Was typed at the same time. And wonder if the Crucial crew statement is legit, seems so though.

[alden]

Seams a little smarkish to me to be honest. I have very strong fellings of people thinking they are adding more to a show then they are. There is nothing wrong with fans getting into the show. But for a group of people to say hey we are helping the show by doing this and that and they have no right to tell us what to do gets to me a little. Tna is trying to get bigger. for that to happen they need to produce a more "fammily friendly" type of program. The comment of why would you bring your kids here is stupid. They are in a fammily ammusment park. Yah, why would a kid be in a enviorment like that?

[PeterHilton]

Seams a little smarkish to me to be honest. I have very strong fellings of people thinking they are adding more to a show then they are. There is nothing wrong with fans getting into the show. But for a group of people to say hey we are helping the show by doing this and that and they have no right to tell us what to do gets to me a little. Tna is trying to get bigger. for that to happen they need to produce a more "fammily friendly" type of program. The comment of why would you bring your kids here is stupid. They are in a fammily ammusment park. Yah, why would a kid be in a enviorment like that?

ECW fans definitely added to their shows.

TNA has made no attempt to "get bigger" by producing "fammily friendly" programming. None. Zero. They are far more risque in both content and character and practically brag about the fact during their broadcasts.

You're entirely off the mark there. Entirely.

[PeterHilton]

Source: NoDQ.com

Again, we LOVE TNA. So when a man who built his career and reputation on WWF Sports Entertainment comes in, changes the things that make TNA unique and basically tells us that the TNA model is broken and that "the smart marks in the front" (read Hogan's IGN interview) don't matter, aren't representative of mainstream America and so should be ignored- Yeah, we're gonna be pissed.



Here's where this guy goes off the rails.

The fans have every right to express their feelings, especially because it does add a lot to the live events.

But *if* TNA's new direction adds viewers and gets them bigger ratings and increases buy rates, then the opinions of those 20 guys really DON'T MATTER.

It's stupid of TNA to deny the fan response. And considering the reactions
to even the smallest of changes so far, they should get used to dealing with a lot more before it's through

(I mean..those spoilers..if that goes down the way it was written..the intrawebs might explode)

[Wade]

I'm crossing my fingers, and hoping that everything we've seen is a work. That Jarrett turns straight face, Hogan/Bischoff heel, and Jarrett fights them off and brings back the TNA that we have come to love.

[jwt13]

I dissagree with you all I think this man has all the rights in the world to do this because the fans are coming in free.

Example: Its like extras on a movie set, if your a extra and they had said that the sene eould be shot at a favrite club of yours and then they change it or change anything on the set you liked your and extra you sit back and mind your bussiness. You dont just stand back and scream at the directer " We want the old set you prick" or somthing like that because you dont matter your an extra.

Example 2: Its like if you have a team you really like lets say the Jets they fire their coach and hire the patriots coach who you hate and dont like the way that he's running the team so you and a group of buddies go to their practice field and sit in the front row and just start jeering him on I'm preety sure they would not let that happen and you would probley get kicked out and still what you did didn't change a thing.

[sheepy]

I loved Sting vs. Abyss with Sting having some sort of control over Abyss. I loved the Angle Alliance vs. The Christian Coallition. I loved the random attacks on Joe and then Jarrett's return. I loved most of the Main Event Mafia. I loved Big Poppa Petey. I loved the Dudleys being pushed as main event faces in a PPV main event. I loved VKM. I loved AJ Styles. I hated Curry Man. I loved TBP (especially Velvet). I loved their feud with Roxy. I loved the undefeated Samoan Submission Machine. I loved the undefeated Christian Cage. I loved Mick Foley vs. Jarrett. I loved the six sided ring. I loved Jim Cornette. I loved the Ultimate X. I loved the X-Division World Cup. I loved Matt Morgan's slow introduction and then promos about being the genetically jacked, athletically stacked next big thing. I loved Jay Machismo (especially his feud with Dutt).

I just don't think I can get into this new TNA :( I respect Bischoff and wish he was back in WWE with a say in the creative direction and booking of one of the brands but him and Hogan back in control just doesn't offer the chance of seeing something new. TNA felt like something new, whereas I can't see this new TNA being anything more than a WCW mark 2.

I was hoping TNA would push on to become something more than a clone.

[brashleyholland]

I dissagree with you all I think this man has all the rights in the world to do this because the fans are coming in free.

Example: Its like extras on a movie set, if your a extra and they had said that the sene eould be shot at a favrite club of yours and then they change it or change anything on the set you liked your and extra you sit back and mind your bussiness. You dont just stand back and scream at the directer " We want the old set you prick" or somthing like that because you dont matter your an extra.

Extra's get paid. There are also there to work, not enjoy something.

Example 2: Its like if you have a team you really like lets say the Jets they fire their coach and hire the patriots coach who you hate and dont like the way that he's running the team so you and a group of buddies go to their practice field and sit in the front row and just start jeering him on I'm preety sure they would not let that happen and you would probley get kicked out and still what you did didn't change a thing.


This happens all the time, in all sports.

[PeterHilton]

I'm crossing my fingers, and hoping that everything we've seen is a work. That Jarrett turns straight face, Hogan/Bischoff heel, and Jarrett fights them off and brings back the TNA that we have come to love.

LOL....:p

yeah, no, that's not happening.

[brashleyholland]

I'd like to give you a little perspective on things. There is a group of about 12-20 of us who are at every show we can attend (Collectively known as the "Crucial Crew", which is why you see us throw up the 'c' hand signal). And we DO NOT like the direction this company is going.


Here's where the guy kills it for me. 12-20 of them. The DO NOT like the way the company is going. Geez, how would TNA survive without them?


I saw hundreds of people walk out on the show last night, something i've NEVER seen at a PPV.

If TNA only gets a top end of 2000 people in the building, wouldn't we have noticed these 'hundreds of people' walking out? Wouldn't someone have mentioned this before now?


Want some compelling TV? Wait until the entire pit revolts and empties into the ring on live TV. The way things are going, this is not altogether inconceivable.

Again, what, all 20 of them? What do they plan on doing when they get in the ring, aside from getting thrown out an banned from the venue?

If this in indeed legit, he just comes accross like a petulent kid who's resisting change just because. I know the ECW crowd added alot to their shows, but they aren't the ECW crowd and this certainly isn't ECW.

[PeterHilton]

I dissagree with you all I think this man has all the rights in the world to do this because the fans are coming in free.

Example: Its like extras on a movie set, if your a extra and they had said that the sene eould be shot at a favrite club of yours and then they change it or change anything on the set you liked your and extra you sit back and mind your bussiness. You dont just stand back and scream at the directer " We want the old set you prick" or somthing like that because you dont matter your an extra.

Example 2: Its like if you have a team you really like lets say the Jets they fire their coach and hire the patriots coach who you hate and dont like the way that he's running the team so you and a group of buddies go to their practice field and sit in the front row and just start jeering him on I'm preety sure they would not let that happen and you would probley get kicked out and still what you did didn't change a thing.

Terrible. Just terrible. Have you ever been to a sporting event?

And you have MORE rights if you DON'T pay?? :rolleyes:

[Hyde Hill]

Here's where the guy kills it for me. 12-20 of them. The DO NOT like the way the company is going. Geez, how would TNA survive without them?

If TNA only gets a top end of 2000 people in the building, wouldn't we have noticed these 'hundreds of people' walking out? Wouldn't someone have mentioned this before now?

Again, what, all 20 of them? What do they plan on doing when they get in the ring, aside from getting thrown out an banned from the venue?

If this in indeed legit, he just comes accross like a petulent kid who's resisting change just because. I know the ECW crowd added alot to their shows, but they aren't the ECW crowd and this certainly isn't ECW.

And he misquoted Hogan on the IGN interview as I reread it after this came up. He just said smart marks in general only constitute a certain percentage of the crowd he wasn't specifically referring to them but more to the internet wrestling board smarks and in that I have to agree with Hogan.

Maybe those hundreds walked out during the Impact taping and he was misquoted that would seem more realistic given the spoilers.

PS I consider us guys here "educated smart marks" and that is another category.

[lazorbeak]

Just watched Genesis and wanted to weigh in on some of this stuff:

First, Angle vs. AJ was great, no two ways about it. I didn't watch their Impact match, and I can see people getting tired of the constant finisher back and forth it turned into, but good slow build and a dramatic finish. I don't even mind the turn, even though I think it's a dumb move.

That said, this is the definition of a one match pay per view. Nearly every other match varied between garbage and forgettable, with the highlight being the Pope/Wolfe match that the crowd was absolutely dead for. Actually Red vs. Kendrick was pretty decent, too. I don't really have anything to say about those two matches.

But as for the rest of the card! Daniels is a phenomenal worker, and it's a shame he's so small that in the big leagues he'd never do better than Jamie Noble, because he is too good for TNA. This was really the first time we ran into horrible booking. Morley is the babyface here? Why? What has he done other than the same terrible mic work he always did except without his catchphrase that got nostalgia pops. Why on earth would the fans cheer this overweight 38 year old who has spent the last decade doing essentially nothing over their own homegrown talent who has been with TNA since roughly forever and is willing to put his body on the line? Why resist the crowd cheering for Daniels? Just turn him babyface you morons. Also Sean: stop using a top rope move if you are too fat and rusty to stand on the turnbuckle. Mediocre match for the bits that Daniels wrestled himself, but Morley looked terrible.

Tara over ODB: what was that all about? Why give ODB the title if you're hot-shotting it right back and making ODB look that weak in the process? I hope this feud is done because these two aren't great in the ring together. Also what was with ODB checking her pulse? I smell a worked shoot where she has blood pressure problems or some other health issue related to drinking. Also she will give birth to a hand. Pretty poor match, let this be the end of it.

Dull match for the tag titles that sticks two of your best homegrown babyface top guys into a midcard title. Hopefully the MCMGs or somebody takes the belt off these guys so they can feud and/or just be singles workers. Why hasn't Matt Morgan already gotten a pay per view title shot?

Beer Money over the Band- you could hear a pin drip when Syxx was in the ring: literally no heat at all. Considering everybody knew the Band was on their way out, they had WAY too much offense.

Speaking of overweight and sloppy, Mr. Anderson looked like he's been storing nuts for the winter in his face. Frankly at this point he looks worse than Hardcore Holly. Maybe that means he's off the juice (oh wait he never took steroids, right?)? Anderson did a decent job on the mic but his match was as bad as most Mr. Kennedy matches generally are, and Abyss didn't look particularly motivated either. Pretty big heat vacuum for this one, too.

Considering Hogan's line about being WRESTLING, it's a little ironic that two overweight WWE midcarders who looked sloppy in the ring were each given singles victories over TNA main-stays. I get that for the audience to care they have to beat somebody, but both guys didn't even bother working their way up the card: they just beat a couple of upper midcarders, one a former champ and the other a guy who was main eventing TNA's pay per view a month ago.

Also considering the roughly 500 guys TNA employs, how does it make any sense to have 4 singles matches and 2 tag matches on PPV? That's 16 guys. Of those, Waltman, Morley, Kendrick, and Anderson haven't been on the roster a month (and one is already gone). That's 1/4 of your in-ring talent. Wolfe and Pope are practically veterans with their whopping FOUR combined pay per view appearances. Also considering the roughly 30 guys that aren't being used maybe you could at least have a video package or a backstage segment or something that tells the viewer "hey these guys are also important"? Is Jeff Hardy under contract? Even if the answer is no, replay the footage from two weeks ago. Where's Homicide, Suicide, Eric Young (even though I think he sucks shouldn't he at least be on TV?), the MCMGs, Team 3D, Rhino, and anyone else that is not on the card but also not a jobber?

What bugs me is that TNA is letting the fact that they are a small market promotion cause them to rely too much on outside talent. You have a pay per view deal and a weekly show, trust your audience enough that the casual fan might actually watch even if they don't see something they recognize from 6 years ago on Raw. Sure Mr. Anderson and even Morley might be better known nationally, but there is a reason neither ever won a world title, and neither looked even close to being main event ready even in TNA. Hernandez and Matt Morgan and Pope look like superstars while Morley and Anderson look like aging midcarders. Start pushing them accordingly, TNA!

On the fans: I hate smarky fans, so I'm biased, but considering I don't think they pay anything to just show up and chant about the various members of the Hogan family, I don't see where the product could possibly be worse if they didn't just disappear. They are only there to fill a seat for a TV taping, and it makes the end product look bad when they feel like they are "owed" something by the wrestlers or the promotion itself. Yes, telling audiences who to cheer and who to boo is lame and I wish TNA's creative wasn't so terrible that they need to do anything like that. But since TNA desperately needs to get out of the impact zone anyway, maybe it's a necessary evil.

[Wade]

LOL....:p

yeah, no, that's not happening.

A man can dream...

On the bright side, I read spoilers for the next two weeks of iMPACT! and.. There's some things that just sound downright stupid, but there are some things that make me think Bischoff isn't a total tool.

[Johnny Fenoli]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTd--qhRZ-s

he has a point thought. this is a free show, its not an outside of the impact zone show. this is a tv show in a sound stage in a theme park.

http://www.cramthis.com/video/166/TNA-Director-of-Production-Steve-Small-tells-the-Impact-Zone

there's another link since the other is down...

[Hyde Hill]

Actually ODB has been toughing out a burst implant the last couple of weeks and that is probably why she was checking her pulse if everything was ok. The thing she threw out of the ring was indeed a filling as to make both breasts the same size and resulted in them possibly shortening the match. And yes I hope this program stops and hope they build up Flash vs Tara.

[brashleyholland]

Actually the second set of Impact spoilers doesn't seem that bad.

[Stennick]

The shows seem to be going downhill from the live episode on. I'm glad its easier to read the spoilers for TNA ahead of time so I don't waste my time trying to watch it when it airs.

[jwt13]

I read the show to and sounds good to me I love the way Hogans taking them on a couple exeptions.

[GDE71]

The 28th show does sound better then the one we get on the 21st.

[TDubTNA]

I def agree the next few shows after the 21st sound pretty good. I am not a huge Hogan fan but I am willing to give him a few months to get things settled and make my decision on whether I want to continue watching wrestling altogether. It does seem to me like the young guys are getting a decent rub as it seems AJ is getting a huge huge push and Morgan, Hernandez, Joe, Dinero and Wolfe are getting pushed rather well. Hopefully the Nasty Boys don't last long as well as Bubba who seems like he is gone anyway which I love

[Hyde Hill]

Actually the second set of Impact spoilers doesn't seem that bad.

Agreed although it will take a lot of work to overcome what they do next thrusday.

Semi - Spoiler (Highlight to read) : Seems they are serious in pushing Jordon. But Jordon beating Burke and then Burke beating AJ next show?? Looks a lot like what they did with Wolf. This type of booking results in zero sum or even negative sum overness longterm.

[tristram]

Ok... I'm a week behind (I think), and am starting to get through Impact when the wifey gives me leave to use the TV!!!

Have only seen the first match of that show, Generation Me versus MCMG. Wow! The "This is awesome" chants should have been echoing around the arena. Only thing counting against Generation Me is physically they are rather bland. They really time in a solarium and at the gym. I like MCMG and obviously now Generation Me, and I have a lot of time for Lethal-Creed, so I'm kind of hoping to see someone out of those teams starting to move up the card. I feel MCMG have been left to stagnate too long, even though they've excelled down the card its time to let them go up the card I feel.

Ok, I've finished the show. Sadly, that start to the show was the highlight, and everything for me went downhill from there.

Points of interest:

* Not overly happy with Lethal Consequences being on the end of a beat down by 3D because they were angry and wanted mic time. I guess, that's just me though because frankly, I like Lethal Consequences, I think both are very talented workers.

* Nasty Boys-Team 3D bash up segment. Nasty Boys had a match down under here in Sydney, which became a hard core tag match, and they sucked at it. Everything sounded soft, nothing sounded legit, and it just looked weak. That segment reminded me of that. Did nothing for Team 3D by associating them with Sags and Knobs. Perhaps putting MCMG or Lethal Consequences with them with the idea of giving the youngsters the rub, with NOTHING more in it for Nasty Boys. I don't actually see their relevance, to me, TNA's tag division kills WWE's currently, it seems a bit old school in that it seems genuine. Not digging the Nasty Boys.

* Someone made a comment that Flair hasn't been good in years on the mic. You know, I think sometimes we miss the point a bit with Flair. Flair has never been a great 'orator', as in someone who annunciates marvelously. Flair has been someone who creates a pop or heat by raw enthusiasm. It's hard for him to do that from commentary, so I guess it's fair to say he's not commentary material. That said, Pope D'Angelo, I liked his work on guest commentary.

* Speaking of commentary, there's a few things here that annoyed me. They are overdoing the repetitive announcement of Hogan/Bischoff, to the point where it almost detracts from the matches. The Tyson Tomko segments... ok, were these supposed to be prerecorded? Because it kinda didn't fit that if he's a 'mystery' man that he's had the time and presence to uncover the mask backstage and talk smack with the production crew to get a video prepared. Even the production video of Tara/ODB, where they openly talk about 'fueds' and 'divas to knockouts' etc, it just sounds sometimes like there's bit of a complex against being the little cousin of WWE.

* I saw really no point in them doing away with Christy Hemme for the 'band' segment, either. I don't think Bubba added anything, and personally, Waltman probably could have played off the female tangent with Christy anyway.

* Glad to say Angelina Love, and, I thought that angle was done well. GOD, how hot is Velvet Sky? What a figure! Hamada and Kong look quite natural, and by association I think Hamada benefits tagging with Kong.

* Tomko-Styles match, was fairly ordinary, comparatively to what Styles-Angle was of course. Tomko didn't look in the best shape either, he looked a bit.. flubby?

* Super Max and Morgan - great wrestlers, Super Max is REALLY impressing me.

* The crowd were not digging it with Morley. I feel for the guy. I don't think he's as out of it as we think. When did he leave the E? 4 years ago, or something? And in his entire time there it seemed to me the IWC always wanted more to be done with Morley. Now he's in TNA, suddenly he's stale? Anyhow, I liked Daniels work in that segment.

* Wolfe-Samoa Joe, good match. I hope that the win by Wolfe is .. 'genuine', in that it keeps him up the card. IE, the match was supposed to make Wolfe look strong, not the beginning of a sluggish run for Joe.

* So is World Elite officially dead? Is it true Bashir willingly left TNA, because it's kinda a pain for the World Elite idea, as he was the basis of many different angles I felt.

* The Hogan-Jarrett backstage confrontation. First things first, wasn't chuffed with Jarrett's comment that 'the young guys aren't worth a dime, he made them relevant' or words to that effect. I understand the need to turn him heel, if that's what they're intending to do, but I don't think he needs to bury talent when I thought the whole idea of the new TNA was to promote the talent. Otherwise, I didn't mind it, and I liked Jarrett flaking out and leaving when Hogan got up, because comparatively Hogan is so much more stronger and it made sense... sorta like the cowardly cheap heel against the big face in a 'well worked' match.

A concern I have also is Jeff Hardy. What's happening there? He's just come basically from the main event of WWE, is a fantastic in ring talent, yet he wasn't even on the show? The guys who appear to be moving up and shaping up to me are Pope and Wolfe, they look... spectacular at the moment. I think they're booking them well, and of course, AJ Styles to me has gone to the next level, and I have been critical of him in the past.

[tristram]

I loved Sting vs. Abyss with Sting having some sort of control over Abyss. I loved the Angle Alliance vs. The Christian Coallition. I loved the random attacks on Joe and then Jarrett's return. I loved most of the Main Event Mafia. I loved Big Poppa Petey. I loved the Dudleys being pushed as main event faces in a PPV main event. I loved VKM. I loved AJ Styles. I hated Curry Man. I loved TBP (especially Velvet). I loved their feud with Roxy. I loved the undefeated Samoan Submission Machine. I loved the undefeated Christian Cage. I loved Mick Foley vs. Jarrett. I loved the six sided ring. I loved Jim Cornette. I loved the Ultimate X. I loved the X-Division World Cup. I loved Matt Morgan's slow introduction and then promos about being the genetically jacked, athletically stacked next big thing. I loved Jay Machismo (especially his feud with Dutt).

I just don't think I can get into this new TNA :( I respect Bischoff and wish he was back in WWE with a say in the creative direction and booking of one of the brands but him and Hogan back in control just doesn't offer the chance of seeing something new. TNA felt like something new, whereas I can't see this new TNA being anything more than a WCW mark 2.

I was hoping TNA would push on to become something more than a clone.

You just reminded me of one of the dumb things about the show I just watched (the 11/1 show). We see Sting in the rafters, with the 'Band' in the ring. Ok... ok... it worked in 1997/98, but it was SO much better back then. Sting sitting there doing nothing... not working.

And then to top it off, 'after the break', Taz and Tenay go "We've reviewed the footage and we're pretty sure that's Sting". What? You're """"""PRETTY SURE"""""""" that that is one of your marquees? We all KNOW that was Sting, yet you're not so sure? Give me a break. Lame.

And the other lame piece of commentary from Flair was "I haven't really been watching these two and don't really know their issues but there's a lot of intensity" in the Tomko-Styles match. Weird. Ok, firstly, that sounds like a negative comment in my book. If someone within the industry hasn't been paying attention, why should people outside the industry care? If someone has been placed as a mentor/manager of a figure, shouldn't that person not make it their job, if wrestling was real, to understand a bit about that particular wrestler? Wouldn't that make sense? Either that was poorly written, or Ric got that one way wrong.

[Moe Hunter]

So my take on Genesis...

"Oh my god, what's Red gonna do, he's amazing!"... Apparently he's going to do a really basic front flip, land with a little bit of his leg over Kendrick's shoulder, the rest of him hitting the floor and smacking his jaw on the guard rail. Red did one decent move in the whole match, and that was the finish. Kendrick continues to impress me, very nice to see his mat game is as good as his speed game was. Interesting that he's kept the look of "THE Brian Kendrick", but none of the gimmick.


Beer Money... I just don't see why there's any fuss about them. In a promotion where pretty much every team says "we're the best team in TNA/The World Today/History"... Actually, it didn't make sense when Tomko or 3D said it either. But anyway - James Storm, Robert Roode, didn't impress me in 2005 and seemingly haven't added anything to their game in the past four years. I imagine when they do their mid-match taunt that they yell "Lame!" -- "Lamer!". "The Band" are about as you'd expect them to be. Waltman can still go, but he can't shake the X-Pac Heat still. I like that Nash's character is at least admitting that everything around him is bogus.


Morley continues to suck on the mic. While we're at it, do they need to make his video a clone of his WWE one? All the stupid visual innuendos? ... I like that Daniels went into the Gogoplata / Hell's Gate - a dig at Undertaker's girl using his and AJ's finishers, perhaps? That Koji Clutch is a hell of a move, btw. They really have the wrong guys being Face and Heel in this one. It's stupid having Daniels say "I love TNA... wait, no I don't like the fans though, I'm not on your side".


Mr Anderson had a really good debut promo. Pity the match was slow, and that Abyss really isn't a great opponent. I counted only one of Kennedy's moves used in the match, too and that was the basic Face Wash, which Joe does anyway. No Finlay Roll, Kenton Bomb, Mic Check, the double roundhouse... Nothing that really showed him off.


By the way... How crappy is Lashley if he gets knocked out that easy, and can't compete half an hour or so later? If that's how he is, how is he ever supposed to compete in MMA? Oh, and story-wise... If he's so passionate about not wanting to wrestle in TNA... Why does he show up to every event?


Pope and Wolfe! These guys are plain awesome, and Wolfe found himself an extra stak of star power and strengthened his character with his new valet and his pre-match routine. Very solid match, love all the submission moves and the psychology pretty much all the way through. Only iffy spot was when Wolfe went for his Headstand move for the second time... Why? It didn't make sense. Still, great match, great finish.


Women's match was subpar. ODB still really sucks, busted implant or no. Tara bringing a spider to the ring *is* lame as others have said. And putting it on her fallen opponents isn't any cooler than when Boogeyman put worms on his opponents.


Hernandez has some really good moves, but I'm not sold on his look entirely. I think the team of him and Matt Morgan is definitely a good one. British Invasion I don't feel like I've seen enough of to make a proper opinion of.


Styles vs Angle was really good. Seemed a little bit slow, but that's probably just because their previous shorter match is still in my head. The turn was handled really well, but as people have said there aren't any good faces to take on AJ. Anderson or Daniels would be nice choices if the bookers hadn't decided they should arbitrarily be heels. Pope might be good, but he's probably not quite there. Wolfe would be great... again, if he wasn't heel (but I think he needs to be heel).

I'm not looking forward to the Orlando Screwjob, but I am enjoying a lot of the wrestling on display with TNA.

[Ben_91]

Is Lashley actually going to leave TNA? I thought after constantly being ignored by Hogan and Bischoff that Lashley would intervene in the Genesis Main Event and cost Angle the World Title and therefore starting a huge feud between Angle and Lashley. Considering that it would've been Angle's last shot at the world title in 2010.

I would've also liked to seen Ric Flair manage Desmond Wolfe instead of turning AJ Styles heel. I thought it would've been cool to see Flair look as if he was going to mentor Styles, only for Styles to be blindsided by Wolfe. Hence giving Wolfe a push. Wolfe's character seems to be a bit've an opportunist and I think it would've been a great way to get him over with Flair.

Oh yeah, turn Samoa Joe face again and have him destroy the NWO and all of the new deadweight (Morley, Hall, Walterman, Nasty Boys, etc) that's been brought in and have him gun for Hogan and Bischoff.

[wrestlingfan#1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTd--qhRZ-s

he has a point thought. this is a free show, its not an outside of the impact zone show. this is a tv show in a sound stage in a theme park.


I watched the clip haven't read through the rest of the posts yet as I won't be able to watch genesis until later today and don't want anything to be spoiled. However after viewing this clip I have to comment, ok so its a free show and the fans don't have to pay to be there but for this guy to say you all are part of the crew ( i'm paraphrasing obviously but this is the general statement he made ) that would imply that TNA were paying them to be at the arena and such obligated to " do as your boss tells you or else." Honestly telling your fans not to swear or make rude, crude, etc. gestures or have vulgar signs, is basically saying " Hey, I don't like earning a paycheck so could you all just show up to our shows and sit on your hands and remain quiet for the duration of the program so the company no longer needs me?"

I don't consider myself to be the biggest TNA fan in the world by any means but i was very excited for them when they got their tv show and again when they got to add a second hour. It seems that when they got the additional time the alienated a large set of their fan base, after all isn't TNA supposed to stand for Total Nonstop Action? Now they are just as bad as WWF (yes I said it and will say it to the day i die, take that World Wildlife Foundation you gonna sue me too? ) in that a two hour wrestling show is nothing more than a two hour show of talk. Now you can't say that they have to in order to survive with today's " modern wrestling " fan, them making it as far as they did without doing so proves that statement to be false.

Now that that's out of the way:

I finally had a chance to watch last week's impact and unless something changed at Genesis. I would like to speculate that I see a possible resurrection of the Four Horsemen ( or at least a FH'esque stable if WWF owns the rights to that name when they purchased WCW) with the way Flair has been acting toward and interacting with Kurt Angle.

[dcxbox]

i don't think wwe can say anything. the four horsemen started before wcw actually and crocket didnt trademark his gimmicks unlike wwe now.

[Hyde Hill]

Yeah but if WCW trademarked the gimmick later on in it's history which would be likely for Bisschoff to do when they where using the Horsemen it would belong to the WWE now.

[lazorbeak]

Trademarks expire. Just searched for "Four Horseman" and "New World Order" and found no live wrestling trademarks for the Horseman, and the live NWO trademark was first used in commerce in 2002 (Vince's version). I searched both to make sure I wasn't just missing something. It looks like most all of WCW's trademarks have expired if they weren't in WWF. Just for fun I searched Randy Savage's name since he hasn't been anywhere since WCW ended. He registered the name for his own use in 2001, but the Macho King and all of the merchandise rights expired.

[Hyde Hill]

Cool would mean he got good money from the DVD then even though it was just matches and TNA could use the Horseman moniker.

[tristram]

Morley continues to suck on the mic. While we're at it, do they need to make his video a clone of his WWE one? All the stupid visual innuendos? ... I like that Daniels went into the Gogoplata / Hell's Gate - a dig at Undertaker's girl using his and AJ's finishers, perhaps? That Koji Clutch is a hell of a move, btw. They really have the wrong guys being Face and Heel in this one. It's stupid having Daniels say "I love TNA... wait, no I don't like the fans though, I'm not on your side".

Good point. That's the way it should have been. I think if they get the allignment right, then Morley can win with a screwjob finish, and then at the end of the feud Daniels can rightly go over as a courageous face.

By the way... How crappy is Lashley if he gets knocked out that easy, and can't compete half an hour or so later? If that's how he is, how is he ever supposed to compete in MMA? Oh, and story-wise... If he's so passionate about not wanting to wrestle in TNA... Why does he show up to every event?

I never, ever, like an angle that borders on a worked-shoot when the worker is supposedly saying he doesn't want to be in TNA. What does that say to the fans? If the talent doesn't want to be there, and they're getting paid, why the heck should I be there? It was like WCW when Chris Jericho started going nuts and the same with Eddie Guerrero. From there of course within 15 months both are in the WWF and have left the WCW altogether. So it served no long term purpose anyway.

[brashleyholland]

By the way... How crappy is Lashley if he gets knocked out that easy, and can't compete half an hour or so later? If that's how he is, how is he ever supposed to compete in MMA? Oh, and story-wise... If he's so passionate about not wanting to wrestle in TNA... Why does he show up to every event?



Not just knocked out, but knocked out for several minutes while a room full of guys have a conversation.

Hogan made some strongly worded comments about Lashley's commitment to TNA recently, which I'm guessing is the catalyst for all this. Bobby is getting paid a decent amount of money for a small amount of work right now, so you can't blame Hogan for wanting Bobby to commit fully, or not at all.

The nature of Hogan's comments on Lashley were that he wasn't taking TNA seriously and needed to get his priorities right. The only problem with that is the following: If Hogan is reluctant for Bobby to take the spot of one of TNA's up and comming stars, how is he justifying giving the Nasty Boys, Bubba, Waltman and Hall even a second of TV time? None of them have added anything to the show so far and all will likely be gone from the company in short order.

Lashley is only going to get bigger in the MMA world for the time being. He's building his record against hand-picked opponants that will make him look good. Fair enough, he won't be doing house shows and will need more time off in the future as his camps get longer, but why can't TNA use his status as a supposedly high-level MMA fighter to their benefit?

Bobby will have to quit wrestling for good in a year or so if he is going to take MMA seriously, so I don't see why TNA isn't having him choking people out left right and center before going out on a big loss to one of their up and commers.

[dcxbox]

Not just knocked out, but knocked out for several minutes while a room full of guys have a conversation.

Hogan made some strongly worded comments about Lashley's commitment to TNA recently, which I'm guessing is the catalyst for all this. Bobby is getting paid a decent amount of money for a small amount of work right now, so you can't blame Hogan for wanting Bobby to commit fully, or not at all.

The nature of Hogan's comments on Lashley were that he wasn't taking TNA seriously and needed to get his priorities right. The only problem with that is the following: If Hogan is reluctant for Bobby to take the spot of one of TNA's up and comming stars, how is he justifying giving the Nasty Boys, Bubba, Waltman and Hall even a second of TV time? None of them have added anything to the show so far and all will likely be gone from the company in short order.

Lashley is only going to get bigger in the MMA world for the time being. He's building his record against hand-picked opponants that will make him look good. Fair enough, he won't be doing house shows and will need more time off in the future as his camps get longer, but why can't TNA use his status as a supposedly high-level MMA fighter to their benefit?

Bobby will have to quit wrestling for good in a year or so if he is going to take MMA seriously, so I don't see why TNA isn't having him choking people out left right and center before going out on a big loss to one of their up and commers.

they shouldnt use lashley on tv, just his wife instead talking for him about him being above wrestling. then when he comes in he can have so much heat on him at shows. only bring him in for the big ppvs though, make him important hav hm get wins while making opponent look good then eventually lead to some home geown guy like say samoa joe, beating him. dont overuse lashley. he could be great for tna and a solid draw with him in strikeforce for tna. his wife is needed more for him, she can take all the heat til he can come in for a ppv

[TracyBrooksFan]

The Wrestling Observer reports that Awesome Kong gave notice to TNA on Tuesday night. This comes on the heels of her altercation with Bubba The Love Sponge over the ill-advised comments about Haiti.

[alden]

The Wrestling Observer reports that Awesome Kong gave notice to TNA on Tuesday night. This comes on the heels of her altercation with Bubba The Love Sponge over the ill-advised comments about Haiti.

I hope they can talk her out of it. She is a huge part of the knock outs. She is a champion and would hate to see her go. hermada is getting a good push with her. i would hate to see her push go away.

[stratusfaction]

I'm so sad to hear that she is leaving TNA. I always enjoyed seeing her wrestle. She wasn't the normal diva look alike. I really hope they can stop her. The Knockouts division is going to take a MAJOR blow without Kong.

[justtxyank]

How big will a loss would it be long term though? Her size over the other knockouts inherently limits her. This is what has hurt Big Show in his career.

[GDE71]

How big will a loss would it be long term though? Her size over the other knockouts inherently limits her. This is what has hurt Big Show in his career.

I agree with this. She really needed to stay in the tag division to be believable as no one on the roster should beat her 1 on 1.

[stratusfaction]

How big will a loss would it be long term though? Her size over the other knockouts inherently limits her. This is what has hurt Big Show in his career.

I would have to agree on the Big Show comment. But I really think this is a big loss for them because she was TNA's biggest and most popular heel knockout. With out her you have heels but they are either not popular or they aren't great wrestlers like The Beautiful People.

[TracyBrooksFan]

Diva Dirt has just received word that TNA Knockout, Alissa Flash — real name Melissa Anderson — has parted ways with TNA.

Anderson made her debut in January 2008 as Raisha Saeed, manager of Awesome Kong before debuting a second character, ‘The Future Legend’ Alissa Flash in July 2009. Saeed was written out in October last year and Anderson continued to compete as Flash until her departure.

During her time in the company, Alissa has competed in memorable matches with Sarita, Hamada, Awesome Kong and Tara.

For more on Alissa please visit her Twitter page and official website

[stratusfaction]

Diva Dirt has just received word that TNA Knockout, Alissa Flash — real name Melissa Anderson — has parted ways with TNA.

Anderson made her debut in January 2008 as Raisha Saeed, manager of Awesome Kong before debuting a second character, ‘The Future Legend’ Alissa Flash in July 2009. Saeed was written out in October last year and Anderson continued to compete as Flash until her departure.

During her time in the company, Alissa has competed in memorable matches with Sarita, Hamada, Awesome Kong and Tara.

For more on Alissa please visit her Twitter page and official website

Wow, the day keeps getting worse and worse for the Knockouts Division!

[Hyde Hill]

WTF!!! Both Kong and Melissa/Alissa no freaking way! They where two of the best if not the best knockouts!

Edit; Still it isn't up on PWI yet and I hope they can be talked into staying.

[jwt13]

I really dont like Womans wrestling so I dont see as much of a loss I always skip the knockouts any way instead of TBP but I can see how people who like the knockouts could be disspapointed but I dont see it as much of a loss

[stratusfaction]

TNA Knockout catfights and mud matches HERE WE COME.

So now all we have left in legitimate knockouts are Hamada, Tara, Sarita, and maybe Taylor Wilde. I hope Roxxi comes back soon from injury.

[stratusfaction]

I really dont like Womans wrestling so I dont see as much of a loss I always skip the knockouts any way instead of TBP but I can see how people who like the knockouts could be disspapointed but I dont see it as much of a loss

It is a slight loss to TNA considering there Knockouts consistently pull in some of the highest rated segments on Impact.

[Gouge]

Unreal. The Knockouts are the last true alternative left to WWE and honestly, they're pretty damn good. Melissa has been busting her butt for 10 years to get where she is, but is overlooked by WWE because she isn't a model. It's a shame she'll never get the recognition she deserves. I was hoping TNA would be the place for that, but it would appear not. Kong leaving is a huge blow as well. And I can't help but think Hamada's time is limited.

I can't see Hogan being a huge fan of legitmate female wrestlers. Considering right now, the Beautiful People seem to be the only ones getting air time due to them feuding themselves.

[Franchise22]

issues with ken anderson and his contract?

http://www.gerweck.net/news/1264103705.shtml

[stratusfaction]

Unreal. The Knockouts are the last true alternative left to WWE and honestly, they're pretty damn good. Melissa has been busting her butt for 10 years to get where she is, but is overlooked by WWE because she isn't a model. It's a shame she'll never get the recognition she deserves. I was hoping TNA would be the place for that, but it would appear not. Kong leaving is a huge blow as well. And I can't help but think Hamada's time is limited.

I can't see Hogan being a huge fan of legitmate female wrestlers. Considering right now, the Beautiful People seem to be the only ones getting air time due to them feuding themselves.

Your comment on Hogan not being a huge fan of legit female wrestlers and it got me thinking...could the changes that are happening effect the relationship that TNA has with Sh!mmer? If TNA looses the girls that also work for Sh!mmer it would be the end to the Knockouts.

[MrCanada]

am I the only person who finds it funny that TNA loves to blur the lines so much between heel & face (I have to admit I have no idea who's what) but get mad when the fans react differentley then how they think they should?

[Franchise22]

angle vs styles for 3rd time in a month? hogan would suck at TEW lol

[lazorbeak]

I really dont like Womans wrestling so I dont see as much of a loss I always skip the knockouts any way instead of TBP but I can see how people who like the knockouts could be disspapointed but I dont see it as much of a loss

Awesome Kong is one of the few draws on the roster so yeah, it hurts. I have to assume "dur I don like wimmen wrestling" is the exception, since the Knockouts have regularly been the highest rated part of TNA since their debut. A debut which featured Awesome Kong.

I think Kong would be great for WWE, especially since Beth Phoenix has been teasing a face turn for the past year. A feud between those two would be worth watching. Melissa... isn't likely to get much of a shot if she went up north. I look at where Katie Lea is and that seems like the same spot Melissa would end up in.

[Franchise22]

its wierd seeing TNA in a ring again.....

[b0shey]

TNAWrestlingNews.com is exclusively reporting that TNA Knockout Alissa Flash is leaving TNA Wrestling.

According to their source, word is that Alissa (Melissa Anderson) requested her release from the company. There are rumors of others besides Kong and Anderson requesting their releases but nothing is confirmed.

good for her i'm a big fan of Cheerleader Melissa and she deserved to use her own gimmick.

[justtxyank]

Just watched tonight's impact. Didn't think it was bad at all actually. Much better on tv than it was in the spoilers.

Even the Nasty Boys didn't seem so bad. Knobbs is definitely a lot worse off than Sags at this point.

[Gouge]

angle vs styles for 3rd time in a month? hogan would suck at TEW lol

LOL. I keep making the "penalty" reference on other message boards and nobody gets it :(

Yeah, that show was... ugh. I don't understand the point in them blatantly ripping off the Montreal Screwjob right down to the spitting. I mean, they've already done two of these in the past with Larry Z and Earl Hebner. Did they just do it in hopes that WWE would rehash it and ruin it's appeal? Who knows.

I tried my best to enjoy it, I couldn't. None of the matches were good, it was flooded with pointless segments, and there's too many guys sitting on the sidelines who have good momentum at the moment that just aren't being followed through with (Beer Money, Desmond Wolfe)

[Wrestling Century]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a minute. What's with these rumors that Mr. Anderson wants to leave? If these rumors are true, why does he?

[justtxyank]

Two things.

1) If WWE was held to the standards TNA is, it would be out of business.

2) TNA needs to go to a live show bad. With taped shows, fans are deciding whether the shows are good or not before they ever see them. Tonight's Impact was no worse than any WWE broadcast, but it is being trashed largely because we all got so upset from the spoilers earlier in the week.

[jesterx7769]

Just finished watching the DVR of the show (was gonna miss the first half hour and now that I have DVR I decided to catch TNA for the first time in months) and three things stuck out

1) The knockouts all have t*ts so big its distracting (Seriously a C won't do they all need double D's?

2) Scott Hall is fat and needs to go away.

3) TNA apparentley is doing GREAT financially b/c they can afford to sign everyone who has ever spent any time wrestling.

bonus 4th: plz make the ring bigger now that it is square.

bonus bonus 5th: Their house music sucks.

[SaySo]

Does TNA release a financial report to show whether they are making a profit or loses? If so, can someone post it. And why would wrestlers want to sign a deal with Panda Energy instead of TNA?

[tristram]

The Wrestling Observer reports that Awesome Kong gave notice to TNA on Tuesday night. This comes on the heels of her altercation with Bubba The Love Sponge over the ill-advised comments about Haiti.

Well... that would suck. She's the only chick who genuinely looks .... frightening. She's the key to the Knock Outs division, as you can always book her legitimately as the strong heel no questions asked.

Diva Dirt has just received word that TNA Knockout, Alissa Flash — real name Melissa Anderson — has parted ways with TNA.

Anderson made her debut in January 2008 as Raisha Saeed, manager of Awesome Kong before debuting a second character, ‘The Future Legend’ Alissa Flash in July 2009. Saeed was written out in October last year and Anderson continued to compete as Flash until her departure.

During her time in the company, Alissa has competed in memorable matches with Sarita, Hamada, Awesome Kong and Tara.

For more on Alissa please visit her Twitter page and official website

Again, that's rather ordinary also.

This just sounds so... WCW-ish. Hogan thinks he's the messiah, sells himself well to corporate types, gets ingratiated with the upper brass, becomes a key figure behind the scenes, and whammo, the ingredients of a great recipe start to go by the way-side.

It sounds like a very disorientated, very disorganised unit at the moment. It doesn't surprise me. Look, I think Hulk Hogan knows how to sell Hulk Hogan. And he's done it very well for a very long time. But much like say Ric Flair with WCW, I don't think Hulk Hogan is someone to lead an organisation from a non wrestling perspective. At the end of the day, it seems to me that Vince McMahon is probably sitting back quite happy that the only genuine chance in years to pose any threat to his promotion is destroying itself, in good old WCW fashion.

[BHK1978]

Does TNA release a financial report to show whether they are making a profit or loses? If so, can someone post it. And why would wrestlers want to sign a deal with Panda Energy instead of TNA?

I read that if TNA were to go out of business their contracts would still be guaranteed because they are working for the parent company. If they had TNA contracts and the company went out of business that would be that, and they would get nothing.

[The Final Countdown]

I read that if TNA were to go out of business their contracts would still be guaranteed because they are working for the parent company. If they had TNA contracts and the company went out of business that would be that, and they would get nothing.
Right. Just like how some of the guys from WCW (Goldberg being one for certain) continued to receive money from Time Warner/AOL/whatever after WCW was sold off.

[SaySo]

Right. Just like how some of the guys from WCW (Goldberg being one for certain) continued to receive money from Time Warner/AOL/whatever after WCW was sold off.

But why would they sign with the parent company if the child company is profitable?

[alden]

from what i understand panda energy *the parent compnay if you will* makes alot of money and was willing to loose money for a while till tna started making a profit. I do understand that tna was turning a profit. but that was before hogan and all the new people started coming in. I am assuming that is costing them alot of money. They might not be making a profit any more but panda might be willing to risk it for a few more month.

[PhenomenalPat]

Panda is Dixie's Dads company and a very successful company. Her dad is more than willing to eat some cash for his daughters passion project.

[GDE71]

Hopefully firing Bubba will have the ladies in a "changing their mind" mood and wanting to stay in TNA.

[justtxyank]

Well... that would suck. She's the only chick who genuinely looks .... frightening. She's the key to the Knock Outs division, as you can always book her legitimately as the strong heel no questions asked.



Again, that's rather ordinary also.

This just sounds so... WCW-ish. Hogan thinks he's the messiah, sells himself well to corporate types, gets ingratiated with the upper brass, becomes a key figure behind the scenes, and whammo, the ingredients of a great recipe start to go by the way-side.

It sounds like a very disorientated, very disorganised unit at the moment. It doesn't surprise me. Look, I think Hulk Hogan knows how to sell Hulk Hogan. And he's done it very well for a very long time. But much like say Ric Flair with WCW, I don't think Hulk Hogan is someone to lead an organisation from a non wrestling perspective. At the end of the day, it seems to me that Vince McMahon is probably sitting back quite happy that the only genuine chance in years to pose any threat to his promotion is destroying itself, in good old WCW fashion.

I don't think this is the case at all. I think we need to stop buying the perception that the internet media is putting out there. They have issued reports ranging from "Morale is great after inspiring speech from Hogan!" to "Everyone wants out! Hogan is terrible!" We just need to stop trying to be smarky about it and see what happens. I think Hogan is doing a good job right now personally. The only thing I hate that they've done is reenact the Montreal bit last night. To be fair though, the WWE does that seemingly twice a year.

[lazorbeak]

I don't think this is the case at all. I think we need to stop buying the perception that the internet media is putting out there. They have issued reports ranging from "Morale is great after inspiring speech from Hogan!" to "Everyone wants out! Hogan is terrible!" We just need to stop trying to be smarky about it and see what happens. I think Hogan is doing a good job right now personally. The only thing I hate that they've done is reenact the Montreal bit last night. To be fair though, the WWE does that seemingly twice a year.

I would agree except for Knockouts apparently leaving and homegrown talent not working so that the Nasty Boys can wrestle Kevin Nash. That's just not something that needs to exist in 2010.

Also, even if WWE did do screw-jobs twice a year (which they don't), it is THEIR STORY. The screwjob was WWF's, and they took something which was genuine and real and made money off of it by creating the Mr. McMahon character. TNA's re-enactments of the screw-job are just sad in comparison since they have virtually no connection to that genuine event and are basically saying "hey, remember this wrestling fans?" Instead of TNA doing anything creative, they are leeching off of 12 year old stories show-wide. It's wrestling nostalgia for the Attitude era.

[Stennick]

I would agree except for Knockouts apparently leaving and homegrown talent not working so that the Nasty Boys can wrestle Kevin Nash. That's just not something that needs to exist in 2010.

Also, even if WWE did do screw-jobs twice a year (which they don't), it is THEIR STORY. The screwjob was WWF's, and they took something which was genuine and real and made money off of it by creating the Mr. McMahon character. TNA's re-enactments of the screw-job are just sad in comparison since they have virtually no connection to that genuine event and are basically saying "hey, remember this wrestling fans?" Instead of TNA doing anything creative, they are leeching off of 12 year old stories show-wide. It's wrestling nostalgia for the Attitude era.

Yes exactly the point

[justtxyank]

I would agree except for Knockouts apparently leaving and homegrown talent not working so that the Nasty Boys can wrestle Kevin Nash. That's just not something that needs to exist in 2010.

I just read that Kong's issues don't have anything to do with Bubba but rather have to do with not wanting to do the UK tour. As for Flash, we have no idea yet why she is leaving. As for the homegrown talent thing, the homegrown talent has still been working. I'm not going to knock them for the Nasty Boys until I see where it goes. But it is unfair to say the homegrown guys haven't been getting any airtime. They've gotten airtime. Let's remember that when the show was all about the homegrown guys nobody was watching.

Also, even if WWE did do screw-jobs twice a year (which they don't), it is THEIR STORY. The screwjob was WWF's, and they took something which was genuine and real and made money off of it by creating the Mr. McMahon character. TNA's re-enactments of the screw-job are just sad in comparison since they have virtually no connection to that genuine event and are basically saying "hey, remember this wrestling fans?" Instead of TNA doing anything creative, they are leeching off of 12 year old stories show-wide. It's wrestling nostalgia for the Attitude era.

I agree completely about them doing the screwjob story being stupid. I don't agree that they are just rehashing the attitude era show-wide though. The storyline with The Band is actually interesting to me and it plays off the real life issues that have happened since the Attitude Era, including the common themes that have gone on since it was announced Hogan would be taking over.

I just think we are being way too harsh on TNA just because we can. They've basically had 4 televised shows now under the new regime and people are eviscerating them. The WWE has been ramming garbage down our throats for 5+ years. Let's give TNA a chance to play out the storylines before we start saying it's WCW all over again.

[trypio]

Last Impacts wasn't that bad besides the main event finish in my opinion.

- Flair on the mic was surprisingly good.
- I did think it was a bit weird to book a match that people had to pay for just 4 days before the show, but other than that the tag team title match was pretty good.
- They're doing their best at making the Jeff Jarrett storyline realistic, but it got boring after the second time he called in, why would he still pick up the phone knowing it's Bubba?
- Jordan vs. The Pope was ok. Good they're using Jordan as a heel.
- Why make such a fuzz about Lashley. Why would they even keep him if he doesn't wrestle?
- Knockouts match and post-match was pretty meh and expected.
- Hall and Waltman getting fired was expected as well, but I somehow hope they come back. They're entertaining. Don't know why, but I'm a fan of Hall.
- Nasty Boys match was better than I expected. (Still very far from good though)
- Anderson vs. Abyss is something I don't really care about, Abyss has been demoted to just a midcarder and Anderson should get a higher profile feud.
- Main event was lame. Also why curse and swear if you know it'll just be -beeeeeep- whole the time on tv, it annoys me.

[cappyboy]

Last Impacts wasn't that bad besides the main event finish in my opinion.

Agreed. Wasn't quite as good as what they were having before. But considering the Hogan influence I'll definitely take it.

- They're doing their best at making the Jeff Jarrett storyline realistic, but it got boring after the second time he called in, why would he still pick up the phone knowing it's Bubba?

I guess. But if he's supposed to be a dire heel now, it's going to take a while to properly translate. Going up against Bischoff is a hard row to hoe if you want to establish yourself as a heel. If he had been heel all along and were battling Hogan/Bischoff all along, okay. That would be easier to embrace. But because he's going off on Bischoff, Jarrett tends to sound in the right.

- Jordan vs. The Pope was ok. Good they're using Jordan as a heel.

I guess. I don't get what all the bother is about Jordan actually. That dragon screw while in the ropes was pretty nasty looking and I hope to find Jordan/Pope on Youtube so I can see it again. But Orlando Jordan looks like some personal trainer dude they pulled out of the crowd. You can't get somebody more impressive to mess with The Pope?

- Why make such a fuzz about Lashley. Why would they even keep him if he doesn't wrestle?

Looks like they are going with a Krystal over-speaking her bounds and Bobby wanting to wrestle while the MMA will let him angle. Hope they keep Krystal on hand however much more time Bobby's able to give TNA. She makes a really good shrew of a manager and could be a real asset for bringing the young guys along.

- Knockouts match and post-match was pretty meh and expected.

I guess. But you know I'm looking forward to seeing it play out all the same. I love that Angelina is ticked off about being replaced by Lacey Von Erich and willing to go to war with her old friends because of it. If the other Knockouts can feel useful enough to stay around, I'll be very interested to see whether they back Angelina up in this fight or are too afraid to trust her because of all the crap she pulled when she led the group.

- Hall and Waltman getting fired was expected as well, but I somehow hope they come back. They're entertaining. Don't know why, but I'm a fan of Hall.

To each their own, dude. But I hope they stay gone. It will be good for establishing Hogan the way they want to. And if they can do that without diluting the awesome undercard, that could be a good thing.

- Nasty Boys match was better than I expected. (Still very far from good though)

Gotta disagree here. It was pretty much exactly what I expected. I can think of a lot of matches that would have been better. But if the Nastys can perform consistently at this level, I'll be able to live with that. They've never been ones to do lots of whizzy, bangy offense or dramatic selling. So it's not like there was a lot of room for rust to accumulate in their game.

- Anderson vs. Abyss is something I don't really care about, Abyss has been demoted to just a midcarder and Anderson should get a higher profile feud.

Again I have to disagree. You have of Abyss being demoted and how awful that is. But that says to me one of two things. Either they think they are re-establishing Abyss by playing him off Holly. Um Anderson. Or they are trying to secretly bury Anderson by giving him a false sense of security. Either way I'm all for that. I really like the character Abyss has now. I enjoy seeing former monsters break out of that mold. See comedic Big Show. See Kane grappling with his career mortality. Abyss playing the mentally limited nice guy who agonizes over reverting back to his old monster ways is a compelling counter-balance to me. Abyss building his way back up to his former heights from his monster days in this post Dr Stevie world could be great stuff if they are just willing to run with it. And if it can come partially at the expense of Mr Holly (GAH!!) Anderson, all the better as far as I'm concerned.

- Main event was lame. Also why curse and swear if you know it'll just be -beeeeeep- whole the time on tv, it annoys me.


Agreed. There was the one crowd chant I kept trying to hear that I couldn't finally make out because of all the beeping. Sounded like it was either "Thank you, Angle" or "F you, Angle" Could never properly distinguish the verb. The only thing I liked about it is the fact they teased willingness to play Hogan as the monster heel by asking if he was directly involved in screwing Angle. If they are willing to do that and follow through, Hulk being the bad guy could be a very good sign for this Hogan/Bischoff regime.

[brashleyholland]

But why would they sign with the parent company if the child company is profitable?

Because even if a wrestling company like TNA is profitable (which considering some of the numbers that are flying around, I have a hard time believing), at the end of the day it's a *wrestling* company. It's playing serious second fiddle in a highly cyclical business.

Panda energy is an institution; an energy company that has opperated successfully for 30 years. Which would you rather have a guarentee from? If Spike cans TNA, they wont see 2011. I can't see Panda energy going anywhere soon.

[Moderndaywarrior]

I watched Impact again this morning(first time I've really watched current wrestling in a while)

-I kind of liked the Flair/Styles thing,it was pretty good, my only downsides here were: A) AJ doing the "kiss stealin'...." line was not good,he doesn't have the delivery for it(which is ok,not everyone can do every part/gimmick) and B) For God's sake, someone either get Ric a decent hairpiece or loan a few bucks to hit the barber and get a decent hairstyle going.

-Morgan/Hernandez v. British Invasion was IMO decent...there was a bit of storytelling going on and noone looked awful inside the ring.

-Thank God the Knockouts segment was short...they're sure as heck nice to look at but jesus is it painful to watch them wrestle.

-Lashley was ok but I didn't quite 'get' it....are they trying to show him as a nice guy who happens to be saddled with with a loud,annoying wife?

-Pope/Jordan was ok if a little short, I think it's worth seeing them in a longer match once to see how it goes.

-Not going to comment on Mr.Anderson as I never really liked that guy(as a wrestler).

-Hall and Waltman......jeez guys, 1995 called,it wants it's gimmick back.Nash I didn't mind as the "torn between his friends and the company" thing was at least kind of interesting, just as long as it doesnt turn into the "N.W.O. Reunion Tour 2010".

-Christ do I hate "The Pit Stop"....Nasty Boys were sorta ok otherwise though,should work well with Team 3D.

-Anyone else find it ironic Hogan makes this big spiel about "earning your spot" yet his good buddies Knobbs and Bubba The Love Sponge ride in on his coattails?

-Knowing the above doesn't that make Jeff Jarrett's character right?

-Finally the whole Jarrett/Bubba/Hogan thing and the screwy finish to Angle?Styles......um,no please.....if I wanted stupid "smark" angles I'd watch old Russo-era WCW tapes and if I wanted "Heel owner/promoter screws everybody left and right" I'd have continued not watching current wrestling at all as "Mr. McMahon" has done it to death....I'd like to see something different please.

[lazorbeak]

I just read that Kong's issues don't have anything to do with Bubba but rather have to do with not wanting to do the UK tour. As for Flash, we have no idea yet why she is leaving. As for the homegrown talent thing, the homegrown talent has still been working. I'm not going to knock them for the Nasty Boys until I see where it goes. But it is unfair to say the homegrown guys haven't been getting any airtime. They've gotten airtime. Let's remember that when the show was all about the homegrown guys nobody was watching.

Did I say anything about Bubba? Curious where you got that. My point is talent is leaving and the knockouts division is one of the only areas where TNA is equal to or greater than WWE. Or at least, it was. And as I mentioned in my review of Genesis, the homegrown talent isn't being used much: 1/4 of the guys working at Genesis had never been on a monthly TNA PPV before, while Team 3d, Rhino, Jarrett, the MCMGs, Jay Lethal, Homicide, and more weren't on the show at all, even in video packages. So no, not unfair: accurate.

Also I take issue with this: "Let's remember that when the show was all about the homegrown guys nobody was watching." This attitude is not only wrong, it's poisonously wrong. Yes, Hogan increased interest and ratings. BUT instead of using his name value to increase exposure to guys who aren't already household names, we get Sean Morley and Ken Anderson going over TNA talent right and left. The fact that bringing in a name like Hogan increased ratings isn't an excuse to not showcase talent that could actually make your company money so that the Nasty Boys can be on television for 10 minutes an episode. I mean, Hogan brought in bigger ratings for WCW, too, but that helped make guys like Chris Benoit, Rey Mysterio, Eddie Guerrero, etc. go from "talented unknowns" to recognizable names. The idea that these guys shouldn't be pushed because they didn't get ratings on their own isn't just wrong, it's "kill the business" wrong.



I just think we are being way too harsh on TNA just because we can. They've basically had 4 televised shows now under the new regime and people are eviscerating them. The WWE has been ramming garbage down our throats for 5+ years. Let's give TNA a chance to play out the storylines before we start saying it's WCW all over again.

I'm being harsh on TNA because they are putting out train-wreck TV on a weekly basis and don't appear to have any idea what they're trying to do. It's fun to watch in the same way as late 2000/early 2001 WCW was.

As far as "ramming garbage down our throats," do you honestly believe that or is that just gross exaggeration? I mean, seriously? WWE is conservative and predictable, but at the end of the day the biggest thing against them is they know what works and they do that. It's not "edgy" and I can see where it's probably not as "cool" to teens and young adults as it was w hen Steve Austin was giving everyone the bird, but it still features logically booked feuds leading to good wrestling matches on a regular basis.

[justtxyank]

So, 75% of the guys on Genesis HAD been on one of their pay-per-views before and that equals them not getting enough time? OK.

And yes, I do believe WWE is garbage. I'm sorry you like it. Rarely are the matches any good unless it is a pay-per-view, and even then it is hit or miss. While feuds may have "logic" there isn't anything interesting about them because the promos are all scripted and lack passion and the ringwork is all generic. As for the shows, I don't get to watch Smackdown or ECW so I can't comment on them, but Raw sucks. Sucks sucks sucks sucks. Generic matches, stupid as hell storylines involving Hornswoggle, DX going through the motions and cracking corny jokes every week.

The only thing remotely interesting to me about the E is the Bret vs Vince story that is developing.

I also think it is irrational to say TNA has no direction after 3 shows have been aired. When the WWF was three shows in under Vince McMahon I wonder if people said "Yep, this is going to be the wrestling show that dominates the world!"

[Wade]

Earlier in this thread I made a post saying that I was really hoping Hogan changing everything was a giant work (which by the way, would be the greatest work in wrestling history) and that Jarrett would establish himself as the face and fight back for the TNA originals and the 6-sided ring. They opened iMPACT! with the fans chanting, "We want six sides!" That makes me even more optimistic that this just may be the case. Let's not forget that when Bischoff had control of WCW, he did a couple of stories and angles that were out-of-this-world good. I'm going to keep crossing my fingers on this one, I think he just might be delivering again.

[jesterx7769]

What do you all think of Bischoff being on air? When I first saw him on I was pretty disapointed that he was on my tv again but by the end I liked him back in the authority figure role and him vs. Foley has my interest to see where it will end up.

[justtxyank]

I've always thought Bischoff was the perfect on air authority figure, but only as a heel.

[Wade]

I don't understand how Bischoff can fire Mick Foley if he's a minority owner. This entire angle makes absolutely zero sense.

[lazorbeak]

So, 75% of the guys on Genesis HAD been on one of their pay-per-views before and that equals them not getting enough time? OK.

Did you not read the part where at least 10 notable TNA stars who have been with the company more than a month were left off pay per view? Do you seriously not find a 25% turnover rate to be a little high? Imagine if you were at a job and 1 in 4 people were people you had never worked with before. Wouldn't that be a pretty significant change?

And yes, I do believe WWE is garbage. I'm sorry you like it.


No need to be sorry, is there?


Rarely are the matches any good unless it is a pay-per-view, and even then it is hit or miss. While feuds may have "logic" there isn't anything interesting about them because the promos are all scripted and lack passion and the ringwork is all generic. As for the shows, I don't get to watch Smackdown or ECW so I can't comment on them, but Raw sucks. Sucks sucks sucks sucks. Generic matches, stupid as hell storylines involving Hornswoggle, DX going through the motions and cracking corny jokes every week.

It's true, WWE rarely goes "all out" on free TV, but why should they? Considering the age of their top guys combined with the lack of any real benefit to giving away PPV matches on TV, you're not seeing 4* matches being given away every week. Maybe if TNA actually challenges them for ratings that will change. Also considering your taste, it's pretty amusing that Raw is the only show you've watched. Christian has had excellent TV matches with half the ECW roster, and Smackdown has workhorses like CM Punk and Jericho and Rey Mysterio that could wrestle themselves to a good 10 minute match. But yeah, admitting "I only watch one part of WWE so all of WWE is garbage" just makes you sound really ignorant. I won't defend DX because yes, it is lame, but I think they're starting to develop a storyline that'll take them through Wrestlemania, and right now I still don't really have any idea where it's going.

The only thing remotely interesting to me about the E is the Bret vs Vince story that is developing.

And that's the point: WWE presents something for everyone: they market themselves so that they always have at least one "serious" feud at a time even if there is comedy or wrestlecrap elsewhere. Despite WO and PWI occasionally whining about WWE, it wins 'storyline of the year' almost every year because they remain capable of telling great stories in and out of the ring. But WWE knows that an entire show's worth of "super serious" wrestling does not sell tickets, video games, action figures, etc.


Again, the biggest problem with WWE is that they know what they're doing and do it effectively, so there's really no "oh god now what?" aspect of the programming any more the way you'd often see in WCW and are currently seeing in TNA.

So again, to say it's "garbage" just makes you sound like you have no idea what you're talking about. And that's all I'm going to say about that.

[PhenomenalPat]

I don't understand how Bischoff can fire Mick Foley if he's a minority owner. This entire angle makes absolutely zero sense.

The onscreen storyline is that Hogan (and by proxy Bischoff) are now Dixies Partners and outrank JJ and Foley, thus having control over thier fates.

As for a real world example, say your store manager of a department store that gets bought into, the power is restructered and the store is partnered with another store, that the new owners already own. Someone new is appointed regional manager for both stores (this would be Bischoffs' role), that new guy now has control over you and your store...thus he could fire you.

It's a lose off the top of my head comparision, but you can see what I'm saying.

[PhenomenalPat]

It's true, WWE rarely goes "all out" on free TV, but why should they? Considering the age of their top guys combined with the lack of any real benefit to giving away PPV matches on TV, you're not seeing 4* matches being given away every week. Maybe if TNA actually challenges them for ratings that will change. Also considering your taste, it's pretty amusing that Raw is the only show you've watched. Christian has had excellent TV matches with half the ECW roster, and Smackdown has workhorses like CM Punk and Jericho and Rey Mysterio that could wrestle themselves to a good 10 minute match. But yeah, admitting "I only watch one part of WWE so all of WWE is garbage" just makes you sound really ignorant. I won't defend DX because yes, it is lame, but I think they're starting to develop a storyline that'll take them through Wrestlemania, and right now I still don't really have any idea where it's going.


Again, the biggest problem with WWE is that they know what they're doing and do it effectively, so there's really no "oh god now what?" aspect of the programming any more the way you'd often see in WCW and are currently seeing in TNA.

So again, to say it's "garbage" just makes you sound like you have no idea what you're talking about. And that's all I'm going to say about that.


Your defense of WWE is, in my humble opinion, the biggest fault they have. They are complacent. They're the top dog by far, and they know it. There is no urgency to be surprising or awe inspiring, they ride thier name to the bank and call it a day.

While I'm not going to defend every booking or business decision TNA makes, I will defend them for trying to be different, trying to be cutting edge, trying to be shocking and surprising. Yes, there is occasional problems with the "swerve for the sake of a swerve" style being implemented, and logic gaps can occur, but WWE's angles and matches are, for the most part, done in a very pedestrian "paint by numbers" style. They're simply going through the motions.

Hell, I can in all honestly say that I have only been surprised ONCE by WWE's product in the past year, I was surprised when Sheamas won the Title from Cena. Other than that I know I don't have to watch every show or pay per view cause if I miss it, it's no big deal. I already know what's going to happen anyway.

TNA is spotty, but they work at standing out and trying to actually surprise the audience.

That is the main reason why I perfer TNA over WWE...make an effort to surprise and entertain me, don't just go through the motions.

Plus, personally, I perfer Angle, Styles, Wolfe, Daniels, Joe, Sting, Foley, Jarrett and Beer Money over Triple H, HBK, Cena, Taker, Batista, Big Show, Kane and Khali. I will however gladly admit that Jericho and Christian rule the world.

[justtxyank]

Did you not read the part where at least 10 notable TNA stars who have been with the company more than a month were left off pay per view? Do you seriously not find a 25% turnover rate to be a little high? Imagine if you were at a job and 1 in 4 people were people you had never worked with before. Wouldn't that be a pretty significant change?

Out of curiosity, how many workers on WWE's roster are left off each ppv outside of the Royal Rumble? No, I don't think 25% is that big of a deal when the whole focus of the company right now is a new sheriff has come in to shake everything up. I actually think it makes more sense that way than if it were a new boss trying to change everything by having the exact same people fighting each other. But, to each his own.

It's true, WWE rarely goes "all out" on free TV, but why should they?

They don't "need to" in order to sell their product, because they have no real competition. But whether or not they are doing good business is irrelevant to me when evaluating whether their product is actually entertaining. It isn't.

Also considering your taste, it's pretty amusing that Raw is the only show you've watched. Christian has had excellent TV matches with half the ECW roster, and Smackdown has workhorses like CM Punk and Jericho and Rey Mysterio that could wrestle themselves to a good 10 minute match.

I never said I hadn't seen the other two shows. What I was saying is that due to circumstances I rarely get to watch them. Because of that, I wasn't using what happens on those shows to base my evaluation on WWE. Considering Raw is by far their flagship brand, I think that is ok.

But yeah, admitting "I only watch one part of WWE so all of WWE is garbage" just makes you sound really ignorant. I won't defend DX because yes, it is lame, but I think they're starting to develop a storyline that'll take them through Wrestlemania, and right now I still don't really have any idea where it's going.

I'm sorry you think it makes me sound ignorant, but you distorted what I said entirely. But it's cool. I don't care if they are starting to develop a storyline, just like your judgment of TNA, storylines need to exist in perfect right this second or else it is a trainwreck. Right?


So again, to say it's "garbage" just makes you sound like you have no idea what you're talking about. And that's all I'm going to say about that.

Different opinions for different people. From a wrestling perspective, I find that WWE presents a pretty stale, generic, paint by numbers product, which translates to garbage in my opinion. You like that stuff. That's great! There were people who defended WWF having guys like Bastion Booger, Abe Knuckleball Schwartz, etc.

I'm glad you aren't going to say anymore. We obviously won't agree and you are getting annoyed to the point of heading toward insults. It's best we leave the conversation at that. You can defend WWE and hate TNA, I can hate WWE and cross my fingers and hope for TNA.

[Wade]

The onscreen storyline is that Hogan (and by proxy Bischoff) are now Dixies Partners and outrank JJ and Foley, thus having control over thier fates.

As for a real world example, say your store manager of a department store that gets bought into, the power is restructered and the store is partnered with another store, that the new owners already own. Someone new is appointed regional manager for both stores (this would be Bischoffs' role), that new guy now has control over you and your store...thus he could fire you.

It's a lose off the top of my head comparision, but you can see what I'm saying.

I get what you're saying, but I was under the impression that Mick Foley was a (kayfabe) minority owner in TNA. Unless his stake was bought out, would he not still be a minority owner?

And yeah.. I know that it's weird that's the big thing bothering me in TNA, and not the Nasty Boyz winning or Scott Hall getting air-time over Samoa Joe. But, I don't mind if they're trying to push certain guys, just don't treat me like an idiot in the process.

[lazorbeak]

Your defense of WWE is, in my humble opinion, the biggest fault they have. They are complacent. They're the top dog by far, and they know it. There is no urgency to be surprising or awe inspiring, they ride thier name to the bank and call it a day.

I definitely agree WWE is complacent, and I certainly don't like that they hurt the business so much 9 years ago so that they could coast, but they do still have to occasionally produce, and when they have to, they do.

While I'm not going to defend every booking or business decision TNA makes, I will defend them for trying to be different, trying to be cutting edge, trying to be shocking and surprising.

Trying to steer this back to TNA, I certainly agree that it's good that they try to be different. But where does bringing in the Nastys, the Band, and re-doing one of the most famous finishes in another company's history fit into that? My gripe with all of that is that it's NOT different. On one of the WCW dvds put out by WWE, Bischoff basically outlined that his plan was to be different from WWF's then product: down to earth, serious storylines where workers could use their actual names and draw on their actual personalities. TNA has guys unlike anything WWE has: Hernandez is a big Latino who could easily be a big draw as TNA grows, Pope is a great worker who is incredibly charismatic, Daniels just for his skill and lack of size is unlike 98% of WWE's guys. My problem isn't that TNA isn't taking risks, it's that they're taking dumb risks. Bringing in Sean Waltman is a dumb risk. Running your own screwjob angle isn't being different.

Hell, I can in all honestly say that I have only been surprised ONCE by WWE's product in the past year, I was surprised when Sheamas won the Title from Cena. Other than that I know I don't have to watch every show or pay per view cause if I miss it, it's no big deal. I already know what's going to happen anyway.

That certainly surprised me, but Punk's slow-burning heel turn was probably my favorite "I did not see that coming" bit of the year. His program with Jeff Hardy was great stuff, and it's a shame Jeff's future is in doubt so Punk can't get a big Wrestlemania win for his trouble.

storylines need to exist in perfect right this second or else it is a trainwreck. Right?

:rolleyes:


Different opinions for different people. From a wrestling perspective, I find that WWE presents a pretty stale, generic, paint by numbers product, which translates to garbage in my opinion. You like that stuff. That's great!

:confused:

[jwt13]

Thats the thing I don't get people are quick to jump on Hogan saying this new direction sucks not going any where and so on but three shows he's been in charge of and he's setting some ground for some good storylines and really WWE has nothing but Vince/Bret going for them right now I mean if you have guest host every week how suck and have a Champion who has a bad time beating a opening spot monkey and your trying to make him look like a monster I mean come on. In TNA they are building and still growing and I think the've got somthing with AJ "Stylein and Proflien" Styles and I have enjoyed there shows for sometime know. With WWE I watch every week except for ECW and Superstars and its just uhhh you have a hard time haveing fun watching Raw and Smackdown. I do enjoy Smackdown more than Raw. But please if your gonna put your title on a young guy build him up first dont give him two matchs Vs Jamie Knoble and win a Ten man rumble and then put the title on him just cause he's HHH's work out buddy.

[sebsplex]

Trying to steer this back to TNA, I certainly agree that it's good that they try to be different. But where does bringing in the Nastys, the Band, and re-doing one of the most famous finishes in another company's history fit into that?

I can live with the Band for now, simply because it plays off well against Hogan's role in TNA. He's promising new beginnings, yet the Band have turned up looking for a final paycheck, no respect for the company besides riding it, etc, basically the opposite. The angle should force Hogan to put his cards on the table one way or the other and deal with them (although in truth Nash is the most interesting component of the storyline).

The Nastys are a different bag altogether. They're not relevant to TNA, they're not relevant to the wrestling in 2010, outside of 'inside' (I know this has been mentioned on Impact) knowledge of their friendship, there's no real storyline link between them and Hogan. They look dreadful in segments, worse in the ring, will badly damage the credibility of anyone they go over and worst, offer no sort of momentum or worth to anyone that goes over them. The already established teams in TNA should be going through these guys without breaking a sweat.

As for the screwjob finish... I guess I'm willing to see how it plays out fully... I just don't get how even if they wanted to create their own 'Montreal moment', where the sense is to make such a blatant reference to the WWF/E's history. Is it really that hard to create a finish that would achieve the same effect, yet have a different execution? Take the South Philly screwjob in WWE/ECW, scripted completely, clear purpose, yet it didn't feel like watching a rehash of a 10+ year old incident.

[tristram]

I don't think this is the case at all. I think we need to stop buying the perception that the internet media is putting out there. They have issued reports ranging from "Morale is great after inspiring speech from Hogan!" to "Everyone wants out! Hogan is terrible!" We just need to stop trying to be smarky about it and see what happens. I think Hogan is doing a good job right now personally. The only thing I hate that they've done is reenact the Montreal bit last night. To be fair though, the WWE does that seemingly twice a year.

The internet media? I don't read any of the internet sites, so I don't have a clue what the """"internet media""" has to say. How's that for """"smarky""""?

Nope, this is just my own opinion. To me, sadly, there's a lot of what happened in WCW in this. As I said, WCW wasn't all about Hogan. It included Flair and Bischoff, and before that through the NWA-WCW transition Ole Anderson, Bill Watts and Dusty Rhodes. And the underlying element to them all was instability within their under card. And that to me was one of the major elements of the death of WCW, the lack of willingness to firstly care, and then promote the undercard. Of course, the likes of the Giant, Sting, even Ron Simmons were all exceptions to that rule. Right now, the likes of MCMG, Lethal Consequences need to be exceptions to that rule. The home grown talents the likes of Joe, Daniels, they need a spotlight hanging above them too.

What is mostly disappointing about these turn of events is that you have TNA with several ... probably underutilised, but none the less points of difference to market your product on. The six sided ring with really I think helps explode the X Division because it gives more locations to go for a top rope move, which in particularly helps X Tag Matches, and the Knock Outs. I didn't see enough of Saeed to say it's the end of the world, but ... losing Amazing Kong is a tough tough blow. She's the biggest point of difference available to the mainstream American market. Granted, I haven't seen any of the SHIMMER's or any of the Japanese women's products, but here you have a legitimate brute to build a division around... and potentially here, through one of Hogan's pals Bubba the Love Sponge who has no place being involved in TNA in the first place, you're about to lose your most bankable commodity in a very important division to TNA. IMO, the Knock Outs drop plunkeys from a great distance all over the bottle blonds of the Diva Division. Because they have in the last 6-12 months at the least had a monster to play off, and genuine storylines to pursue. Personally, they're one of the reasons I have tuned in. Bubba the Love Sponge is one who shouldn't have been there, but neither should Nobs or Sags and the others of the Hulk Hogan class of 1988. This is TNA, it's time to grow the TNA home grown talent, because IMO, with the voice and overness of Hulk Hogan working behind them and pushing their talents by his promos, there's enough there for progressive growth into the wrestling market.

I have no problems adding in guys like Kennedy, RVD, Hardy, heck even Goldberg if the opportunity arose, because in 2010 they have name value and ... though I'm not sure on Goldberg, can still work good matches. I really don't have a problem with the 'Band', provided they are used to build others up. But anyone who comes in should be there to support and grow what they have, not cause backstage incidents, political turmoil and talents leaving left and right.

One other thing, I read Bashir went of his own accord a couple of months ago. Does anyone know why? I genuinely though World Elite could be used as a good stepping stone stable for a few talents, Bashir included.

[tristram]

I just think we are being way too harsh on TNA just because we can. They've basically had 4 televised shows now under the new regime and people are eviscerating them. The WWE has been ramming garbage down our throats for 5+ years. Let's give TNA a chance to play out the storylines before we start saying it's WCW all over again.

For the first time in 5-6 years I have sat through full TV tapings of wrestling. Maybe even longer, it was probably way back till the initial Invasion concept, before we knew it was going to be a WCW funeral procession.

I think people are trying to be fair with TNA. IMO, Kurt Angle right now is the best talent on the face of the planet. I don't get the PPVs, but the Impact match he had with Styles was outrageously good. Perhaps, just perhaps, he's even arisen above my perception of Bret Hart. The match between MCMG-Generation Me, best tag match I've seen in a very long time.

But this is the point - you have the elements to build outrageously good wrestling matches already in the building. Keep on adding your Desmond Wolfes, your Popes, young guys with agility and who will go. Bring in your personalities, as I've said, don't even mind the Band if used properly. Don't bring in the Nasty Boys and Bubba who can't add a single them but issues. Have the Hogan character do what he says he's going to do, I want to hear him praising Angle, praising the X division, confronting Joe from his 'lull' and breathe life back into him. I want the backstage segments to flow, not be ''smarky'', be genuinely interested in the in ring action. They will not overtake WWE this year, to me they're trying to go for the instant grand slam home run, take your time, and I'm sure thy can progressively build it up and go over.

In summary, I think you'll find the complete opposite. A lot of people WANT TNA to rise, they want genuine wrestling competition ala '97-99, but they are rightly pointing out that there are some stumbling blocks that it appears TNA are adamant are logical, which clearly they're not. If they kept it basic, and built intense storylines that had 'all out' blow off matches, then they will rise.

[Bigpapa42]

For the first time in 5-6 years I have sat through full TV tapings of wrestling. Maybe even longer, it was probably way back till the initial Invasion concept, before we knew it was going to be a WCW funeral procession.

I think people are trying to be fair with TNA. IMO, Kurt Angle right now is the best talent on the face of the planet. I don't get the PPVs, but the Impact match he had with Styles was outrageously good. Perhaps, just perhaps, he's even arisen above my perception of Bret Hart. The match between MCMG-Generation Me, best tag match I've seen in a very long time.

But this is the point - you have the elements to build outrageously good wrestling matches already in the building. Keep on adding your Desmond Wolfes, your Popes, young guys with agility and who will go. Bring in your personalities, as I've said, don't even mind the Band if used properly. Don't bring in the Nasty Boys and Bubba who can't add a single them but issues. Have the Hogan character do what he says he's going to do, I want to hear him praising Angle, praising the X division, confronting Joe from his 'lull' and breathe life back into him. I want the backstage segments to flow, not be ''smarky'', be genuinely interested in the in ring action. They will not overtake WWE this year, to me they're trying to go for the instant grand slam home run, take your time, and I'm sure thy can progressively build it up and go over.

In summary, I think you'll find the complete opposite. A lot of people WANT TNA to rise, they want genuine wrestling competition ala '97-99, but they are rightly pointing out that there are some stumbling blocks that it appears TNA are adamant are logical, which clearly they're not. If they kept it basic, and built intense storylines that had 'all out' blow off matches, then they will rise.

No surprise to me, Tristam, but I think our opinions on TNA are very similar. I have to admit that I am harsh on TNA in terms of critism. But its not because I enjoy hating them (I don't hate them) or want to see them fail. Its the opposite. I truly believe that with the talent they have, TNA can be what the WWE no longer is. They can become what they are aspiring to be and what they proclaim to be.

But no matter how much they proclaim it, being about wrestling means they need to actually be about the wrestling. Making backstage segments and repetitive storylines the focus instead of the in-ring action means you aren't about the wrestling. Hypocracy bothers me. At least the WWE is honest about not being about the wrestling anymore.

If TNA can actually practice what they preach and make the focus the in-ring wrestling, they will win me as a fan. They will get me buying PPVs regularly, instead of just tuning into the show each week. What they've shown me through the Hogan-era gives me no real reason to believe that will be the case.

[tristram]

You nailed it one. Preach what you say you are. And frankly, they are the promotion right now who can achieve exactly that. Their roster is stacked with players who can blow your mind. So... blow our minds. Let them do it in the ring, let them excite us, and have the backstage segments and promos simply... DRIVE the matches. Not some convuluted work-shoot, just drive the matches. Drive us to believe that Alex Shelley can be a big deal, that Samoa Joe is a dominating Samoan wrecking machine. I believe to a large extent from what I've seen they've got it right with Angle-Styles (bar any screwjobs) and Pope-Wolfe, and the reason for that has little to do with the build ups, its the in ring execution of the athletes involved. That's their strength, that's their point of difference, now exploit it ruthlessly.

[Moderndaywarrior]

That's exactly it, and probably the source of a lot of the frustrations from fans...wrestling,as it is, is not in a great state because of a lack of real competition up top;it needs real competition on top to realize its potential....I can remember years back when WCW had finally turned around and was just starting to beat out the WWE,I said to my friends "This is going to be good for wrestling" because I knew both companies would be forced to put out their best to hold that top spot and in the long run,which meant a better wrestling product than we had seen in few years.

The problem is when WCW did it,they competed by doing some hot angles highlighting their guys and bringing in elements like Lucha Libre that were mostly unknown in the U.S.....in effect they succeded by being different.

When WWE come back during the Attitude Era to take back the top spot, they did it shifting things around to present action and characters people had not been exposed to very much before....they also succeeded by being different.

Now with TNA, they want to compete but what they are doing now is worked shoot stuff and rolling out guys from the past....in effect they are coming off as being "WWE Lite".....people want an alternative,not the same stuff they see on WWE just with different guys.

[Wrestling Century]

My only hope is for something that I think is new and fresh is for ROH to come up and challenge WWE and TNA. I have never personally watched them but from what I've heard it sounds like a good formula:

1. Matches Finishes don't always end with a finishing move.
2. Focus on the matches themselves, while still have a storyline.
3. ROH is basically a stepping stone to WWE and TNA right now IMO.

Remember that this is all IMO, so no arguments!

[jwt13]

ROH is a good example of why TNA is now Sports Entertainment they noticed that if they stayed souly on wrestling they would never get a good following people who are not on internet fourms or youtube match watchers dont want to see just wrestling they want what WWE and WCW have been doing did and ROH is a good example they started at the same time as TNA pretty much and have really not grown to much popularity wise they do have good matches but with out SE they want grow to anything special or even remotly challenge WWE or TNA

[Bigpapa42]

ROH is a good example of why TNA is now Sports Entertainment they noticed that if they stayed souly on wrestling they would never get a good following people who are not on internet fourms or youtube match watchers dont want to see just wrestling they want what WWE and WCW have been doing did and ROH is a good example they started at the same time as TNA pretty much and have really not grown to much popularity wise they do have good matches but with out SE they want grow to anything special or even remotly challenge WWE or TNA

I'm not quite certain exactly what you're saying here... but I get that you're trying to say TNA can't be anything but pure SE if they want to be successful. This is based on what?

Using ROH as a point of comparison isn't particularly accurate. They built a fanbase based on nearly pure wrestling, with a roster very different from what TNA has. They've never had anywhere near the mainstream exposure that TNA managed just by being on Spike for the past few years.

Personally, I don't want to TNA to try to emulate ROH any more than I want to see them emulate the WWE. What I do want to see is a compromise in between. A focus on in-ring action, with angles and segments used to drive forward what happens in the ring. Right now, its the opposite. On TV, the matches are usually the after-thought. And I honestly might have less problem with TNA using this approach if they were just honest about. Yet they keep proclaiming ot be "about wrestling" and so different from the WWE. Hypocrisy.

[Hyde Hill]

Finally got around to watching Impact. Most that needed to be said has been said but I don't like the fact that the ramp is still leading all the way to the ring. Does it look kinda nice? Sure but it really limits the amount of high flying dives to the outside of the ring (, a kinda TNA trademark) plus brawling on the outside and anything that limits the move sets is bad imho. This combined with the fact that it looks like the crowd barriers are now closer to the ring is really limiting in an unnecessary way imho. And I actually noticed the "Crucial Crew" not being there as the crowd was really flat in the front row.

[dvdWarrior]

Finally got around to watching Impact. Most that needed to be said has been said but I don't like the fact that the ramp is still leading all the way to the ring. Does it look kinda nice? Sure but it really limits the amount of high flying dives to the outside of the ring (, a kinda TNA trademark) plus brawling on the outside and anything that limits the move sets is bad imho. This combined with the fact that it looks like the crowd barriers are now closer to the ring is really limiting in an unnecessary way imho. And I actually noticed the "Crucial Crew" not being there as the crowd was really flat in the front row.

Well, in all fairness, I think it was awful nice of them to set up the handicap ramp for some of the ... more senior... members of the new TNA's roster.

I'm kidding! I'm kidding!

:o:p:o

[stratusfaction]

Finally got around to watching Impact. Most that needed to be said has been said but I don't like the fact that the ramp is still leading all the way to the ring. Does it look kinda nice? Sure but it really limits the amount of high flying dives to the outside of the ring (, a kinda TNA trademark) plus brawling on the outside and anything that limits the move sets is bad imho. This combined with the fact that it looks like the crowd barriers are now closer to the ring is really limiting in an unnecessary way imho. And I actually noticed the "Crucial Crew" not being there as the crowd was really flat in the front row.

Sorry to say this but most of TNA trademarks are gone now...6 sided ring... An amazing knockouts division...more wrestling... but at least we have Hogan LMAO!

[FINisher]

From Gerweck
- Here is an update to the Awesome Kong requesting her TNA release story. The request was not solely due to the incident with Bubba the Love Sponge. Kong has indicated to friends and co-workers that she is having issues dealing with the recent passing of NWA promoter Ed Chuman. She apparently has not been herself and has suggested she needs time to adjust. Her issue with TNA centers around the company's unwillingness to work with her in allowing Kong to deal with the loss of her friend and promoter. Kong requested to be taken off the UK tour, but TNA denied her request. As a result, Kong requested her release.

- In an update to a story reported yesterday there is now talk that none of this year's TNA PPV events will be held on the road and will all take place in Orlando. Once again nothing is final but TNA has been losing money on road PPV's recently so this could be done as a cost cutting measure.

- The reviews from the talent regarding the new Impact set are mixed. Some have expressed their approval, but others feel the removal of the six sided ring has removed their identity.

- There is talk of bringing in Heidenreich to appear on a show or two.

WrestleView:

Honky Tonk Man is very close to signing a deal with TNA. The former Intercontinental champion has been in contact with TNA since early December.


.. FFS. :mad:

[James Casey]

If that Kong story is true, then TNA need a slap. Why would you make an unmotivated and upset worker fly halfway aroudn the world? Yes, she's an attraction - but it's not like they're so desperately short of big name talent right now that they need her to suck it up and keep working.

If it's true :p

[jwt13]

http://www.ewrestlingnews.com/stories/BREAKING_NEWS_TNA_Moving_To_Monday_Nights_Per.shtm l

WAR IS ON :)

[Craig Edwards]

that goods give them time to build the storylines and characters up more plus it looks like every other monday is going to be live.

[dcxbox]

that goods give them time to build the storylines and characters up more plus it looks like every other monday is going to be live.

rumor is tna will go live every other monday. one week live then next week taped. much like raw used to do. to save money for the time being with them eventually just moving to live every week.

what i wish tna would do is go live every week and move all ppvs out of the impact zone and sell ppvs as combo ppv/impact deals and the impact after a ppv is a 3 hour special impact. that way they can get out of orlando once a month

[Hyde Hill]

RVD on TNA in an interview with Slam Sports:

Now that his wife is cancer free and he has had a chance to recover from being burnt out from the WWE schedule, RVD isn't as adamant about returning to a national stage. He has been a buzz on the Internet about the possibility of going to TNA, to the point where WWE locked him out of his WWE.com profile because they thought he had signed with the company. He hasn't agreed to anything yet.

"I have some interest right now. For the longest time I have been saying no thanks, and recently it turned into a maybe. Now with the spotlight on TNA with Hogan being there, as much as people were talking about it before people are talking about it three times as much now. There is a lot of optimism in the air, maybe something will work out."


If this works out they can churn out as many Impacts as last one and I won't care lol.

[jesterx7769]

As much as I loved everything about him I think he would just end up being misused and he probably isn't as athletic as he once was.

[jesterx7769]

I don't like the Monday move, there is no way they can actually compete with the WWE. If they ever become a serious threat WWE can squash them in six months. Also, TNA keeps talking about fans but this hurts the fans b/c youre making them choose TNA or RAW, why not just put on a great show on Thursday in your junky little Universal gym? Seriously...

[jwt13]

Quick question didn't WWF use the Manhatten Center for every Raw back in the day for the first two years or so that Raw was on?

[Hyde Hill]

I don't like the Monday move, there is no way they can actually compete with the WWE. If they ever become a serious threat WWE can squash them in six months. Also, TNA keeps talking about fans but this hurts the fans b/c youre making them choose TNA or RAW, why not just put on a great show on Thursday in your junky little Universal gym? Seriously...

It is because a Monday night war draws in more "casual" fans and results into higher ratings period. Because of the excitement it brings etc and because Monday = wrestling night. Also TNA can not be squashed as long as Bob Carter doesn't want it to be squashed.

PS RVD can still go just watch his matches in Europe from last year if you can find them.

[Candyman]

Wow. Ouch. BIG mistake by TNA, they'll be back on Thursdays before long IMO. Is there a scheduling issue or something that prevents them from being live on Thursday? That would be the next logical step. How bout you do that, then see if you can get your ratings to half of Raw's, and then think about going head to head...or at least make sure you don't get slaughtered the next time you go head to head, when you don't have Hogan's debut bringing in a lot of curious one-time viewers.

[Johnny Fenoli]

Wow. Ouch. BIG mistake by TNA, they'll be back on Thursdays before long IMO. Is there a scheduling issue or something that prevents them from being live on Thursday? That would be the next logical step. How bout you do that, then see if you can get your ratings to half of Raw's, and then think about going head to head...or at least make sure you don't get slaughtered the next time you go head to head, when you don't have Hogan's debut bringing in a lot of curious one-time viewers.

I think the problem with being live EVERY week, whatever day... Is part of the TNA's appeal for some guys is the schedule. You work two days in a row, every two weeks, then you got the other time off. Free to be with family, or work other indies... Pretty good no?

[PeterHilton]

.

what i wish tna would do is go live every week and move all ppvs out of the impact zone and sell ppvs as combo ppv/impact deals and the impact after a ppv is a 3 hour special impact. that way they can get out of orlando once a month

How many times does this have to be said in this thread?

They are NOT selling enough tickets to move out of the Impact Zone yet. Not happening. Probably a year away at best.

[justtxyank]

How many times does this have to be said in this thread?

They are NOT selling enough tickets to move out of the Impact Zone yet. Not happening. Probably a year away at best.

Yep. They actually lose money when they go on the road for ppvs. This seems like something they might actually HAVE learned from WCW. Don't throw money away where you don't need to.

[Blackman]

Personally, I don't want to TNA to try to emulate ROH any more than I want to see them emulate the WWE. What I do want to see is a compromise in between. A focus on in-ring action, with angles and segments used to drive forward what happens in the ring.

Indeed. I thought that was supposed to be the whole idea. I was hooked from 2002, but after seeing a bunch of crappy matches and angles, i gave up all-together. What a freakshow it has become. :(

[lazorbeak]

Wow. Ouch. BIG mistake by TNA, they'll be back on Thursdays before long IMO. Is there a scheduling issue or something that prevents them from being live on Thursday? That would be the next logical step. How bout you do that, then see if you can get your ratings to half of Raw's, and then think about going head to head...or at least make sure you don't get slaughtered the next time you go head to head, when you don't have Hogan's debut bringing in a lot of curious one-time viewers.

No they won't. You really think Hulkster's going to tuck his tail between his legs and move the show to another night, even if the ratings suffer? Note that their Monday show did better ratings than they had ever done on Thursdays. Even if that's just a one-off, I don't see them losing face by just turning around and running back to Thursday nights.

Yep. They actually lose money when they go on the road for ppvs. This seems like something they might actually HAVE learned from WCW. Don't throw money away where you don't need to.

Sometimes you have to deal with minor losses in order to grow your promotion. WCW lost money 9 years out of 11, but if they don't spend the money in 1995 and 1996 you don't get to be the #1 promotion in the world by 1997. Traveling to major markets and performing in front of paying customers instead of cast members is part of the growing process.

Hiring the Nasty Boys? Throwing money away. Taking losses by going to major markets like Chicago or their old digs in Tennessee? Losses that make you look like a legitimate wrestling promotion.

[CQI13]

It is easy to spend other people's money. While I won't disagree on the Nasty Boys, as a business owner I can tell you that not all expenses to make you look bigger are worth it.

I've been to two trade shows in the past, probably spending upwards of $10,000 and didn't see a single sale. It would be asinine for me to go back unless I've developed something I'll be able to sell there.

Bringing that back to TNA, I'd rather they stay in Orlando for the moment, until they figure out who they are (WWE Lite? TNA? ROH Lite?), and gauge interest outside of Orlando some other way. Once you know you'll at least break even, THEN you venture out to different markets. I would think that their old stomping grounds would be a suitable second home, but I guess they moved for a reason?

[Tag01]

Where's Jeff Hardy? What's the deal? I was excited to see him on the big Hogan Impact debut. Then nothing. Was that a one time thing? If so, that's the most pointless bit ever.

[angeldelayette]

Where's Jeff Hardy? What's the deal? I was excited to see him on the big Hogan Impact debut. Then nothing. Was that a one time thing? If so, that's the most pointless bit ever.

My guess is they backed off after his latest arrest on drug charges. What a waste of God-given talent.

[Tag01]

My guess is they backed off after his latest arrest on drug charges. What a waste of God-given talent.

Was he arrested again after that appearance?

I want to like TNA. But they're making it hard. The Nasty Boys have been on my tv for the last 5 minutes; I'd much rather be watching Generation Me flying around the ring...

[jesterx7769]

Did anyone feel bad for the girl that Flair picked? She had a one in three shot of escaping his old man b*lls and lost :-P

[tristram]

Did anyone feel bad for the girl that Flair picked? She had a one in three shot of escaping his old man b*lls and lost :-P

Space Mountain may be the oldest ride in the park, but it still has the longest line.

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

[Candyman]

Did anyone feel bad for the girl that Flair picked? She had a one in three shot of escaping his old man b*lls and lost :-P

I've never been happier to have missed Impact in my life. (And I was VERY happy when I heard I missed the 'Orlando screwjob')

[jesterx7769]

Who all watched Impact last night and what did you think? This is the first time I have watched a full episode of impact since Angle was going through the divorce bit and booker t had an accent from some unknown country (watched last weeks too)

Honestly it was a bit of a lit down from last week. There weren't many matches which was dissapointed and I HATE this 8 card stud tournament you have to win a match to get into UH HELLO! It is just a 16 man tournament! Come on! They should have atleast had some triple threats or battle royals to get into the tournament. And I don't remember but was Anderson vs Jarrett even a match to get into the tournament?

Also, I know theyre pushing Hogan but I got really sick of him by the end of the show, he is in just about every segment and his crappy knock off nWo house music is really annoying.

Bobby Lashley= waste. Is even a draw? Especially considering the whole MMA thing, the good thing about it is they get publicity when he fights but if he ever becomes a serious MMA competitor (say he ends up beating Fedor for the HW title) Strikeforce probably wont let him do TNA anymore

And after all these years how is it Styles still seems out of place when he's in angles?

And what is with Raven and Rhyno? they are still on the roster but i didnt see them even when I watched a long time ago

Now time to throw in some positives, I like Wolfe, like his intensity and his character since its not too gimmicky. Also liked the way the X-Division title changed hands eventhough its like Money in the Bank match, but i think its a good way for heels to win since it doesnt take away from the champ.

[PeterHilton]

So let me get this straight:

Flair and AJ conspired to "screw" Angle...

Angle though Hogan was involved so he spits on Hulk.

Next week, we find out that it was Hebner paid off by Flair..so Hebner gets fired...but there's no real punishment for AJ

And Kurt is happy because at least he knows Hogan wasn't involved, so he's not going to demand a rematch, he's just gonna jump into the tourney thing.

And oh btw we have yet to really build Joe/AJ which is our main event at the next PPV

I know this is nitpicking, and wrestling doesn't have to be logical to be good, but why would you run a screwjob angle that seems to throw everything into complete chaos and then follow up with....nothing? No one even seems that bothered it happened?

[PeterHilton]

Oh and Lashley....


Bobby as a legitimate athlete face was ok. Nothing terrible but not at all exceptional.

Bobby as a heel who think he's "too good" for wrestling was interesting, if a little misguided because his wife had to cut all his promos.

Plus, he got bitched out by Abyss which is not good for a heel type.

So then...two weeks later..he apologizes and says he loves the fans..so he's a face again...but now Eric fires him ...so am I supposed to want him back?

wtf is goingon in that storyline?

[jesterx7769]

Totally agree with you on your first post but didnt say anything since I figured the generaly response would be "dont think too much its wrestling" even though it makes absolutley no sense. Also don't understand Abyss at ALL, why is he so afraid of getting fired? Just black hole slam Bischoff and get it over with, all of a sudden he went from being a monster to a borderline feminine retard?

[ColtCabana]

Just watched the latest edition of Impact. A few stupid angles, why the hell is Bubba the whoever he is on my tv screen? The Nasty Boys?

Still, I liked the 3 man tag and the 3 woman tag but I'm stll not sure why Anderson v Jarrett was the main event.

[Purple Cowboy]

Bubba is Hogan's boy and even gave deposition in Hogan's favor during his divorce procedings. Plus he has Hogan on his radio show like once per week. Guess Hogan felt like he owed him.

[jwt13]

TNA broke their Thursday ratings record this week with a 1.4

[PeterHilton]

TNA broke their Thursday ratings record this week with a 1.4

Yeah...I think all the publicity is kicking in.

Even when the shows are just ok, they are getting better and better ratings. Net fans are throwing up all over Hogan and Eric, but what they're doing is translating into viewers.

[PeterHilton]

Bubba is Hogan's boy and even gave deposition in Hogan's favor during his divorce procedings. Plus he has Hogan on his radio show like once per week. Guess Hogan felt like he owed him.

http://www.411mania.com/wrestling/news/128422/Hulk-Hogan-And-Eric-Bischoff//s-State-Of-TNA-Address.htm

Worth a read. It's Hogan and Eric's latest appearance on Bubba's show. They all come off as d-bags, but you do get to see some of the thought process.

[Remianen]

Yeah...I think all the publicity is kicking in.

Even when the shows are just ok, they are getting better and better ratings. Net fans are throwing up all over Hogan and Eric, but what they're doing is translating into viewers.

Not surprising. I mean, it's not like you need steak to attract pigeons.

[Waghlon]

I considered posting that as well but just couldnt wrap my head around the words i read...

"EB says he never crapped on Jericho, likes him, but doesn't think he can headline."

It makes my head hurt. It really does...

[PeterHilton]

I considered posting that as well but just couldnt wrap my head around the words i read...

"EB says he never crapped on Jericho, likes him, but doesn't think he can headline."

It makes my head hurt. It really does...

Eric's least likable character trait is his inability to admit mistakes. His book is page after page of excuses for why WCW failed, nothing having to do with hi creative decisions or the way they ran the nWo into the ground...he says something similar in the interview

"oh why did we lose to the Rock and the WWF? because Turner made us be more family friendly, not because or shows were crap or anything..."

[jesterx7769]

Interesting read, the probably I have with interviews like that is you dont know whats worked and whats real

[Basmat01]

I considered posting that as well but just couldnt wrap my head around the words i read...

"EB says he never crapped on Jericho, likes him, but doesn't think he can headline."

It makes my head hurt. It really does...

Jericho responded to Eric

He wrote on his Twitter "Bischoffs right I can't headline in TNA...Cos im not in my 50's"

[BHK1978]

Yep. They actually lose money when they go on the road for ppvs. This seems like something they might actually HAVE learned from WCW. Don't throw money away where you don't need to.

I agree they make next to nothing on the road.

When they came up here two years ago to do Joe vs. Angle in Lowell, MA (Lockdown). it was their biggest show at the time attendance wise. And there was maybe like three thousand people there tops, in fact a good portion of the arena was empty. So they must have lost money that night.

[alden]

Tna is a regional promotion with a great tv slot. Pure and simple. That is not a bad thing but to be honest they are a south eastern company. They go out of florida.....heck even out of orlando and they will bomb. I would love to see how they do in an arena in orlando that people would have to pay to get into. Just to see how they would do. I am a tna fan, big time but i am also realistic that they need to stay put.

[sabataged]

Tna is a regional promotion with a great tv slot. Pure and simple. That is not a bad thing but to be honest they are a south eastern company. They go out of florida.....heck even out of orlando and they will bomb. I would love to see how they do in an arena in orlando that people would have to pay to get into. Just to see how they would do. I am a tna fan, big time but i am also realistic that they need to stay put.

I went to the St Louis Lockdown in 2007. I was never a fan of TNA but the tickets were only $18 so I figured hell I couldn't pass that up. They had about 3800 people in a 5-6000 arena so it was fairly close to being sold out. I was about 10 rows back which was pretty cool. Overall an excellent time. I think if they do venture out they should never go above 5000 seat arena's because I just don't seem them selling them out.

[Nedew]

They had about 3800 people in a 6000 arena so it was fairly close to being sold out.

How is less than 2 thirds 'close to being sold out'?

[cappyboy]

How is less than 2 thirds 'close to being sold out'?

Okay. So you edit his post and then criticize the point he was making with the edited math? Not saying you're wrong to question his "close to being sold out". But you could have framed your conclusion better without the number shifting

[sabataged]

How is less than 2 thirds 'close to being sold out'?

3800 out of 5000 is over 75% so I would say nearly sold out yes. And this was 3 years ago so I think they could hit 5000 by now

[PeterHilton]

3800 out of 5000 is over 75% so I would say nearly sold out yes. And this was 3 years ago so I think they could hit 5000 by now

Based on their latest run of live show figures, you'd be wrong.

[masterded]

Wasn't TNA giving away tickets the day of the show to help fill the building? (Not saying most of the people didn't pay just some)

[MrCanada]

^^ The problem with TNA. they came to Oshawa (Toronto basically) and did 1500 and thought that was so good they would come back and do a PPV. And they gave tickets away for that house show.

When ROH comes to town, they do about... lets seee... 1500. I guess they're national.

[masterded]

Based on their latest run of live show figures, you'd be wrong.

Though I agree the house so numbers are not a good sign I don't know how well they can be use to dictate PPV attendance. I mean they would at least advertise a PPV (I would hope). Also it wouldn't be a weak roster like a good number of the house shows get (I know last time they came up here I didn't go due to who wasn’t going to be on the show and no way am I alone).

[TNAfan123]

^^ The problem with TNA. they came to Oshawa (Toronto basically) and did 1500 and thought that was so good they would come back and do a PPV. And they gave tickets away for that house show.

When ROH comes to town, they do about... lets seee... 1500. I guess they're national.
No what it is is lack of advertiseing if they did that properly they could get depending on the place 5 to 10,000 people at a house show easy and I hope thats something Bischoff we help TNA out with.

[brashleyholland]

3800 out of 5000 is over 75% so I would say nearly sold out yes. And this was 3 years ago so I think they could hit 5000 by now

Three quarters full is not nearly sold out. 4800 would be nearly sold out. But a 5000 seat arena (pretty small) having 1200 empty seats is awful.

[PeterHilton]

^^ The problem with TNA. they came to Oshawa (Toronto basically) and did 1500 and thought that was so good they would come back and do a PPV. And they gave tickets away for that house show.

When ROH comes to town, they do about... lets seee... 1500. I guess they're national.

No no no..based on the thread in the general discussion section, 1500 fans in Canada makes them International. And EVERYONE in England knows who they are, so they could actually be Global.

Also, Dixie Carter is a fan of Star Trek. So arguably, they could even be Intergalactic.

[MrCanada]

No no no..based on the thread in the general discussion section, 1500 fans in Canada makes them International. And EVERYONE in England knows who they are, so they could actually be Global.

Also, Dixie Carter is a fan of Star Trek. So arguably, they could even be Intergalactic.

So, ROH is also National? And WWE is........

I think the honest to god problem (this just occured to me) is people are trying to measure from the bottom up. You have to relate from the top down. if WWE is global, or WWE is international, or what have you. Then this promotion, be it TNA, ROH, or whatever, must be this.

[masterded]

Though I do agree with you two lets not start that discussion here too.

[PeterHilton]

Though I agree the house so numbers are not a good sign I don't know how well they can be use to dictate PPV attendance. I mean they would at least advertise a PPV (I would hope). Also it wouldn't be a weak roster like a good number of the house shows get (I know last time they came up here I didn't go due to who wasn’t going to be on the show and no way am I alone).

It's not a perfect indicator, but I'm not risking a bunch of empty seats on a live PPV unless it were a super show and I'd been advertising for weeks.

And let's face it, TNA does a sh*t job building their PPVs. The main event for the next PPV is Joe/AJ...how much has that been built?

No what it is is lack of advertiseing if they did that properly they could get depending on the place 5 to 10,000 people at a house show easy and I hope thats something Bischoff we help TNA out with.

10 k fans? Easy? You're insane. They just aren't there yet.

Three quarters full is not nearly sold out. 4800 would be nearly sold out. But a 5000 seat arena (pretty small) having 1200 empty seats is awful.

This.

[jesterx7769]

Has anyone been to their shows in Orlando? now that I live in Florida I am thiking of going so was hoping to hear from some1 first hand

[PeterHilton]

So, ROH is also National? And WWE is........


Based on that logic? The WWE is Pan-Dimensional. They are allowed to run shows throughout the space-time continuum and in alternate versions of our own reality.

[TNAfan123]

Based on that logic? The WWE is Pan-Dimensional. They are allowed to run shows throughout the space-time continuum and in alternate versions of our own reality.

:rolleyes:

[PeterHilton]

:rolleyes:

Hey, if the TNA nutjobs want to claim that TNA is a "National" or "International" company - even though they've never drawn a large paying crowd anywhere, they have to give away tickets to their TV and PPV tapings, and their buy-rates are negligible - then the WWE must be so powerful that they are altering our perceptions of reality.

Like a new pantheon of demi-gods or something.

[lazorbeak]

No what it is is lack of advertiseing if they did that properly they could get depending on the place 5 to 10,000 people at a house show easy and I hope thats something Bischoff we help TNA out with.

Wow...... just wow. They could double their all-time best attendance figures at a house show? That would really be something, I guess.

[TNAfan123]

Wow...... just wow. They could double their all-time best attendance figures at a house show? That would really be something, I guess.

Read what I said ok I siad with the right advertising (Spell Check) they could ok so reread it if you need to because with the names that TNA has they could get 10,000 people

[brashleyholland]

Read what I said ok I siad with the right advertising (Spell Check) they could ok so reread it if you need to because with the names that TNA has they could get 10,000 people

Just...no.

It's not a lack of advertising that's the problem, it's a lack of 10,000 people willing to attend a TNA show.

[justtxyank]

Just...no.

It's not a lack of advertising that's the problem, it's a lack of 10,000 people willing to attend a TNA show.

I think he's a kid so I'd give this up.

[PeterHilton]

Read what I said ok I siad with the right advertising (Spell Check) they could ok so reread it if you need to because with the names that TNA has they could get 10,000 people

ROFL

You're being delusional.

10 K fans? at a house show? Even though their biggest names don't routinely work their house shows?

[MrCanada]

Read what I said ok I siad with the right advertising (Spell Check) they could ok so reread it if you need to because with the names that TNA has they could get 10,000 people

No... just... no... and spell check...

By YOUR logic, TNA is bigger then WWE because WWE doesnt average 10,000 for a house show. I hate TNA fans SO much.

And I'm not a WWE fan. I like all wrestling equally (even TNA). It all has ups and downs. But why do TNA fans feel the need to always say how good they are and not just except reality?

TNA is the second biggest company in North America. correct. But are they anywhere near the level of WWE? no.

WWE TV gets 15,000 (give or take) PAID through the door. TNA TV gets 1500 FREE through the door. So TNA is 1/10th the size of WWE in that sense.

WWE house shows get 7000 I'd say on average (that could be wrong, usually its between 5000 and 9000 so) and TNA gets 500-750, call it 625. That makes them 1/11th the size of WWE.

TNA PPV gets around 35,000 buys (for their big ppvs) (and some are WAY lower then that) and WWE gets "low" 235,000 buys. So TNA is 1/6th the size of WWE there. And thats not measuring against the 1,000,000 or so that get Mania (WWE's biggest PPV) which would make TNA 1/28th the size of WWE.

All you are allowed to measure is TRUTH and FACT. This isnt Fox news with hypothetical, fantasy, & opinion.

Whether TEW terms apply or not is really the thing that should be debated. But being as this is GDS's board they do. Drawing 1500 people is cult. DEAL with it.

And dont do what typical TNA fans do and use TNA's best number vs. WWE's worst. Or just TNA's best. Sure maybe they drew 3000 to a house show once (dont know if thats true just made it up) but that doenst count.

[Craig Edwards]

profile says he is 34

[lazorbeak]

Read what I said ok I siad with the right advertising (Spell Check) they could ok so reread it if you need to because with the names that TNA has they could get 10,000 people

Maybe you need to re-read what I "siad." You're saying they could sell over 5,000 tickets more than they ever have in their history at a house show. This is the same company that can't afford to go on tour and can't fill a venue of less than 2,000 on a regular basis. That's not just wrong, that's laugh out loud wrong.

If and when TNA leaves the Impact Zone and can show they can sell tickets at actual arenas anywhere close to the 5K mark, then they'll be on the road to the kind of numbers you're talking about. But not only are they not there, they can't even see there from where they are.

[TNAfan123]

No... just... no... and spell check...

By YOUR logic, TNA is bigger then WWE because WWE doesnt average 10,000 for a house show. I hate TNA fans SO much.

And I'm not a WWE fan. I like all wrestling equally (even TNA). It all has ups and downs. But why do TNA fans feel the need to always say how good they are and not just except reality?

TNA is the second biggest company in North America. correct. But are they anywhere near the level of WWE? no.

WWE TV gets 15,000 (give or take) PAID through the door. TNA TV gets 1500 FREE through the door. So TNA is 1/10th the size of WWE in that sense.

TNA PPV gets around 35,000 buys (for their big ppvs) (and some are WAY lower then that) and WWE gets "low" 235,000 buys. So TNA is 1/6th the size of WWE there. And thats not measuring against the 1,000,000 or so that get Mania (WWE's biggest PPV) which would make TNA 1/28th the size of WWE.

All you are allowed to measure is TRUTH and FACT. This isnt Fox news with hypothetical, fantasy, & opinion.

Whether TEW terms apply or not is really the thing that should be debated. But being as this is GDS's board they do. Drawing 1500 people is cult. DEAL with it.

No where in what I said says that TNA is bigger than WWE I know that isn't true I like WWE too but some are just to stupid to understand some things but I'm not talking to you Mr.Canda

[brashleyholland]

profile says he is 34

Dog years? :p

[MrCanada]

No where in what I said says that TNA is bigger than WWE I know that isn't true I like WWE too but some are just to stupid to understand some things but I'm not talking to you Mr.Canda

I know. but if WWE is by definition National in America, aka recognized throughout the country, how can TNA be ANYWHERE near them?

WWE being a global company is because they are also national in pretty much all other countries as well.

So if TNA is basically a sliver to WWE's Giant Redwood (CVERSE~!) how can it at all beconsiderd a National promotion?

EDIT:

And what Slim Jim said is why I went on my TNA vs. WWE rant. Because you implied with your made-up math TNA was in fact a bigger company then WWE but with bad advertising.

[Slim Jim]

Recent Raw house show in New York drew 9000 fans. NY is a pretty easy area for WWE to draw a crowd, and they still didn't get the 10000 you claim TNA can get with the right advertising. (by the by, on the same night TNA drew 900 fans in Montreal)

Suggesting that TNA could get 10000 fans to a house show, when WWE don't even pull that many implies you think TNA are the bigger company... which is just so obviously wrong.

[PeterHilton]

No where in what I said says that TNA is bigger than WWE I know that isn't true I like WWE too but some are just to stupid to understand some things but I'm not talking to you Mr.Canda

Listen..you said that TNA could draw 10 K fans "easy" to a house show.

WWE doesn't draw that many fans to house shows, therefore your claim would make TNA more popular than WWE.

MrC is just showing you how and why - specifically, using actual data - you're wrong to make that claim that TNA could draw 10 k fans to a house show.

Then lazorbeak re-affirmed it.

This is a pretty unbiased board (TNA and WWE get it both equally imo) but it's a bad, bad place to use broad statements without being able to back them up.

[masterded]

No where in what I said says that TNA is bigger than WWE I know that isn't true I like WWE too but some are just to stupid to understand some things but I'm not talking to you Mr.Canda

Recent Raw house show in New York drew 9000 fans. NY is a pretty easy area for WWE to draw a crowd, and they still didn't get the 10000 you claim TNA can get with the right advertising. (by the by, on the same night TNA drew 900 fans in Montreal)

Suggesting that TNA could get 10000 fans to a house show, when WWE don't even pull that many implies you think TNA are the bigger company... which is just so obviously wrong.

Yeah, what he said. What you said may not have been directly with advertising TNA would be bigger then WWE, but that is what one would intrepid the results you expect of TNA house shows with advertising to mean. Which adds up to your expectations being over inflated.

Would advertising help TNA house shows? Sure, but nowhere near as much as you seem to think.

[Wrestling Century]

Does the 8 card stud tournament take place at the Against All Odds PPV? And is there no TNA World Title match at Against All Odds? If that's the case, that looks like a pretty crappy PPV to me.

[SeanMcFly]

profile says he is 34

Welcome to Forums buddy...

"Wur Splleng dosn't mattir at al"

:D

[jwt13]

Does the 8 card stud tournament take place at the Against All Odds PPV? And is there no TNA World Title match at Against All Odds? If that's the case, that looks like a pretty crappy PPV to me.

The title match is Joe V. Styles and how can you say it looks crappy when most of the matches have not been confirmed yet?

[Nedew]

Okay. So you edit his post and then criticize the point he was making with the edited math? Not saying you're wrong to question his "close to being sold out". But you could have framed your conclusion better without the number shifting

He said 5-6000, i made it clear i was using the higher estimate.

[SaySo]

My friend told me that he went to Bash at the Beach a decade ago headlined by Hogan and Vader. He said that him and his family were able to attend the event for free since they let people in. Did the BatB always offer free tickets? Or is this a practice common within the wrestling business or any business of giving people a free sampling?

[lazorbeak]

My friend told me that he went to Bash at the Beach a decade ago headlined by Hogan and Vader. He said that him and his family were able to attend the event for free since they let people in. Did the BatB always offer free tickets? Or is this a practice common within the wrestling business or any business of giving people a free sampling?

It's always been pretty common practice to give away tickets the night of a show to fill tickets. I'm not sure if it's still practiced today, but it was a pretty par for the course thing for WCW, especially as they were suddenly miraculously filling much larger venues.

[alden]

I believe that bash you are talking about was the one on the beach wasen't it? If that is the one you are talking about everyone got in free It was on a public beach and they could not charge. Just like when nitro was at mall of america. They could not charge because it was a public mall and they let everyone see the show for free.

[SaySo]

I believe that bash you are talking about was the one on the beach wasen't it? If that is the one you are talking about everyone got in free It was on a public beach and they could not charge. Just like when nitro was at mall of america. They could not charge because it was a public mall and they let everyone see the show for free.

Yes, it was in Huntington Beach, California, 1995. That seems like that was the case since of its locale.

Reminds me of when TNA was in the live Impact in Las Vegas one-two years ago.

[ColtCabana]

My friend told me that he went to Bash at the Beach a decade ago headlined by Hogan and Vader. He said that him and his family were able to attend the event for free since they let people in. Did the BatB always offer free tickets? Or is this a practice common within the wrestling business or any business of giving people a free sampling?

Hog/Road Wild PPV was free too

[cappyboy]

He said 5-6000, i made it clear i was using the higher estimate.

And skewing things to make him look extra silly in the process. His "close to" was questionable enough at 5k. No need to sledgehammer the point by rounding up.

[Hyde Hill]

Giving away free tickets is standard practice, the E still does it as well. 3.8 of 5 is not near full but decently attended lol. 5-10 k on TNA house shows no way that is happening anytime soon. Actual house show numbers vary A lot 300 - 1500. Latest house show numbers and merch sales compared to last year are (way) up though according too various sources.

Right now they need to focus on getting on monday live each week. Then move the ppv's out of the zone again. Then either go on the road or have a home stadium (paid) for Impact. In the meantime House shows are more advertisement in themselves then an avenue of income.

TNA in TEW terms is Cult with a strong fanbase in the UK.

[Nedew]

And skewing things to make him look extra silly in the process. His "close to" was questionable enough at 5k. No need to sledgehammer the point by rounding up.

Like Triple H, I'm a fan of the sledgehammer :)

[justtxyank]

To clear something up, WCW gave away attendance in their prime for a few pay-per-views which ended up being a DISASTER for them financially. They were being incredibly stupid and it cost them a fortune. The Roadwild ppvs sent money down the drain. When they did it for Nitro it was equally stupid.

No smart wrestling organization gives away tickets that they don't have to. The WWE sells as many tickets as they can before they start giving away free tickets.

[Wrestling Century]

The title match is Joe V. Styles and how can you say it looks crappy when most of the matches have not been confirmed yet?

Oh. I thought that with the whole tournament thing going on and with AJ saying that he and Ric were off for the month, I thought that the tournament was on the PPV and there wasn't going to be a title match.

[brashleyholland]

To clear something up, WCW gave away attendance in their prime for a few pay-per-views which ended up being a DISASTER for them financially. They were being incredibly stupid and it cost them a fortune. The Roadwild ppvs sent money down the drain. When they did it for Nitro it was equally stupid.



Surely they only gave away unsold tickets on the day or two before the show? Thats a question not a statement by the way, I haven't a clue :-p

I guess if they were papering *EVERY* Nitro, people got wise to it and just hung around waiting for spare tickets. I've a similar thing happen with my local football team. They moved to a bigger ground and just couldn't fill it. 10 mins after kick-off they would just open the gates or charge a small, nominal fee - figuring that money spent at the concessions would at least make them something back.

In the end they had to can it because the walk-ups just waited until 10-15 mins in listening to the game on the radio outside, waiting for their inevitable free ticket :-p

[CQI13]

Hog/Road Wild was always free when it was held outdoors. It gave it a different feel, but awful financially.

And as for Nitros, I remember when I went to the next to last Nitro, they were filming the last Thunder (two shows for the price of one!), and they were also giving away 1 ticket for everyone you bought.

[justtxyank]

Surely they only gave away unsold tickets on the day or two before the show? Thats a question not a statement by the way, I haven't a clue :-p

I guess if they were papering *EVERY* Nitro, people got wise to it and just hung around waiting for spare tickets. I've a similar thing happen with my local football team. They moved to a bigger ground and just couldn't fill it. 10 mins after kick-off they would just open the gates or charge a small, nominal fee - figuring that money spent at the concessions would at least make them something back.

In the end they had to can it because the walk-ups just waited until 10-15 mins in listening to the game on the radio outside, waiting for their inevitable free ticket :-p

As mentioned above me, they did the Road Wild ppv at the Sturges bike rally and charged nothing for admission. It was retarded. Say what you want about Jay Leno being involved in wrestling, but that ppv could have sold some tickets.

They also had bad judgment in they they frequently went to smaller venues to hold Nitros and ppvs when they could sell more.

[DaMegaFish]

NEWS BREAK-

Rumor has it Hulk and Eric are looking to bring back the Dupp Cupp. Stan Dupp also known as Trevor Murdoch has already been contacted as has Bo Dupp. No word of if the ticket lady or Tiny the time keeper will return however.

--------------------------


Okay so thats not true...sadly.

Anyway, am I the only one who hates having a Global and World title? WHAT THE EFF IS THE DIFFERENCE?!

[PeterHilton]

As mentioned above me, they did the Road Wild ppv at the Sturges bike rally and charged nothing for admission. It was retarded. Say what you want about Jay Leno being involved in wrestling, but that ppv could have sold some tickets.

They also had bad judgment in they they frequently went to smaller venues to hold Nitros and ppvs when they could sell more.

Bash at the Beach was also free to the public, and they would often film Nitros at Panama Beach (IIRC) during Spring Break...

[CQI13]

The same as between an Intercontinental and World Title?

[DaMegaFish]

The same as between an Intercontinental and World Title?

Pretty much, but I personally don't associate the words Intercontinental and World as closely together as Global and World. At least intercontinental is more of different term that is used far less as a synonym as Global and World.

[Hyde Hill]

Yep International would have been a much better name for it.

[DaMegaFish]

Yep International would have been a much better name for it.

Is that supposed to be sarcastic?

Anyway, rumor mill says that TNA is a green light on moving to Monday nights in the near future, being live just about every other week. The speculated time slot is 8-10pm or 9-11pm. I would assume those are EST but the article didn't say.

[CQI13]

EST would be correct. Especially with the company being based in the east coast.

[Hyde Hill]

Is that supposed to be sarcastic?

Anyway, rumor mill says that TNA is a green light on moving to Monday nights in the near future, being live just about every other week. The speculated time slot is 8-10pm or 9-11pm. I would assume those are EST but the article didn't say.

Nope as International/Intercontinental etc isn't associated with world as closely, other name could have been (North) American. But that is assuming you want to use it as a midcard/uppermidcard title open to all styles/weights.

What time slot is RAW EST? As if I was TNA I would preempt them by an hour.

[CQI13]

RAW is 9-11 EST (unless they do the 3 hour one, which starts at 8).

It would behoove TNA to start from 8-10.

[thepeopleschamp]

I think TNA is doing a good thing going head to head with WWE because the at least it might push Vince to pick his product off the ground and do better because right now its just not working for anyone over 11 It is getting a little bit better I watch both WWE and TNA like TNA a little more than WWE right now and I want this to lead to Monday Night Wars pt.2 it could only help if TNA does it right.

[jwt13]

TNA will hold Lockdown in St Louis according to Dixie Carters twitter

[Stennick]

Nice Elimination Chamber and Lockdown here in St. Louis could be a fun year.

[CQI13]

I remember they held it there a few years back (when Scott Steiner pulled off the Frankensteiner, was it not)? Hopefully they break even.

[sabataged]

I remember they held it there a few years back (when Scott Steiner pulled off the Frankensteiner, was it not)? Hopefully they break even.


I went to it last time around. The ticket cost be $18 and I was less than 20 rows back or something like that. It was a nice little show they have lethal lockdown with team christian vs team angle I think.

[Stennick]

Yeah I bet tickets are going to be cheap (not worried about it selling out) so I'll go just so I can say I saw them live.

[sabataged]

Yeah I bet tickets are going to be cheap (not worried about it selling out) so I'll go just so I can say I saw them live.

It was a good show. They play to the crowd a lot more than WWE ever does on TV. Plus being at the Family Arena it's not so spaced out like Kiel is. I'll be there depending on what date the show is. I tried looking it up but can't find a date for it

[alden]

I did not think i would ever hear anyone call that one a good show lol. Remember that was the one with team 3d vs lax in a electrified cage match *shutter*

[nucleardonkey]

I gotta say the more I see Abyss the more I love the new character. What's more dangerous than a 6'8 350 pound guy who thinks he's still a child? I really wish they'd give him something more than just a quicky segment here or there.

[cappyboy]

I gotta say the more I see Abyss the more I love the new character. What's more dangerous than a 6'8 350 pound guy who thinks he's still a child? I really wish they'd give him something more than just a quicky segment here or there.

I don't know how new I'd say the character is. He's been playing it for the better part of a year now. But he does play it well.

And while I'm here, allow me to say two things about Tomko.

1: He really shocked me tonight. I never expected to be impressed by anything Tomko did. But I gotta say that powerslam he gave Angle was pretty darn sweet. Nice and fluid and a really good snap on it. It's still not much to recommend him on but every journey starts with a single step.

2: Is it just me or has he put a few "vanity pounds" on? I pretty sure I saw the beginnings of some fat on him. Nothing significant enough to take away from his impressive look but enough that he might want to work them off.

[Stennick]

So I caught the last five minutes of tonights show.

1. Why was Nash and Foley fighting in a hardcore match?

2. Why did Hall and Waltman attack Nash?

3. If Hall didn't wrestle at Genesis because he didn't ilke the way he looked in tights, how does he ever expect to wrestle it doesn't look like that gut has gone down any in the last month.

4. Is Bischoff a heel making Jarrett wrestle matches against heels that put him against the odds? And if Bischoff is a heel and Hogan is a face? I just don't understand but I'm sure its because I don't watch the shows.

[Hyde Hill]

Bisschoff (, but sometimes makes "good" executive decisions,) is a heel and so are waltman and hall, Hogan is caught in the middle and mainly a face, so is Nash but he is more a heel but not sticking up for Hall and walt as he doesn't agree with their actions and he wants to remain employed. It's really not that hard sometimes but it is confusing if you don't watch regularly and that is a problem if you want to attract new viewers. Jarrett is a face again after the whole lawyer thing which was prolly used to make up for the mistake during the live show where Jarrett outfaced Hogan when it was supposed to be the other-way around.

[cappyboy]

So I caught the last five minutes of tonights show.

1. Why was Nash and Foley fighting in a hardcore match?

Two reasons.

1: Because Bischoff was trying to punish Mick for sticking to his guns and stating publically his distaste for having to associate with Easy E.

2: Because Bischoff was taking advantage of Nash's recent history with Foley to extract a favor from Big Sexy

2. Why did Hall and Waltman attack Nash?

No clue. Hopefully they will answer that next week.

3. If Hall didn't wrestle at Genesis because he didn't ilke the way he looked in tights, how does he ever expect to wrestle it doesn't look like that gut has gone down any in the last month.

Dude, this is Scott Hall you're talking about. If you could find two unpickled cells to rub together anywhere in his body, I'm not sure they'd even be willing to associate with each other. And I'm positive neither of them would be in what now passes for his brain. The last time those cells functioned we were all still concerned about the Y2K bug.

4. Is Bischoff a heel making Jarrett wrestle matches against heels that put him against the odds? And if Bischoff is a heel and Hogan is a face? I just don't understand but I'm sure its because I don't watch the shows.

No. Believe me it's not. I've been trying to make sense of the Bischoff/Hogan/Jarrett relationship since Mr America arrived in TNA. I've been faring about as well as the alien computer in some early sci-fi movie after it's been asked to divide by zero. Bischoff + Hogan + Jarrett is the very definition of not computing.

[sabataged]

Two reasons.

1: Because Bischoff was trying to punish Mick for sticking to his guns and stating publically his distaste for having to associate with Easy E.

2: Because Bischoff was taking advantage of Nash's recent history with Foley to extract a favor from Big Sexy



No clue. Hopefully they will answer that next week.



Dude, this is Scott Hall you're talking about. If you could find two unpickled cells to rub together anywhere in his body, I'm not sure they'd even be willing to associate with each other. And I'm positive neither of them would be in what now passes for his brain. The last time those cells functioned we were all still concerned about the Y2K bug.



No. Believe me it's not. I've been trying to make sense of the Bischoff/Hogan/Jarrett relationship since Mr America arrived in TNA. I've been faring about as well as the alien computer in some early sci-fi movie after it's been asked to divide by zero. Bischoff + Hogan + Jarrett is the very definition of not computing.

The Jarrett/Hogan/Bischoff thing is confusing but here is my take on it.

They started of they were going to make Eric and Hulk the faces and Jeff the heel. But fans crapped all over it. Hulk they can cheer, Easy E...never ever can the fans bring their selves to cheer for the guy. So basically I think it is going to end up like this. Bischoff is the heel obviously. He has The Band doing his dirty work. Hulk is trying to remain neutral. He will keep getting mixed up in the situation as he has allegiances with Eric but wants to stay the good guy for the friends. Their are time he is going to look like he is turning heel (Screwing Angle) but he will continue to play the "It wasn't me card". Eric will continue to try and bash Jarrett and screw him over repeatedly to make him look like the bad guy. But after it's all said and done Hogan and Jarrett will end up being the faces trying to save TNA together side by side against Bischoff as he is "destroying it". Uneasy alliance or whatever. Hell I would be surprised to see some sort of stable like Foley, Hogan, Jarrett and Sting vs who ever is on Eric's side by the time this all comes together.

[Stennick]

Sab you just made that make sense please apply for their head writing job. I would watch every week if you wrote their shows.

[cappyboy]

The Jarrett/Hogan/Bischoff thing is confusing but here is my take on it.

They started of they were going to make Eric and Hulk the faces and Jeff the heel. But fans crapped all over it. Hulk they can cheer, Easy E...never ever can the fans bring their selves to cheer for the guy. So basically I think it is going to end up like this. Bischoff is the heel obviously. He has The Band doing his dirty work. Hulk is trying to remain neutral. He will keep getting mixed up in the situation as he has allegiances with Eric but wants to stay the good guy for the friends. Their are time he is going to look like he is turning heel (Screwing Angle) but he will continue to play the "It wasn't me card". Eric will continue to try and bash Jarrett and screw him over repeatedly to make him look like the bad guy. But after it's all said and done Hogan and Jarrett will end up being the faces trying to save TNA together side by side against Bischoff as he is "destroying it". Uneasy alliance or whatever. Hell I would be surprised to see some sort of stable like Foley, Hogan, Jarrett and Sting vs who ever is on Eric's side by the time this all comes together.

I hope you're right and something like this comes about. It would make for a really good salvage job on TNA Creative's part. Because trying to make Jarrett the heel so abruptly after the last year plus of battling Angle and then whole MEM scenario wasn't going to fly. Even if it might have been Jarrett's natural state prior to that. Folks had gotten too accustomed to cheering for him to just go "Okay, he's whole now. We can go back to hating him."

I have my reservations about Hogan/Bischoff seeing how much the base would appreciate this. Sounds a little TEW to happen in reality. But we've see some really oddball stuff over the last decade or so. So I guess it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility.

[UkWrestleFan]

Surely if they wanted to turn Double J heel they should've just have him beat the crap out of somebody who TNA love...Sting. They still could I suppose.

But really, who knows what's going on in TNA these days.

[Blackman]

ROFL. Been watching some impact episodes.

WTF man, what's up with the recycled gimmicks? It's like watching a rerun of WWE years ago.

[jesterx7769]

Just watched last nights impace (DVR) and I was pretty dissapointed. Didn't understand the AJ/Pope match at all, I get that it hypes up Pope but is it worth the cost of making your CHAMPION look bad? Pope wasn't even on last week! Nice to see Joe back though (way to keep him off the air the past two weeks)

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Waltman & Hall= big waste of time and money. Even if people recognize them they'll just say "wow scott hall looks like my fat drunk uncle"

Tag Match= meh.

Womens match= good storyline but dont really care about it and Angelina's t*ts look awful (sorry, I know Im supposed to like the bigger is better idea but come on they are bigger than her head and look realy really really fake, at least Velvets look alot better)

Abyss= totally hate how they are using him and it pains him. I want Abyss f'in sh*t up, run down the ring and black hole slam Bischoff onto a pile of tacks come on!!!

After such a big deal about Double J last week, why was he not on this week? Same with Lashley.

Mr. Anderson= seems to be alright so far, he gets alot of heat and isn't an old timer so thumbs up.

Nash/Foley= I liked the concept but the match came off awful, the spots looked really slow and bad (the hockey stick and picture just to name two) I like the idea of Nash being on tv more than Foley and I know its been said over and over but should two guys over 50 really be main eventing? I get they bring name value but was anyone actually excited for that main event match?

So all in all nothing special but maybe they wanted this to be a dull week before they pick it up for the PPV. Whole show just comes off as a car crash, way to many people, too little time, and it seems their segway for EVERY segment is something with either Hogan or Bischoff

oh and p.s. why no Wolfe? He could have atleast had a 30 second promo talking about how he qualified.

[Blackman]

lol, going through the TNA booking style is an exercise in 'find the errors'.

Finished watching last week's episode and the best segment was actually... a segment! What's up with that TNA? how about upping your match-angle ratio? Mr. Kennedy... err.. Anderson or whatever. His segment was the best, closely followed by the X-division tag match. But they're just over-emphasising Hogan, Mick & Flair. Oh well.

I'll watch this week's episode and if that one sucks as hard as last week's, I'm quitting this mindless waste of bandwidth and time. :)

[cappyboy]

Just watched last nights impace (DVR) and I was pretty dissapointed. Didn't understand the AJ/Pope match at all, I get that it hypes up Pope but is it worth the cost of making your CHAMPION look bad? Pope wasn't even on last week! Nice to see Joe back though (way to keep him off the air the past two weeks)

I don't know I'd go quite as far as you have here. But I will say the show felt a little WWE in its layout this week. Segments were thrown on in entirely the wrong order and it hurt the overall feel of the show. I've seen a lot better out of TNA in the last year or so. But I've seen worse shows as well.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Waltman & Hall= big waste of time and money. Even if people recognize them they'll just say "wow scott hall looks like my fat drunk uncle"

I guess I can see this. They are most interesting by the association to Kevin Nash. The juxtaposition of Big Sexy trying to help keep them afloat while trying to be true to his relationship with Hogan is pretty good stuff. But you aren't kidding about the fat drunk uncle with Hall. And the sad thing is that in order to have the torn Kevin Nash you gotta have Hall around. Independent of Nash though, forget it. I'll deal with Waltman in a pinch. I've never had the antipathy for him many segments of the audience have. But Hall really needs to just disappear and go dry out.

Tag Match= meh.

Are you kidding? It's scenarios like the tag match this week that finally brought me around on Team 3D. Whatever I may have felt about them in their primes or in WWE, Bubba and D-Von have rocked my socks since they started being the elder statesmen of TNA's tag scene. The hard-fought bonds of mutual respect they have formed with Beer Money and now apparently Hernandez and Morgan have helped make them more supportable and watchable as characters than I have ever known them to be in previous stops.

Womens match= good storyline but dont really care about it and Angelina's t*ts look awful (sorry, I know Im supposed to like the bigger is better idea but come on they are bigger than her head and look realy really really fake, at least Velvets look alot better)

Again, it seems we couldn't be further apart in perspective. I'm loving this Return of Angelina storyline. Her having gone from leader to replaced in The Beautiful People and learning to see her former friends as the rest of the roster does has been good TV so far. And I love the mutual respect thing she and Tara were doing after all the grief Angelina and the Beautifuls put Tara through when she debuted. I very much want to see where this will take Angelina's character. Will she eventually re-unite with Velvet and Madison? Will she ultimately learn to appreciate Lacey Von Erich or finally destroy her? Or will this view of how the other side sees her former clique result in a lasting reformation for Angelina?

I'll agree on the physical assessment of the sporting goods department boobies. But that's the only place where it looks like we can agree here.

Abyss= totally hate how they are using him and it pains him. I want Abyss f'in sh*t up, run down the ring and black hole slam Bischoff onto a pile of tacks come on!!!

Okay. The last part I couldn't argue with. But I love the current character Abyss has. Guys his size have been monsters forever and will be in the future. But sometimes it's good to see those guys stretch beyond that easy mold. The comedic Big Show, Kane dealing with career mortality, the child-like Abyss. Roles like these stretch the abilities of the talents involved. And while there will always be a place for monsters in wrestling. But the fact Abyss running down to the ring and Black Hole Slamming Bischoff onto a pile of thumb tacks would have to come as part of sticking up for Mick Foley doesn't strike me as necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes the good guys gotta have those guys you don't want to mess with needlessly as well.

After such a big deal about Double J last week, why was he not on this week? Same with Lashley.

Good question.

Mr. Anderson= seems to be alright so far, he gets alot of heat and isn't an old timer so thumbs up.

Meh. I don't get Anderson. I never have and I doubt I ever will. He just comes off as one of these guys who's risen far above his actual ability. He seems like he should be headlining some syndie company with the stature of a Ring of Honor. Not a regularly placed national promotion like WWE or TNA. Which means the whole name-holding shtick that allows him to get all this heat just alienates me rather than make me care what he does.

Nash/Foley= I liked the concept but the match came off awful, the spots looked really slow and bad (the hockey stick and picture just to name two) I like the idea of Nash being on tv more than Foley and I know its been said over and over but should two guys over 50 really be main eventing? I get they bring name value but was anyone actually excited for that main event match?

An example of what I was saying earlier about the WWE-style show formatting taking away from the sum of the show's part. How this main evented over Styles/Pope is beyond me. At best, this should have been the first half of a double main event with Styles/Pope and the relevation of Joe cashing in his Feast or Fired shot at the PPV ending out the show.

I'll go you one better. I loved the idea of this match with the way they merged the Bischoff/Nash relationship with the recent Nash/Foley history. But this in no way should have been the finale. The combined shockers of the world champion losing a non-title match to an up-and-coming challenging and getting a PPV challenge from a long time friend turned enemy should have over-ridden this even with all the story positives. And I will include the picture spot in that. Mick hesitating over waffling Kevin with a treasured memento is beautiful character development. But there are two flys in the ointment here.

The first is how much more compelling and immediate AJ's situation is from a competitive standpoint. And the second is that the "assault" by Hall and Waltman smells like a set-up. Like Nash set up a phony breakup of The Band. I can't keep but think he's trying to compel contracts for his thug buddies so he can get "revenge" on them. Thereby killing the drama that would otherwise be.



oh and p.s. why no Wolfe? He could have atleast had a 30 second promo talking about how he qualified.

Good question on Wolfe. He's an awesome character and that would have built up the King of The Ring-ish tourney at the PPV by giving him to gloat about his place in it. I'd have liked a little promo from him as well.

[Hyde Hill]

Attendance for the UK part of the Tour from 411 mania quoting the WO:

- Here are the attendance figures for TNA's recent International tour:
* 1.16 – Dublin: 2,500 (Sell Out)
* 1.17 – Dublin: 2,500 (Sell Out)
* 1.20 – Manchester: 5,000
* 1.21 – Birmingham: 4,000
* 1.22 – Glasgow: 4,100
* 1.24 – London: 8,100 (All-Time Company Attendance Record)

Credit: The Wrestling Observer Newsletter

Paris was apparently 2.500 (after being cancelled the first time, I couldn't attend on the new date, grrr,) and Glasgow was 1.500.

Pretty decent all-round imho and showing growth from the last time they went to the UK.

Edit: On Impact this week pretty decent show apart from the ending, agree they need to work on the formatting which has always been their problem. Stuffing too much in in too little time and in the wrong order. The storylines themselves are pretty good though atm as they are at least unpredictable for the most part and the predictable ones are being executed well. Still a bit less old folks on my tv would still be nice, they where so getting it post BFG and now this.

PS Rating was a 1.2 rounded up so a big drop from last week. (Relatively)

[jesterx7769]

Seems like we agree on most of it Cappy, I said I like the women's storyline, I just dont like Angelina and never really cared for womens wrestling (sorry movement people) so its hard for me to enjoy the matches and sit through the same catty promos they all do (although Tara's wasn't bad despite its lack of charisma but at least she wasnt b*tchy)