Bidding wars

[Ninja Turtle]

I am currently playing a real world 1995 scenario with WCW, who, of course, is at war with WWF.

I have yet to see the "bidding wars" part of the game. Every attempt at negotiations with someone from WWF always fails with "so-and-so does not want to negotiate due to your war with WWF" (paraphrasing).

Will being at war always trump bidding wars? Or does it depend on the workers personality? Both companies are VERY close in popularity and prestige, and the same thing has even occurred with lower midcarders.

[skiesofryan]

I've been running into that issue with my game too. WWE guys are up for contract negotiations and I can't steal them b/c we're at war.

[hurricanendp]

i've had it a few times with free agents, i've lost a few because my owner has not allowed me to offer more than a certain amount, which happens to be the amount the other companys are usually offering :(

[DNS-4LIFE]

how do you know when they are coming off contract. do you get a email , .... or ?

[Ninja Turtle]

how do you know when they are coming off contract. do you get a email , .... or ?

I believe you can shortlist the worker, but in my case, most of the time it will show up on the news page that the worker has or will begin contract negotiations with their current company.

[pantaloons]

They don't want to negotiate with you because you are a lesser company than the one they work for.

[maskedpropaganda]

A good example of this, is if your an American company who wishes to aquire the services of Jacob Jett. CGC will always want Jett. He will either say he is not interested, or I am thinking if ya fed has reached Cult level, you and CGC will go into a bidding war. (You will lose unless you are willing to off Jett who would most likely be a midcard or lower midcard in you cult sized fed alot more than his asking price. I think I won if I took the 600-700 he was asking and turned it into 1500. lol course that is way over paying a midcard level talent even when they are that talented.)

[wrestlingfan#1]

I believe this was a problem in 08 as well, where if you are at war you are unable to have any dealings with that company or its workers.

[jesterx7769]

Only if you are the less prestigious company, all of these complaints are coming from people playing as less prestigious companies, when I played as RAW in Australia you start out being at war with APW and DIW but I was able to sign their top workers to P.P.A. deals causing them to leave APW/DIW b/c of the war (except for The Comedian since he is DIW owner after all)

[Maaaddenman]

After reading this thread i was thinking the same thing, about me not seeing any bidding wars since i began playing 10. Right after reading i was playing my USPW game and I went to sign Roger Cage but SWF swooped in and took him from me, losers.

[Gigas]

Only if you are the less prestigious company, all of these complaints are coming from people playing as less prestigious companies, when I played as RAW in Australia you start out being at war with APW and DIW but I was able to sign their top workers to P.P.A. deals causing them to leave APW/DIW b/c of the war (except for The Comedian since he is DIW owner after all)

Those are PPA deals, not written. I have the same exact problems as the others.

[jesterx7769]

You are saying though you can't even get to the negotiation screen though b/c you are at war, not even getting to the point of written or PPA, are you a larger company than the one you are trying to steal workers from that you are war with?

[Gigas]

You are saying though you can't even get to the negotiation screen though b/c you are at war, not even getting to the point of written or PPA, are you a larger company than the one you are trying to steal workers from that you are war with?

Yes. I made USPW intentionally bigger than SWF so I could sign Skull Debones. He tells me too bad, You are at war with SWF so I wont sign with you. They all tell me that.

Kinda defeats the purpose of going to war with someone if you cant steal their guys away.

edit: although it just worked that time. Interesting.

[jesterx7769]

Well you did not up your prestige and momentum then, b/c I just ran a test with USPW where I made them global, gave them A prestige and Momentum, edited his contract so he was less than a month, then signed him to a written deal.

[Lt. Lucrativo]

I'm pretty sure that workers will only agree to negotiate with whichever company has the higher prestige when two companies at war are trying to bid for them. I'm pretty sure it was that way in 2008, as well. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me that a worker would refuse to even enter negotiations, but that seems to be the way it is. I agree that it defeats the purpose of going to war with any company that happens to be more prestigious if that relationship precludes you from having any chance of stealing its talent.

What I'm not sure about is whether it's a hard and fast rule that a worker will always only negotiate with the more prestigious company or whether it's just very likely he or she will refuse the less prestigious company outright. I haven't seen anyone who says he's been able to try to steal anyone from a more prestigious company yet, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's impossible. I'd be interested to hear if anyone has been able to do it.

[Antithesis]

War?

War aint got nothing to do with it it!

:D

http://www.greydogsoftware.com/forum/showthread.php?t=75818

[jesterx7769]

Just did some more testing.

1) USPW as #1 promotion in the world but with starting prestige and momentum- would not sign.

2) USPW as #1 promotion but with higher prestige and lower momentum- SWF was offering more money and despite all the extra stuff I could not go over $55,000 so I lost.

So it appears prestige is the big question mark here as to why people are not even getting to the negotiation page, however I found it odd that in my first test when I had higher prestige and momentum I signed him right up and did not even get into a bidding war so workers must like working for promotions with high momentum

[jesterx7769]

Just did some more tests and prestige/size are the biggest things. this time i tested as TCW still trying to get Vengeance.

1) Stayed at national, raised prestige, no go

2) raised to international, kept prestige, no go

3) raised to international, raised prestige (still ranked 2nd in the world though) and signed.

edit: Experimented more with prestige and he will not negotiate with me unless my prestige is higher than SWF, even being the same size and same momentum he would not negotiate

[ampulator]

The reason why bidding wars are rare is because each piece of "stolen talent" should be a big deal. If you have equal prestige, momentum, and popularity with the opposing company, their workers aren't necessarily inclined to sign with you because they don't want antagonize their former bosses. If your company fails when they sign with you, they would be looked down upon. You have to be the clear victor of the war.

In fact, if stealing their talent was easy, even just to get to the negotiating screen, it meant that you were close to winning the war.

[NWO4until01]

Just did some more tests and prestige/size are the biggest things. this time i tested as TCW still trying to get Vengeance.

1) Stayed at national, raised prestige, no go

2) raised to international, kept prestige, no go

3) raised to international, raised prestige (still ranked 2nd in the world though) and signed.

edit: Experimented more with prestige and he will not negotiate with me unless my prestige is higher than SWF, even being the same size and same momentum he would not negotiate

If thats the case then I'd consider it a major flaw in the game. once your within a certain range of a bigger promotion in prestige and size, superior contracts should be a much bigger factor than what it is.

[Lt. Lucrativo]

The reason why bidding wars are rare is because each piece of "stolen talent" should be a big deal. If you have equal prestige, momentum, and popularity with the opposing company, their workers aren't necessarily inclined to sign with you because they don't want antagonize their former bosses. If your company fails when they sign with you, they would be looked down upon. You have to be the clear victor of the war.

In fact, if stealing their talent was easy, even just to get to the negotiating screen, it meant that you were close to winning the war.

But to me, the problem is that one side can steal talent (or at least negotiate to steal talent) at will while the other side can never even get to the negotiating table. Just because one promotion may be somewhat more prestigious than the other promotion it is at war with, doesn't mean that it is "close to winning the war." Plus, it seems to me that a war between promotions would be one of the few times that an individual worker would really have a lot of leverage against his employer during contract negotiations. I don't know why a worker shouldn't be interested in playing two competing promotions against one another to secure the best possible employment situation for himself.

In general, though, I just always find it really jarring when the game tells me I can't do something. Obviously there have to be limits and rules, but it's such an open game and the possibilities are so endless, it just somehow seems wrong to me whenever I'm prevented from even trying to do something. Playing as TCW, why can't I even try to offer an SWF midcarder an obscenely large contract and a promised main event title run? Even if there was a 99.9% chance that he'd turn me down in favor of staying with the more prestigious promotion, I'd still feel a whole lot better just for having had the opportunity to try.

[Antithesis]

The reason why bidding wars are rare is because each piece of "stolen talent" should be a big deal. If you have equal prestige, momentum, and popularity with the opposing company, their workers aren't necessarily inclined to sign with you because they don't want antagonize their former bosses. If your company fails when they sign with you, they would be looked down upon. You have to be the clear victor of the war.

In fact, if stealing their talent was easy, even just to get to the negotiating screen, it meant that you were close to winning the war.

I can understand all that from a game perspective, but in the real world, I am pretty sure of most pro wrestlers will tell you that if you arent in the business to make as much money as possible for yourself and your family, then you're a mark for yourself.

[Gigas]

In fact, if stealing their talent was easy, even just to get to the negotiating screen, it meant that you were close to winning the war.

But stealing talent is that easy.. for SWF. Its a one sided war. Not to mention it totally takes the war feeling away. Whats the point of going to war with SWF at all if you cant sign there guys but they can sign yours?

[NWO4until01]

in the real world the 90's are a great example. how many workers did wcw take from wwe with obscene contracts, yet one could argue they were never actually more 'prestigious' than wwe. in fact, they never would have even gotten off the ground before diesel and razor ramon waltzed in with $$ and CC.

[Antithesis]

But stealing talent is that easy.. for SWF. Its a one sided war. Not to mention it totally takes the war feeling away. Whats the point of going to war with SWF at all if you cant sign there guys but they can sign yours?

Actually a game I played where Train's, Gilmore's and Money's contracts all came up within a two month period, after they started giving the war as the reason they wouldn't even negotiate, I tried asking the SWF to end the war, but they declined.

Hell, I wasn't even thinking about the war with the SWF, my goal was that TCW was in such bad shape, signing a big name would help boost the company.

Funny thing is, they still won't negotiate even if there is a war or not. Giving the war as a reason is a misnomer. As others have said, its about Company size and prestige.

people are focusing on the war thing and thats not the issue. The issue is, if I'm a promotor of a reasonably sized company and I have the resources, I should at least be able to throw sickening amounts of money at talent to get them to sign.

Especially in a game that supposedly will take that into account when factoring things like locker room morale and future contract negotiations with other talent.

[Gigas]

Seems like something should be said in suggestions forum.

[The-619]

in the real world the 90's are a great example. how many workers did wcw take from wwe with obscene contracts, yet one could argue they were never actually more 'prestigious' than wwe. in fact, they never would have even gotten off the ground before diesel and razor ramon waltzed in with $$ and CC.

This is a very good example, WCW just had the money to offer their competitions' workers big deals and I think this is something that needs to be fixed.

[ampulator]

I can understand all that from a game perspective, but in the real world, I am pretty sure of most pro wrestlers will tell you that if you arent in the business to make as much money as possible for yourself and your family, then you're a mark for yourself.

You aren't wrong, but neither am I. I merely forgot to point what you said: Money is important. But it's not the only thing. And for one thing in a war, where two promotions have equal or near-equal popularity, momentum, and money, it's not exactly a wise "business" decision.

The thing is, there are hypotheticals such as a lower promotion wanting to pay more than a higher promotion. But the thing is, can they really afford it? And more importantly, how often do they offer such contracts? Do lower promotions do that often?

People seem to forget in a war, the hiring advantage almost always goes to the stronger promotion. That was true for WCW in the early 90's against the WWF, and WWF against WCW in the late 90's. Even then, how many people really jumped?

[Antithesis]

You aren't wrong, but neither am I. I merely forgot to point what you said: Money is important. But it's not the only thing. And for one thing in a war, where two promotions have equal or near-equal popularity, momentum, and money, it's not exactly a wise "business" decision.

The thing is, there are hypotheticals such as a lower promotion wanting to pay more than a higher promotion. But the thing is, can they really afford it? And more importantly, how often do they offer such contracts? Do lower promotions do that often?

People seem to forget in a war, the hiring advantage almost always goes to the stronger promotion. That was true for WCW in the early 90's against the WWF, and WWF against WCW in the late 90's. Even then, how many people really jumped?



The war isn't the issue. Go to the editor and remove the war between the SWF and TCW. TCW still can't get anyone to negotiate.

As to promotion size, and all, using real life examples ...it is true that is a factor.

But in the mid 90's, out of people that jumped and those that didn't, many of them did negotiate with both companies (or in the case of some ECW wrestlers, they negotiated between three).

Why would they at least negotiate? Because it caused the companies to increase their offers, meaning wrestlers could get the best deal possible.

Real life wise, this is why I have a problem with the way it is now. Because in real life, most pro wrestlers want to get paid (other considerations also a factor)

As it is now, until you take a promotion and reach some benchmark as decided by the developer, you can't even get to the negotiation screen to make an offer.

Another thing not mentioned here. Who says you'll always want to actually sign that wrestler? Maybe I just want to build an offer up to Big Smack Scott so that Eisen has to spend that much extra to keep him. Let the SWF locker room explode as a result.

Its sneaky, its underhanded, and it happens everyday in professional sports, not just pro wrestling.

Given the unprecedented freedom Adam's allowed with user prefernces and the editor and the like, I am surprised Adam didn't offer a feature like this as well. That way, if you want to play a game where all the wrestlers want to do is work for the largest promotion in the world, you can play that game, and people like myself, who think that wrestlers are in it for the money, we can play that game too if we want.

[jesterx7769]

It's near impossible to beat out SWF in the negotiations anyway. When I could actually bid to get Vengeance the owner would only let me give $55,000 and even when I added all the other things in that were possible he still brought up how SWF was giving him more money, so if you all really wanted that chance to negotiate and be shot down I'm sure Adam could include it but then you would all whine about that until he made it as easy to steal workers as it is to edit them. If you really want someone that bad just edit their contract down and then sign them, that is what I did in 08, youre all complaining that the #1 promotion in the world has too much power, thats what they get for being #1! Now go over take them and raid their roster and tell them to suck it!

[Antithesis]

It's near impossible to beat out SWF in the negotiations anyway. When I could actually bid to get Vengeance the owner would only let me give $55,000 and even when I added all the other things in that were possible he still brought up how SWF was giving him more money, so if you all really wanted that chance to negotiate and be shot down I'm sure Adam could include it but then you would all whine about that until he made it as easy to steal workers as it is to edit them. If you really want someone that bad just edit their contract down and then sign them, that is what I did in 08, youre all complaining that the #1 promotion in the world has too much power, thats what they get for being #1! Now go over take them and raid their roster and tell them to suck it!

Why would you assume people would whine?

The SWF can already steal TCW's talent, just TCW can't return the favor. Its ranked as the second largest promotion in the world. Not being able to even make them an offer is a flaw in the game.

I'll give you a real life example.

When Sting was coming up for contract renewal with WCW, he was also in talks with Vince, even when WCW was kicking WWF's ass, Sting still talked to him.

During negotiations Vince made his final offer and Sting told him he'd have to hear back from WCW, and Vince told him to make his offer sound greater than it was, so Sting would get the best contract possible.

After that, Sting gets his big money contract, limited number of televised dates per year, limited number of house shows, cut of merchandise etc etc etc.

A lot of the top WCW guys did the same. It eventually helped contribute to the downfall of the company, because as revenue tightened up, that guarenteed money still had to be paid out, and if the Main EVenters worked over their contracted number of dates, they had to get X amount of bonus money.

And of course, then the lower card guys start hearing rumors about how so and so is making all that money and not even having to show up but a certain amount of days, and what do you know, locker room morale starts to fall.



Its not just about what you bid on vengeance. Its alo the reprecussions Eisen has to deal with now for making a bigger bid than you.

Thats an aspect of the game that people who play TCW don't get to experience (because they can't even get SWF wrestlers to negotiate) unless, as you say, they tinker with the editor or spend copious amounts of time building up the company.

[Gigas]

It's near impossible to beat out SWF in the negotiations anyway. When I could actually bid to get Vengeance the owner would only let me give $55,000 and even when I added all the other things in that were possible he still brought up how SWF was giving him more money, so if you all really wanted that chance to negotiate and be shot down I'm sure Adam could include it but then you would all whine about that until he made it as easy to steal workers as it is to edit them. If you really want someone that bad just edit their contract down and then sign them, that is what I did in 08, youre all complaining that the #1 promotion in the world has too much power, thats what they get for being #1! Now go over take them and raid their roster and tell them to suck it!

Why does it always have to be a Skull Debones? What if Robbie Retros contract is up, and I think hes future ME material in USPW? Hell, he's already an upper midcarder in USPW. He's a perfect fit. Hes also not going to cost $55,000. I could see SWF bowing out of the bidding once it hit 12-15k.

The game is broke the way its set up now. A war with SWF is basically, Hey steal my guys while I sit with a thumb up my ass because TEW2010 wont let me sign your guys. Although apparently the at war thing doesnt even matter, which is even worse. Its broken.

[bshankly]

i've had a few(see other thread) and i think its great. I've been able to replace Eddie Peak with Christian Faith Steve Frehley so not doing too badly. I managed to push Peaks contract upto 125k a month with SWF. Got into a bidding war with (is it BHOGW) over Duane Stones as well but pulled out at about 20k a month.
Faith and Frehley were not renewed by SWF so i still wasn't able to compete with them with there wrestlers that they wanted, but still it just means that i have to get closer to there pop and attack them from there. Think they will drop to cult in 10 as well as there only gettong C, C+ and B- shows at the moment. So when that happens i'll raid them completely.

[Phantom Stranger]

The game is broke the way its set up now. A war with SWF is basically, Hey steal my guys while I sit with a thumb up my ass because TEW2010 wont let me sign your guys. Although apparently the at war thing doesnt even matter, which is even worse. Its broken.

Funnily enough, the things you're complaining about have been true for several iterations of the game, and not until 'bidding war' is added do these threads appear.

[gazwefc83]

that is because we thought bidding war would solve this, plus iv seen threads like this for past versions of TEW another reason why i thought bidding war was added

[Lt. Lucrativo]

that is because we thought bidding war would solve this, plus iv seen threads like this for past versions of TEW another reason why i thought bidding war was added

Exactly. When I read in the Developer's Journal that "Taken from WMMA2, TEW 2010 will feature bidding wars," I assumed that the feature would work more or less like it does in WMMA2--and I was really happy about it because I've always wished that prestige wasn't such a determining factor in TEW negotiations. Fighters in WMMA2 will always take negotiations from every company (up to three, anyway) that is interested in them as long as the company is large enough to be able to sign them. In that game, fighters don't refuse to negotiate with anyone other than the top company, so bidding wars over the top fighters are very common. It seems like in TEW2010, which has so many other factors for workers to consider when deciding what their best employment situation would be--company momentum, locker room morale, relationships with other workers on the roster, etc.--that eliminating that openness and flexibility in hiring is, in my opinion, unfortunate.

[Antithesis]

Yeah, that didn't really occur to me until you mentioned it, but that is what I was kind of expecting as well. Hell, at the start of WMMA 2, playing as SIGMA, you still have a chance to outbid Alpha-1 on Helio, for example. And as time goes on and folks from the Alpha-1 roster come up for renewal, you can at least negotiate with them.

Aside from that, I'd argue that it may be a bug in TEW 2010 if the wrestlers say that a promotional war is the reason they won't negotiate, when in fact its because of your promotion's prestige. Otherwise its misleading folks just playing the game.

[Candyman]

Funnily enough, the things you're complaining about have been true for several iterations of the game, and not until 'bidding war' is added do these threads appear.

Not to speak to anybody else, but it seems pretty obvious to me that people are complaining precisely because 'bidding war' was added: they're complaining that they can't get into a bidding war with SWF. Which would mean that what they're complaining about hasn't been true for ANY prior iterations of the game.

[Ninja Turtle]

Not to speak to anybody else, but it seems pretty obvious to me that people are complaining precisely because 'bidding war' was added: they're complaining that they can't get into a bidding war with SWF. Which would mean that what they're complaining about hasn't been true for ANY prior iterations of the game.

Exactly, which is when I heard that the "bidding war" would be added, I assumed it meant that promotions within a satisfying amount of prestige or popularity to one another can get into a heated negotiation with a worker. I am very disappointed that it appears to have the same stipulations as in previous games in terms of stealing talent. I'm not talking a Cult sized promotion taking on a Global in terms of negotiating, but promotions within one "size" of each other should be allowed to at least throw a number out there. For example, an International promotion should at least be able to offer something to a worker who is in negotiations for his current Global promotion.

I'd like to be able to take TCW and offer an SWF worker a lucrative amount of money and creative control solely to steal talent. If some say it is unrealistic, I beg to differ. It's true that in most cases, star workers will tend to stay put - with rare exceptions (Hall and Nash in WWF). However, stealing of midcarders and veterans is very common, even now in regards to TNA.

All I am saying, and most people here are saying, is that we'd at least like to try to steal talent. If I'm Eric Bischoff in a real world mod for WCW, I believe it to be very realistic for me to offer insane contracts that don't make much sense and seem like cheating - simply because that's what he did.

I hope this is something that can be changed in TEW2010, otherwise it will be frustrating for me, because I love taking WCW back in the 90s but in previous games, and it appears again in this game, it's impossible to steal talent.

I'd really like to hear Adam's take on this. Adam, if you're reading this, can you help clear some things up for us on this subject? Thanks!

[Tempest Kane]

Dont know about the rest of this convo... But i got TCW to global #2 , A* Prestige + A Momentum by October 2010 ... and SWF is A* Prestige and B Momentum @ #1 ... so it isnt like you have to play forever to even the playing field...

I havent tried to sign anyone yet... i assume they still "dont think its good for there careers" at this point, but even a little dint in SWF's prestige i assume will start giving me the upper hand... if thats the case than this isnt a big-a-deal as people make out.

If not then yeah... we need to look into it, the current way its setup is likely more to do with maintaining a stable game world than anything, it dosnt lend its self well to the bidding-war based monday night wars mods people are going to want to play... but im still enjoying the game.

[Adam Ryland]

This was altered in yesterday's patch, you need to upgrade.

[Gigas]

This was altered in yesterday's patch, you need to upgrade.

So awesome. I was hoping it was just an oversite/bug.

[gazwefc83]

Thanks Adam, looking forward to this

[Ninja Turtle]

This was altered in yesterday's patch, you need to upgrade.

Ok, thank you for responding. I did download the patch yesterday, but haven't gotten a chance to play it enough to run into a similar scenario. I am very happy that this wasn't a permanent fixture in the game!

[jtnlange]

Did the patch help this at all?


Trevor

[nZane]

Well, I just tried and I'm no longer getting the won't negotiate due to the war message. Granted, I did get the "joining you wouldn't be a good career move" one, but I'm TCW and sitting at B+ Prestige versus the A* of SWF right now, so it isn't a shock. I would guess you need to be within a letter grade or something closer.

But that means no Jack Bruce for me. :(

[Gigas]

Did you try it with lesser workers?

[Gigas]

Well, I just tried and I'm no longer getting the won't negotiate due to the war message. Granted, I did get the "joining you wouldn't be a good career move" one, but I'm TCW and sitting at B+ Prestige versus the A* of SWF right now, so it isn't a shock. I would guess you need to be within a letter grade or something closer.

But that means no Jack Bruce for me. :(

I tried it with guys like Robbie Retro and got the same thing, so a company like TCW or USPW still cant sign any of SWFs guys, which makes the bidding wars and wars in general really really one sided. Still wish there was at least a chance to negotiate with these people. Especially the Robbie Retros of the world who are stuck in midcard hell. Pretty disappointed that the patch didnt do anything other than replace "wont sign because of the war" to "wont sign because its bad" but w/e.

[CQI13]

You could steal workers from another promotion, and when you're within striking distance steal workers from the other.

[Ninja Turtle]

Well, in my WCW 1995 game, Hulk Hogan's (a big one) contract was running up. I went into a bidding war with WWF.

My prestige was 90, WWF was 96. My US popularity, on average, was 79. WWF was 77. However, WWF was Global and I was International with WCW.

I was able to keep Hogan, thankfully, through the bidding war. I offered him more money than WWF could, apparently. I haven't yet run into a scenario where the worker doesn't currently work for me, so we'll see if the case remains the same. I'd sure be interested to know if that scenario would have had the same result had Hogan been working for WWF instead of me.

[CQI13]

I'm guessing he'd probably have stayed with them (much like he did with you).

[nZane]

Did you try it with lesser workers?Tried it with Gregory Black (Groucho Bling) as well, and got the same thing. I just checked, and my prestige is currently at 85.3 with SWF being at 98.4. That's still a pretty sizable difference in TEW terms, so I have to wonder if I just need to be closer to them. Time will tell, I suppose...

EDIT: I'm going to run some tests here in a little bit and see what I can find.

[nZane]

Alright, here's the setup: I'm playing as TCW in the default Cornellverse. I'm using Jack Avatar as the head booker only with a 5 in every User Talent category (should mean that everything is neutral). The only editing I'm going to do will be to mess with the prestige of both SWF and TCW and to change the contracts of SWF wrestlers. I realize this isn't taking into account several factors and isn't the most scientific of tests, but it's a start.


First test:

SWF prestige - 90
TCW prestige - 72

Vengeance - US pop - 85
Zimmy Bumfhole - US pop -52

RESULT: No surprise, both think joining me wouldn't be a good career move.


Second test:

SWF prestige - 90
TCW prestige - 77

Angry Gilmore - US pop - 76
Marc DuBois - US pop -60

RESULT: Same as above. Again, no surprise.


Third test:

SWF prestige - 90
TCW prestige - 82

Christian Faith - US pop - 85
Captain Atomic - US pop - 46

RESULT: Atom gave me the tried and true "not a good career move", while Christian wished to focus on his SWF career.


Fourth test:

SWF prestige - 90
TCW prestige - 85

Brandon James - US pop - 78
Brett Biggz - US pop -55

RESULT: Same.


Fifth test:

SWF prestige - 90
TCW prestige - 89

Marah Khoklov - US pop - 86
Paul Huntingdon - US pop - 55

RESULT: And the same once again.


It was after this last test that TCW fell to Cult due to inactivity, so my testing is done for now. Looks like prestige alone isn't enough to sway workers, which shouldn't be a surprise.

[Astil]

Didn't Adam say momentum was a huge factor in who would negotiate?

[nZane]

Didn't Adam say momentum was a huge factor in who would negotiate?Sounds about right. Right about time I was setting up the third test, it occurred to me that there is almost definitely more to this than just prestige. That's what I get for trying to run a test when I'm tired and distracted. :p

[jesterx7769]

There is not more to it than prestige, you have to more prestige than them and have to be on the same promotion size, just look at my test. In none of your tests did you up TCW to international/global to be on the same size as SWF nor did you raise TCW's prestige above SWF. It simply comes down to workers do NOT want to leave a bigger and better promotion for a smaller one more money/title shot

[jesterx7769]

I will be playing as TCW and negotiating with Christian Faith, Skull DeBones, and Atom Smasher, all with 5 negotiating skill.
Test 1:
Left TCW at National, upped Prestige and Momentum all the way
- Faith and DeBones rejected on same day, Atom Smasher on the next day. All b/c of not a good career move
Test 2:
Put TCW up to international, prestige and momentum all the way, still #2 in the world in popularity
- Faith rejects as he wants to concentrate on SWF
- Signed Vengeance and Atom Smasher

Test #3

Same as two except I lowered momentum to lower than SWF, exact same contract results.

Test #4

Same as test two except I lowered TCW prestige to 89% (one lower than SWF) and I signed Vengeance and Atom Smasher but no Faith.

Test #5

Lowered TCW prestige to 85%, no one signed.

Test #6

Put TCW prestige at 87%, signed Vengeance and Atom

So all in all it appears you have to be within 3% prestige and the same size promotion.

[MrOnu]

Can you get into bidding wars without being at war with the other company ?

Late 2010 in NYCW game, it was time to renew Sayeed Ali's contract and negotiations felt apart after the first offer. I was getting the message "4C is offering more money, so unless you put more on the table, you'll have to end the process". I raised twice my offer, still got the message, but Ali didn't lose any patience. I finally cancelled negotiation, there was no way I was giving Ali the money is was asking for, he was only a low midcarder. Looking at the news log, it seems his contract with 4C had to be renewed around the same period.

[jesterx7769]

Can you get into bidding wars without being at war with the other company ?

Late 2010 in NYCW game, it was time to renew Sayeed Ali's contract and negotiations felt apart after the first offer. I was getting the message "4C is offering more money, so unless you put more on the table, you'll have to end the process". I raised twice my offer, still got the message, but Ali didn't lose any patience. I finally cancelled negotiation, there was no way I was giving Ali the money is was asking for, he was only a low midcarder. Looking at the news log, it seems his contract with 4C had to be renewed around the same period.

Yes you can get into a bidding war with any worker and you clearly were in a bidding war with 4C.

[MrOnu]

Clearly, Sayeed Ali was the loser in this one. He could have continued to get two paychecks monthly, but, he will only get the 4C one. Well, at least, I know now what a bidding war looks like.

[jesterx7769]

You can probably sign him to a ppa now if you still want him and he will just work for both of you.

[MrOnu]

I haven't tried, but I'm pretty sure I need to wait for the cooldown period of 6 months before opening negotiation again with him like anyone else who gets out of your company.

[Historian]

I don't see why there is all this fuss about guys not wanting to jump ship, especially when they get the 'I do not think this would be a good career move.'

Because it makes sense. If I'm running TCW, which has had a hard two years, and I want to steal say, Angry Gilmore, but Angry Gilmore is happy in SWF, he's making good money, he's on a bigger TV station, bigger PPVs, why is he going to jump ship? It makes more sense for him to stay with a company that has been the dominant power house in the US wrestling scene for his entire career.

I know a lot of people like to use real world examples, on how WCW was able to steal WWF talent by offering large contracts. If you look at it, they only really stole four guys with any name value; Hall, Nash, Waltman, and Savage. While Hall and Nash and Waltman were clearly surprises, Nash being a big one, since he was a top guy at the time, they were moving for larger contracts and a slightly easier schedule at the time. Savage was unhappy with his WWE status, he no longer wanted to be an announcer, but they didn't want to put him back in the ring. Also, WWE was LOSING momentum. They had just come off the steroid scandal, and their product was getting some what stale. WCW had new management, and had an aggressive plan. You could say, they had a lot of momentum, especially since they had signed Hulk Hogan, which adds to their value.

With that said, actual 'big' talent jumps is quite rare. Look at it now, TNA is the number two promotion in the US, they're on national tv, with good pay per view exposure, and they still don't get huge WWE names to jump as a general rule. The biggest one they've had jump was Angle, with Lashley coming in at a second, but even Lashley didn't jump ship, he had been released for quite some time.

I think the game does a fairly good job of simulating bidding wars. I don't know why people think SWF and TCW need to be in these intense bidding wars for talent, just because there were some between WWE and WCW. Both of those companies were International. Both, eventually, had a lot of momentum going their way. TCW and SWF are not on the same level, and for a talent who is happy where he's at to jump down the rung for some more money just seems... foolish.

[gazwefc83]

Are all bidding wars about money? I tried to sign a guy who was all about the wrestling rather than the money, i could match the other promotions wage offer, but i offered him a mainevent push, mainevent title run etc put he signed for the other promotion for more money but only a midcard slot

[Tempest Kane]

Actualy im in May 2011 and i have had Angry Gilmore (Despite his Wife been in SWF) , Vengance and Steve Frehely jump ship to TCW from SWF.

I got Steve when his contract was not re-newed for some reason i still dont understand, before the patch that "fixed this" issue supposedly with bidding wars.

Then i got Vengance and Angry just after the patch for bidding wars, i was the same prestige as SWF.

For the record some people still reject my advances and dont jump... so it isnt like a magic "i win" button... but it isnt like i NEED to hire more than 2-3 guys from SWF, i have built up my own roster of talent in an attempt to get to this point were i can steal a handful of workers from SWF... and as such i dont want to bring anymore in coz it will shadow what is a decent card of talent i have built up along the way... remmber that before you go crazy with the bidding wars :p

[Moe Hunter]

Yes. I made USPW intentionally bigger than SWF so I could sign Skull Debones. He tells me too bad, You are at war with SWF so I wont sign with you. They all tell me that.


If you're editing stuff like that pre-game, why not just put Skull DeBones on a contract with USPW pre-game?

[Gigas]

If you're editing stuff like that pre-game, why not just put Skull DeBones on a contract with USPW pre-game?

I only did it to test out game mechanics.