Grey Dog Software

Go Back   Grey Dog Software > Total Extreme Wrestling 2016 > Total Extreme Wrestling 2016 Dynasties
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Unread 01-03-2018, 08:56 AM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default Divergent Timelines – historical watcher diaries series

Divergent Timelines
Historical watcher diaries series

Among the many pleasures of TEW, one of my favourite is watching a seemingly living world grow and change before my eyes, with wrestling events being held, wrestlers developing, succeeding and failing, promotions rising and falling, history being made and interesting stories emerging left, right and centre. This project aims to share this pleasure of emergent worlds and narratives with you, dear readers, by describing the universes generated during a hands-off simulation and telling stories about them, hopefully in a way that does them justice.

For this project I will be using various historical mods by The Mod Squad aka the people from Wrestling Nexus, starting with Genadi’s “1987: The Golden Age” mod (version 4.0). While simming fictional universes and organically generated ones is also enjoyable, alternate histories are easier to tell stories about, as even simple comparisons with how events unfolded in the real world provide a lot of interesting starting points, from “I wonder what happened with Bret Hart in this timeline” to “How the hell did THEY manage to go out of business/stay in business for such a long time?” to “Wait, how does the UK have a livelier wrestling scene than Mexico now?”.

There are two ways one can go about doing a watcher diary. One of them is to do write-ups every month or year, chronicling the various events and twists of fate as they happen. The other is to sim a fixed amount of time – say, 10 years – and then write up the current state of the world and how it got to this point. They both have their pros and cons – writing up monthly/yearly lets you keep up with the storylines better, but means that less happens in each update and takes much more time and work, while a huge timeskip lets you describe longer, more interesting stories and changes, but means some detail will inevitably be lost (in TEW’s case, I find it very hard to piece together when/if a turn happened from the available history – this information is visible in the daily news, but for some reason not in the news archive). For my first diary, I chose the second option and simmed from March 1987 when The Golden Age begins to January 1st, 1997. I am not sure which method I will use for any future simulations, if and when they happen, so any feedback is appreciated.

About match ratings – I generally treat them as a metric of audience reaction generated by the match than as a metric of pure quality, taking into account how they can depend more on in-ring work or on popularity/storylines based on the company product – but for me an A* match is obviously a match great both in ring and in the overness department. It’s also important how the ratings compare to company popularity, so, a B- match in a regional company with some D+ pop is a barnstormer, while in a B+ pop National company it’s a run-of-the-mill midcard bout.

My plan is first to do a few general posts about the main divergences from our world and the themes that have developed, then proceed to write up stuff based on things like Hall of Immortals inductions, title histories, Match/Card/Wrestler of the Year awards, as well as things that jump out at me as being good story material. All kinds of feedback on my choice of topics and style/quality of write-ups (I’m not a native English speaker, so language and style critique is appreciated) is welcome, but I’d especially love to know whether you, the readers, want me to cover some specific subject, such as a particular wrestler’s career, the fate of a specific company etc.



TABLE OF CONTENTS

Simulation 1: The Undisputed Kings [1987: The Golden Age by Genadi, simmed to Jan 1997]
Overview - part 1: USA & Japan
Overview - part 2: British Isles
Overview - part 3: Mexico, Europe & Canada

Last edited by Ufnal : 01-07-2018 at 06:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Unread 01-03-2018, 09:00 AM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default

1987 => 1997: THE UNDISPUTED KINGS

Overview - part 1

For decades now, the wrestling world was composed of quite distinct regions, that had their unique perspectives of what constitutes good wrestling. USA, Canada, Mexico, Japan, the UK and Europe – all of them had their overlap in terms of talent and broadcasting, but each of them has always had a distinct flavour. In this timeline however, all of them (except Canada) have one more thing in common – in each of them one Undisputed King, one powerful local wrestling promotion rules the land, standing head and shoulders above all their compatriot competition. This state of affairs is largely due to two huge divergences from our timeline – one that happened in the United States and other that happened in Japan.


USA – Kingdom of WWF

JCP Meltdown – not as you know it…

Perhaps the greatest difference between this timeline and ours is that WCW did not acquire the brightest Jim Crockett Promotions. Ricky Steamboat never came back from his WWF contract, and neither did Randy Savage. Ric Flair, Dusty Rhodes and Kerry Von Erich got scooped by WWF just after JCP folded. A bunch of great workers – Arn Anderson, Barry Windham, Bobby Eaton, Tully Blanchard – left Crockett in autumn 1987 and got signed by WWF in early nineties, after they had done some good work in the smaller promotions, especially in World Class Wrestling Association. Some other wrestlers – Rick Rude, Mike Rotundo, Nikita Koloff – joined them in the regional promotions in 1988, after JCP got bought out (with their contracts either discontinued or not included in the deal), and these stars also got hired by WWF in early nineties. Lex Luger was bizarrely overlooked by WWF and WCW until the former hired him in 1994. The Road Warriors stayed in Japan. Ron Garvin and Ron Simmons committed fully to the smaller regional companies. WCW got some ex-JCP people – Jim Duggan, Dick Slater, Jimmy Garvin, Harley Race (for a time), Kevin Von Erich (for a time), Manny Fernandez, Mike Graham, Ivan Koloff – but not even close to what happened in our timeline. This has led to a radically different wrestling landscape…

The Unrivalled Kings – WWF

The obvious result of the divergence is that WWF are the undisputed rulers of US and global (except from Japan and the UK, perhaps) wrestling world. They routinely get Match of the Year and Wrestler of the Year awards, with an occasional Card of the Year, too. Wrestlemania XII gathered over 93.000 people in the Pontiac Silverdome and made half a million people buy the PPV to watch Ric Flair defend the IC title (that over the years became as prestigious as the Heavyweight one) against Ricky Steamboat in a great main even; other attractions included the Dynamite Express (The Undertaker and Robert Gibson) winning the tag titles, Jackie Sato defending the Women’s title, Eddie Gilbert defeating Scott Steiner, a huge brawl by Dusty Rhodes and Roddy Piper and a wonderful skit by Hulk Hogan and Curt Hennig. The 1996 Survivor Series, which by WWF standards was merely a good show, got a million PPV buys despite the poor economy and a relatively diminished popularity of wrestling among the mainstream audiences [D- economy, D industry], probably due to a great, star-studded main event where Kerry Von Erich, Hogan, Flair and Rude defeated Dusty, Roberts, Steamboat and Macho Man. That’s 80% of WWF main event scene in one match – you’d just need to add Junkyard Dog and Piper for the complete picture. Similarly, the co-main event included almost all the upper midcard except Arn Anderson and Kevin Von Erich, as the British Bulldog, Curt Hennig, Nikita Koloff and Billy Jack Haynes managed to defeat Barry Windham, Bobby Eaton, Harley Race and Tully Blanchard.

This huge presence of great and extremely popular talent also meant that egos were kept in check better, with no single person being seen as irreplaceable – for example Hulk Hogan (who by 1997 became a heel turncoat) only had 3 PPV matches in 1996 including the Survivor Series match and the Royal Rumble, instead focusing on riling the fans up with great promos and non-wrestling segments, with most of his matches done on RAW (although limiting him to shorter TV matches and multi-man stuff may have been a way to deal with his neck problems – it got broken in 1993) – and in 1989-1990, after winning the Intercontinental title, he apparently decided “if I don’t get the Heavyweight belt, I’m gonna make this one the main belt”, having an incredible year-long run [with no matches worse than A].

Of course, there is also a dark side to this success. Most of the main event is made up of veterans over 40 years old, and while most of them are still in quite good physical condition, in a few years this might become a serious problem. This is even more worrying when considering how great talent seems to get a bit wasted in WWF. Bret Hart, The Undertaker and Lex Luger all sit in the midcard, the first two with only some tag gold and Luger without any in his WWF career. Sting is in the lower midcard (at Wrestlemania XII he lost to freakin’ Doink the Clown) and he’s generally better known in Japan where he wrestled many tours with NJPW, AJPW, WAR and FMW – although he’s currently holding the tag titles with a fellow lower midcarder and Japan star, Blue Blazer AKA Owen Hart, which is the first WWF title for both of them. Other lower midcarders include Haku and Scott Steiner. One might think a Scott Steiner & Lex Luger tag team (named Mayhem) is a wonderful thing, but in the last year they have lost 19 out of 24 matches (with 3 draws) and kept getting used as feeders for the Dynamite Express and the Midnight Express, providing high-quality matches [average B, highest B+] yet ultimately achieving nothing before Lex finally turned heel (and got something that at first seemed like a push, then transitioned into more of a jobber-to-the-stars status).

Those That The Fates Cheated – WCW

For WCW, this divergence was obviously a huge hit. They weren’t able to promote themselves as credible competition for WWF [falling to Cult], and in his frustrated drive to build a respected force in the industry Ted Turner has over the years entered an open conflict with many regional companies, from the Harts in the North, to Jerry Jarret’s CWA, to ECW, to the greatest threat WCW was in direct competition with – WCWA. What is worse, after a period with Ken Mantell at the helm in which WCW managed to put out some decent wrestling (the best event of this period was 1994’s SuperBrawl VI, headlined by the very over veteran duo of Harley Race and Larry Zbyszko defeating The Latin Connection of Hector Guerrero and Manny Fernandez, and Davey Boy Smith defending his Universal title against Mark Rocco), the book got into the hands of Moose Morowski. While he made a good decision of choosing Steve Austin as the figurehead and pushing him nicely, he didn’t commit to giving him a title belt. What is more, he doesn’t seem to gel too well with the style WCW management is currently going for – more focused on realistic wrestling and technical side of things, to differentiate themselves from the sports entertainment of WWF. The results are clear when one looks at their final PPV of 1996, Starrcade 1996 (which BTW was attended by less than 7000 people in Wicomico Civic Center in Maryland). It featured a very good bout between Steve Austin and Rick Steiner that featured both technical wrestling and fistfighting and generally was way above all the other matches on the card [B-]… and it happened in the middle of the show. Meanwhile, in the main event, the WCW Universal Title was won by Hector Guerrero. That wouldn’t have been bad (the man is still a very skilled worker), if it wasn’t for the fact that the dethroned champ was Jimmy Garvin, a man of little [~D in most of the country] popularity and about as little in-ring skill, who didn’t manage a single title defence after he relieved the very over but ageing Stan Hansen of the belt (he managed to challenge for the lesser US Heavyweight title and lose, and to get pummelled in a non-title match by Bad News Allen). As one might predict, the resulting match was met with a lukewarm [D+] reception, not helped by young Alex Wright interfering to kickstart his feud with Garvin. Even the semi-main event, where the ex-champ Hansen brawled the living hell out of similarly losing the battle with time Hercules Ayala, was met with much more positive response [C]. In such incapable hands, WCW’s survival is far from certain.

The Unexpected Pretenders – WCWA

The unlikely winner of the troubles surrounding JCP’s meltdown was World Class Wrestling Association. With their rise above regional size in 1987 [they went and stayed Cult] and a declaration of hostilities with Vince McMahon in 1988, WCWA became a natural destination for ex-Crockett workers who either didn’t want to join WWF (for example preferring a very traditional, wrestling-based product) or haven’t been offered a chance to do so. Those stars included Kevin Sullivan, Ricky Morton, Arn Anderson, Barry Windham, Bobby Eaton, Tully Blanchard, Lex Luger, Mike Rotundo and Ron Garvin. WCWA was also an important stop for short-term freelance workers, who included such names as Brain Pillman, Owen Hart, Konnan, “Dr Death” Steve Williams, Terry Funk, Vader and Rick and Scott Steiner. Combined with some impressive long-term household names including Larry Zbyszko, Curt Hennig and Dynamite Kid, WCWA around 1989-1990 was one of the most exciting wrestling companies in the world. Despite gradual departures of many ex-JCP workers and other big stars towards WWF and Turner’s money in WCW, WCWA held strong, with Jim Cornette as the new booker since 1992. However, Jim Kettner became the CEO of WCWA in May 1995, when Fritz Von Erich stepped down, and Ron Fuller (brought to the promotion by Kettner) took over the book, with very bad results, including a decidedly worse product [from a dozen B- and above events in 1994 and two dozen of such events in 1995 to only three in 1996]; a noticeable fall in attendances (but not in PPV buys, curiously); ending Kevin Sullivan’s inspired main title run that lasted over two years and provided matches that WWF stars could be envious of – to then have the title change hands four more times in little over a year, with the current champ Greg Valentine disappointing in his [C to C+] defences; the prestigious Six-Man Tag Team championship left undefended and then vacant for half a year; and a scandal in late 1996 when a series of articles described the culture of extreme bullying that emerged under Fuller’s rule. Time will tell whether WCWA will weather this storm, although with Sullivan, Bam Bam Bigelow, Jim Neidhart and Ray Traylor still in the company, they do have a fighting chance.

The Local Lordships

There is also interesting stuff happening in the regional wrestling in the US, with probably the most important consequence of WWF’s oversaturation being that Jerry Lawler stayed in Continental Wrestling Association as the head booker, and while CWA is not what it was in 1990-1992 when Lawler fought Nikita Koloff, Mark Callous, Rick Rude or Bobby Eaton, but bright new prospects like Paul Wight and Jeff Hardy may prove to be the salvation for CWA – if their association with the powerful National Wrestling Alliance isn’t good enough. Other interesting stories about American regional wrestling that might indeed be told later include the relatively new hardcore movement and UWF: a promotion with a very traditional style that employs what might be the strangest roster in the regional circuit, from Chavo Guerrero Jr. and Booker T, to Kevin Sullivan and Larry Henig, to Maxx Payne and a Sting impersonator (in a world where Sting is a midcarder with a career in Japan more than in the US), to Eric Bischoff and Paul Heyman as a commentary team – and the whole thing is owned by Herb Adams (in this universe, not known for cocaine-fuelled craziness, apparently) and booked by Leo Burke (an elder statesman of Canadian wrestling).


JAPAN – Kingdom of AJPW

The Year of Defeat – 1991


New Japan Pro Wrestling was crowned the Company of the Year five times in a row from 1986 to 1990. In 1991 they were able to get almost 13 million people to watch their NJPW World Pro Wrestling TV show (that’s about a million better than WWF RAW at the time) and their last big event, NJPW Giant Challenge in March 1991 filled the Sapporo Dome with 42.000 eager fans to watch Akira Maeda defeat Yoshiaki Fujiwara in the main event (both men had been considered among the top 20 wrestlers in the world in the last few years). But the costs of maintaining a huge national presence, paying all the big stars and constantly defeating the on-and-off danger of AJPW proved to be too much in a Japan where both the wrestling industry and the economy weren’t as big as they used to. In March 1991 New Japan announced its closing due to mounting financial problems, shocking the fans and the industry. The shock was only deepened when most ex-NJPW stars, including Antonio Inoki himself, joined AJPW shortly thereafter, finally healing the rift between the Big Two of Japanese wrestling.

The Year of Defeat and the Fate of Yoshi

NJPW was not the only company that shocked the Japanese scene in 1991. All Japan Women’s Pro-Wrestling (AJW) in around 1989-1991 was one of the best things that happened to Japanese wrestling, or even to wrestling in general. After Japan Women’s Pro-Wrestling closed in 1988, AJW got all the best Japanese Yoshi wrestlers, as well as some talented foreigners such as Judy Martin, Madusa Micelli, Lola Gonzalez, Velvet McIntyre and Luna Vachon. At the height of their popularity and quality they could have two matches headlining 1990’s As Midnight Approaches (Bull Nakano v Lioness Asuka and Chigusa Nagayo v Noriyo Tateno) that any male-based promotion in the world would be proud to host [both A-rated], in 1991 six of their workers ranked among world’s top 50 wrestlers both male and female, and for their main show of 1990, Japan Grand Prix tournament, they had 25.000 people in the audience. However, AJW managed to keep up despite a worsening market and economy by cutting costs in the production department – which meant than in the periods when AJPW didn’t try to fight NJPW directly but instead focused on promoting itself as a complementary promotion [ie they went cult], it outshone AJW (who were gunning for a similar spot] pretty badly. Combined with only having TV for tour highlights, this meant that more and more people chose to use their shrinking resources to watch something else than AJW – and in August 1991 the Yoshi Heaven closed. It was not the end of yoshi, however. In Japan women’s wrestling has found itself hard pressed – Rumi Kazama’s Ladies Legend Pro Wrestling only lasted two years and never reached AJW’s heights, and both Michinoku Pro-Wrestling and the legendary Wrestle Association “R” that had women’s divisions closed their doors in 1995; nowadays the only reasonably sized promotion that still shows yoshi matches is the hardcore bonanza known as Frontier Martial-Arts Wrestling. However, the brilliant alumni of AJW (and, to some extent, of JWP) have taken over women’s wrestling all over the world, from the US to Mexico to the UK, revolutionizing and revitalizing that part of the industry.

AJPW – The Ever-Troubled King

AJPW’s cadre of elite Japanese wrestlers was always almost as impressive as NJPW’s, with names such as Riki Choshu and Toshiaki Kawada (who had the surprise MOTY of 1987 at the Puroresu Chukei TV show), and All Japan used its National Wrestling Alliance connections to supplement the natives with a host of foreign stars, some only for short excursions (including such names as Rick Flair, Kerry Von Erich, Larry Zbyszko and Steve Williams), others spent the best part of their career there (as was the case with Ted DiBiase and the Road Warriors). This combination virtually guaranteed great wrestling, and indeed half the Cards of the Year in the last decade belonged to All Japan.Death of NJPW not only eliminated the only serious competition for All Japan, but also provided them with a huge influx of talent great enough that it made AJPW Company of the Year from 1990 to 1994. The strength of the NJPW presence is best exemplified by two facts. One – in spring of 1995, Riki Choshu (who in this timeline never returned to NJPW and became the AJPW figurehead and one of the best wrestlers of the world), who at the time was starting to get visibly older and less magnificent in the ring, was replaced as the figurehead and main focus of AJPW marketing machine by Akira Maeda, the controversial ex-NJPW star. Two – as of the start of 1997 two out of three main AJPW titles (that in our timeline got unified into the Triple Crown, but in this one stayed as separate titles, which was important when the roster swelled after NJPW closed down) are held by ex-NJPW workers: The Great Muta is the NWA International Heavyweight Champ and Nobuhiko Takada holds the NWA United National title, with only Toshiaki Kawada defending the “old guard’s” honour holding the PWF World Heavyweight title. The division between ex-New Japan and All Japan-only workers was clearly visible during the Champion Carnival 1996, a solid contender for Card of the Year, which finished with three phenomenal bouts between members of those two factions, with Kawada defending his PWF title against the legendary Tatsumi Fujinami (TEW 500 rated them as #6 and #7 best wrestlers of 1996, respectively), Takada beating the young, NWA-seasoned sensation Kenta Kobashi and the NJPW junior innovator turned brawler Atsushi Onita beat another AJPW-loyal, well-traveled future star Satoshi Kojima to retain the AJPW Junior Heavyweight belt. The card drew an audience of 28.000 people and proved that AJPW at its best is also world’s best.

However, given how bad Japanese economy and wrestling industry is, it’s inevitable that AJPW had to suffer through some hard times. In late 80s and early 90s the constant competition with NJPW and worsening financial situation made them constantly switch between trying to compete nationally against NJPW and trying to maintain their hold on their core audience. Their last stint as a truly All-Japan, nationally broadcast and marketed promotion, happened in 1996 and lasted for just one tour before the financial realities put an end to it. Despite being probably good enough to become a national cultural phenomenon like WWF did in the States, AJPW lacks stablility and economic ability to achieve a similar status in the long term. This instability was what cost Motoko Baba her place as the head of the company that her husband built, as in 1991 she was bought out and replaced by Shinya Koshika, who appointed Mitsuharu Misawa (aka Tiger Mask II) as the head booker. That change did not help with another big problem that AJPW has – the age of some of their main stars. Five of them are 45 or older, with some of them still going strong, but others visibly exceeding their welcome at the top. The most striking example of that problem is probably Yoshiaki Fujiwara – a veteran of both NJPW and AJPW, he was one of the top Japanese wrestlers in 1987-1991, but now time has caught up with him. When fighting against competent opponents he can deliver perfectly acceptable and reasonably exciting matches [around B level], but putting him up against another well-past-his-prime legend in Masa Saito resulted in two offensively bad outings, in which the veterans were clearly aiming for something interesting, but their failing bodies and lack of ability to deliver in-ring prevented that from happening [D+ and C-]. Paradoxically, in the last year he was used more, not less, perhaps in a bid to increase the star power and nostalgia value of AJPW’s tour shows, which – when he is used to main event them against other old guard – leads to him letting the fans down and contributing to AJPW’s reputation of unreliableness. The Unsteady Kings of AJPW will have to make a transition from veterans like Saito and Fujiwara to youngsters like Kobashi and Kojima (or even to wonderful but currently overshadowed workers like Tiger Mask II) if they wish their reign to be long and fruitful.

The Cycle of Life

Japanese wrestling scene is a harsh place, where new promotions are born to die after 2-3 years, when the demands of constant touring and low income due to economic problems drain their initial finance reserves. So far, only Shoichi Arai’s Frontier Martial-Arts Wrestling, with its unique combination of hardcore, comedy and impossible stunts devised by Arai and Victor Quinones (and helped by an ever-changing roster of magnificent workers from all over the world) has managed to take roots in the Chubu region, stay alive since 1989 and basically kickstart the hardcore movement in wrestling. This is probably why why the only “name” promotion other than FMW and AJPW, International Wrestling Association of Japan established by Super Delfin and (ECW-connected) Kevin Nash in 1994 is also a garbage wrestling company, albeit with less comedy and more traditional style. There are, however, many short-lived promotions that hold an important place both in fans’ hearts and in history, with the most famous being probably Giant Baba’s “side project” called Wrestle Association “R”, the Mecca and Holy Grail of tape traders and early Internet smarks, which deserves a whole story on its own.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Unread 01-03-2018, 01:40 PM
TsuMirren TsuMirren is offline
Major League
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 838
Default

NJPW ever closing just provea that TEW is flawed on a grand scale. The ai should apparently adapt, make changes to stop major losses for example. But, through testing and working on various mods it's become apparent that just isn't the case. Closing inside 5 years just shows there's a major flaw in there somewhere...maybe it's wages, maybe it's the promotion not hiring enough lower level guys, who knows. Even if, we, the Mod Squad made a colossal **** of the mod and didn't pad out future workers enough or balance starting workers you'd hope the ai would adapt. Breaks between tours should offer a natural reset point for finances etc.

Anyway, interesting diary concept and I'm looking forward to seeing how the UK & Europe plays out.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Unread 01-03-2018, 02:07 PM
Bluestillidie00's Avatar
Bluestillidie00 Bluestillidie00 is offline
Low Minors
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TsuMirren View Post
NJPW ever closing just provea that TEW is flawed on a grand scale. The ai should apparently adapt, make changes to stop major losses for example. But, through testing and working on various mods it's become apparent that just isn't the case. Closing inside 5 years just shows there's a major flaw in there somewhere...maybe it's wages, maybe it's the promotion not hiring enough lower level guys, who knows. Even if, we, the Mod Squad made a colossal **** of the mod and didn't pad out future workers enough or balance starting workers you'd hope the ai would adapt. Breaks between tours should offer a natural reset point for finances etc.

Anyway, interesting diary concept and I'm looking forward to seeing how the UK & Europe plays out.
On my RW save, Kojima and Tenzan main evented Wrestle Kingdom 12, while Okada and Naito just had an confrontation angle. The AI in this game is utter shite at times. As far as I'm concerned, the main event of every PPV should be the main event champion vs the most popular worker who's not the champion, to at least somewhat replicate real life. Okada is constantly the star of the show, yet he's midcard while Kojima and Tenzan are Main Eventing every show. I can leave someone like Natalya or even Darren Young on PPAs, (I like putting my lower card guys on PPAs, theoretically, they'd wrestle more away from me) and no one will try to pick them up, even on a PPA. Like, if Natalya was available, every company and their dad, would be trying to sign her for an appearance. Instead she's never picked up on a PPA.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Unread 01-03-2018, 02:17 PM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluestillidie00 View Post
On my RW save, Kojima and Tenzan main evented Wrestle Kingdom 12, while Okada and Naito just had an confrontation angle. The AI in this game is utter shite at times.
Yeah, we'll see lots of this kind of crap unfortunately. Starrcade 1996 with Austin in midcard* was not a one-off thing. WWF keeps doing strange stuff, too, but I can at least explain that away as an overabundance of legitimate all-time greats and superstars + locker room politics had to lead to some questionable omissions.


Also, thanks for the comments, both of you!

*EDIT: To be fair, WCW's current booker has Booking Skills of F, so that might just be the stats at work. xD

Last edited by Ufnal : 01-03-2018 at 02:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Unread 01-04-2018, 12:01 AM
Genadi's Avatar
Genadi Genadi is offline
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 3,664
Default

This is awesome, thanks for doing this.

Great read, will be following.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Unread 01-04-2018, 02:27 AM
DomNWO DomNWO is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 68
Default

this was an amazing read, keep this up!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Unread 01-05-2018, 09:42 AM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default

Overview - part 2

//I wanted to post the whole rest of the world in the part 2, but I want to introduce the regions in order of importance, and Mexico is giving me a tough time - both because I know little about it and because it's a bit of a mess - so I decided to post the UK for now. Or, to be precise, the only really interesting company in the UK and my favourite promotion in this timeline...

BRITISH ISLES – Kingdom of ASW

King ASW and the Knights of the Round Table

In our world, UK’s All Star Wrestling had a brief period of glory, when in 1987-1988 a short period of TV exposure on ITV combined with great wrestling provided by legends such as Johnny Saint, Mark Rocco, Tony St. Clair, Fit Finlay, Chic Cullen, Kendo Nagasaki and (briefly) young Flying Fuji Yamada, later known as Jyushin Thunder Liger. They would then go on to milk the boost in popularity until mid-90s, never again achieving such heights. In this timeline, however, the TV deal did not expire and Flying Fuji Yamada never left the UK, instead spending 1989 and 1990 in a terrific feud with Chic Cullen over the World Lightweight title that cemented the company’s position as a cult phenomenon in the Isles and defined the ASW style – mixing traditional wrestling with character work and a healthy dose of fast-paced, high-flying action, and putting together workers from different parts of the globe in interesting, well-paced fights where they could show what they are worth. And in the world where WCW was falling flat and the Japanese scene was struggling, such a place was a Promised Land, or maybe more thematically a Camelot, where true knights could join the Round Table and prove their valour.

Thus, from 1990 much of ASW’s history was written by people who came to England looking for a place in the world. First, when UK’s Joint Promotions [and BWF] started to crumble midway through 1990, the best British talent converged on ASW, including Tony Walsh, Greg Valentine (the nephew of famous “Big Daddy” Shirley Crabtree, not the American wrestler), Marty Jones, Johnny Angel, and above all the sensational Danny “Boy” Collins, a youngster not only imitating but surpassing the Japanese juniors with his mat wrestling, flying shenanigans and jaw-dropping athleticism, whose feud with Flying Fuji Yamada defined 1991 for ASW. Another crucial signing of that time was Madusa Micelli, a young American wrestler with US and Japanese experience, who joined the best of British female wrestlers to kickstart what would become the best women’s division in the world. Arguably the most important event of 1990, however, was the signing of two American journeymen who would help define ASW and pave a way for more US-born stars: Scot Hall and Vader. Hall at the time had successful tours with New Japan and All Japan under his belt, while Vader after leaving AWA in 1988 toured with AJPW and European Catch Wrestling Association. Both of them spent some time in WCWA, but compared to their Japanese successes, wrestling the States was a letdown for them, with differences in style and booking combined with crowds that didn’t appreciate their pedigree. Not wanting to move to Japan full-time but not seeing a place for themselves in the US, they decided to join All-Star Wrestling as a compromise – and boy, did that compromise pay off. Hall took some time to adjust to the UK before finally becoming one of their most important players. Vader had much less problems, with his televised match against Yamada from September 1990 being hailed at the time as the most exciting thing that happened in ASW, or even in all of UK’s modern wrestling. The final pieces of the glorious machine that ASW is today came together two years later, with the signing of the tremendous young talent Tony Stewart, and more importantly with Shawn Michaels and Brian Pillman, two great youngsters fed up with WCWA and ignored by WWF and WCW, arriving and conquering the place. Michaels’ feuds with Yamada and Collins defined how ASW looks today (and brought him a Wrestler of the Year award in 1994, the only one in the 90s not won by a WWF wrestler). While Pillman’s run wasn’t as impressive, his tag team with Collins, despite winning no gold, became Tag Team of the Year after their brief war against Hall & Michaels brought us the best tag wrestling of 1995. Add to that the stunning female talent both local and imported from defunct Japanese promotions (including 1992 & 1995 Female Wrestler of the Year Mayumi Ozaki and JWP veteran, 1996 Female Wrestler of the Year Nancy Kumi), National Wrestling Alliance membership that helped negotiate some fruitful talent loans (from Butch Reed and Kamala to Kenta Kobashi and Atshushi Onita), as well as some young local talent getting their spotlight thanks to the abundance of title belts (the one to watch among those is Steven Regal) and you have the answer to a stunned question repeated by many in the wrestling industry: How did a regional UK company manage to turn into 1995 & 1996 Company of the Year that goes head to head with WWF in terms of popularity (at least in the British Isles)?

Of course, All Star has its fair share of flaws. Their American and Japanese workers have recently been presented as the main eventers, which has alienated some hardcore British fans that didn’t feel too positively about the British stars being used as mostly upper midcard (although to be fair, two out of five biggest belts in the company are held by British men. Why, yes, ASW has a huge amount of titles). And just in the last year the booking team has diminished their Women’s title (which in better periods is seen as no less prestigious than any men’s title in the world) by putting it on 47-years-old, extremely physically diminished and injury-prone Mitzi Mueller (who, to be fair, is a British veteran of much renown and while not good anymore still manages a non-terrible average quality in her matches [C+]). They proceeded to vacate the title when she broke her foot, then managed to lift it to its legendary heights again via short but intense and exciting reigns of Madusa and Nancy Kumi before giving the title back to Mitzi who, despite her best efforts, again dragged it down into mediocrity. Problems like those are far from crippling, however, and ASW is still standing strong as the King of Britain and one of the best wrestling promotions in the world.

//Question for the readers: Should I use bold/underlined text to introduce new names, or would it be more confusing and cluttering than helpful?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Unread 01-07-2018, 06:00 PM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default

Overview - part 3 and final

MEXICO – Kingdom of CMLL

The history of Mexican wrestling diverged significantly in 1987, when Antonio Pena, who in our timeline defected from CMLL in 1992 (along with a bunch of lighter, more fast-paced workers dissatisfied with the more traditional style of CMLL) to open Asistencia Asesoría y Administración (which resulted in the death of UWA and shook the foundations of CMLL’s domination and of lucha libre itself). Another change occured in April 1989, when Francisco Flores, the co-founder and owner of Universal Wrestling Association (the second biggest Lucha promotion after the ancient beast that is Consejo Mundial de Lucha Libre) died, and Pena took over instead of opening his own company. This meant that he didn’t have as much creative control as in reality, and his leaving didn’t coincide with a huge walkout from CMLL that would provide him with talent and cause an upset in the market which he could exploit (actually, CMLL, then known as EMLL, did release a whooping amount of 21 workers in the previous year as a cost-cutting measure, but their competition didn’t capitalise on that and many of those wrestlers did not find work in Mexico in the following years). Pena did manage to cause some change in the lucha world by strengthening UWA and inspiring a more modern direction in the third name promotion of Mexico, World Wrestling Association, but the changes were far from regicidal. Moreover, the Mexican wrestling industry (perhaps due to the lack of AAA changing things up, perhaps due to some other butterfly flapping its wings somewhere) has been declining for some time – the big three can bring 7 (WWA), 10 (UWA) or even close to 20 (CMLL PPVs) thousand people to their shows, but outside the hard lucha fanbase there’s little mainstream interest in the sport (so much that Mexico is the only place other than Japan where WWF does not broadcast its programming). As a result, while both the regional companies are actually not that far away from CMLL in terms of wrestling quality or star power, they are the only Mexican promotion with a TV and PPV presence, due to their long history of delivering stable product as much as to the superior quality of their wrestling. Therefore, the Old King maintains his grip on the Mexican throne to this day.

The Old King and his Four Princes – CMLL

Known until 1991 as Empresa Mexicana de Lucha Libre (EMLL) and since then as Consejo Mundial de Lucha Libre, CMLL is the oldest existing pro wrestling promotion, with over 60 years of history. This has not changed from our timeline – but two other significant things did. First is the Big Layoff of 1988 that was mentioned above – in April, 21 workers were informed their contracts will not be extended and they left the company in May. The reasons for that are one of the hottest topics of speculation and scandalous gossip in the wrestling world – although financial problems, a declining industry and a conviction that a small roster with just a few main stars was more than sufficient to turn in profit were the most logical reasons, wild theories have emerged over the years, about Pena’s backstage manipulation causing a walkout or, to the contrary, EMLL executives purging the company of Pena sympathisers (throwing out his protégé Octagon seems to support this idea), as well as rumours about fights emerging backstage over the extremely limited TV time – but no substantial evidence for this kind of gossip ever emerged. What we know is that out of those 21 wrestlers 11 (most of them veterans, but some relatively promising rookies, too) never found any stable employment outside the independent circle (which, due to the amount of relatively well-known luchadores desperate for a source of income, has emerged despite the relative weakness of lucha industry). On the other hand, the list of the released includes quite a few people who later proved their worth, such as Vampiro (who had some success touring Japan before joining WWF undercard and recently teaming up with the One Man Gang), Blue Demon Jr. (who’s now doing reasonable midcard work for the other two Mexican promotions), Cachorro Mendoza (whose run in lower midcard of WAR lasted over two years and proved he’s a capable worker) and Eddie Guerrero (who is now a respected tourer and tag wrestler in Japan, especially in FMW, where his team with Manabu Nakanishi called “Breakout” has held gold five times in total). Other important or promising wrestlers have left EMLL not long after the layoff, most importantly a friend of Blue Demon Jr. Atlantis (who later combined a championship-winning career in UWA and WWA with some decent Japanese tours), and MS-1, one of the mainstays of early EMLL MS-1, who later found success in WAR. All those departments would be enough to bury a medium-sized company, even with CMLL staying in the NWA in this timeline and massively profiting from its talent trades – especially seeing as there are currently only 14 full-time in-ring workers with written contracts, 7 men and 7 women. So how did CMLL manage to stay afloat with such a decimated roster?

The common opinion among the lucha fans will have you believe that it’s all due to the four people nicknamed Four Princes or Four Walls/Corners of CMLL… and it’s mostly right. While veterans such as Kung Fu, MS-1, Mascara Ano 2000 and El Satanico (who slowly bled away from the company due to age, or in case of Mascara due to wanting to try some different challenges, with Kung Fu leaving as late as November 1996) were crucial in late 80s up to early nineties, three people were always crucial for EMLL/CMLL: the youngster turned legend El Dandy, nearly synonymous with the prestigious NWA World Middleweight title; Rayo de Jalisco Jr., a second generation star and one of the flashiest and certainly most charismatic luchador of his time; and Lizmark, a veteran now much past his prime, who still is a valuable midcard member, but in his early 90s prime he helped catapult El Dandy to stardom in the second most important feuds in company’s history, the first being Dandy’s feud with Rayo de Jalisco Jr., which started in earnest in 1991 and continues to be the main story behind CMLL to this very day. The fourth member of the Princes has changed over the years – Rayo de Jalisco Sr. was widely considered to be the Fourth Corner until his demise in 1994. Nowadays, some people point to the ugly yet very entertaining brawler veteran Emilio Charles Jr., who’s been recently helping El Dandy in his feud against Rayo and who currently holds the NWA World Light Heavyweight title, others point to Jerry Estrada, who tagged with El Dandy in the early 90s to great effect, then recently had stellar bouts against both Dandy and Rayo, and throughout the last two years has been fighting with Lizmark (each man defending a title belt) in what may be a passing-the-torch storyline. For an American audience, a product consisting of around 10 men at each time (including the undercard and occasional freelancers and NWA loans) fighting each other and nobody else for a few years would probably be deeply flawed (even when you add a good women’s division that includes an AJW legend and one time Female Wrestler of the Year Lioness Asuka, American sensation Sherri Martel and Australia-born veteran Susan Sexton). In Mexico, where the remaining lucha fans seem to be very conservative and prone to like what they already got accustomed to liking, keeping to the same formula based on a few legitimately hugely talented luchadores is good enough to ensure CMLL’s cult-like following across the country stays stable.

//Seriously though, the state of CMLL’s roster is so strange. Rayo de Jalisco Jr. is the only main eventer, El Dandy is the only Upper Midcarder, Lizmark and Estrada are midcarders, Emilio Charles is LM and there’s an Opener and an Enhancement Talent. The tag belts are currently womens’ belts, which actually makes sense, and the trios titles are vacant since 1994. Meanwhile, Paco Alonso (owner/booker) has a preferred roster size of “Very large”, CMLL has a bank of 20 MILLION DOLLARS, and… *checks some other stuff up after looking at the finances* oh damn and they have a hiring rule of “STYLE MUST BE PSYCHOPATH”. Which is present in the main database, not only in the savefile. Huh. That would explain certain things. Soooo, either my file is corrupted, or I’ve found my first bug. If it’s NOT corrupted, then I guess it was supposed to be “style must be luchador” and I’m updating my database accordingly. Explaining this away as “they prefer a small bunch of wrestlers because they are conservative/have a conservative audience” makes for a nice bit of a story, but if I ever sim the database further, it would suck to have CMLL fold due to something like that.


The Would Be King and The Prince of the North – UWA and WWA

Universal Wrestling Association and World Wrestling Association have very much in common – half of UWA’s male luchadores work for WWA, and 3/4 of WWA’s luchadores work for UWA. Those shared workers include such names as the criminally underrated Atlantis, Silver King and Blue Demon Jr., Mexican and Japanese stars Dr. Wagner Jr. and El Hijo del Santo, veteran Mando Guerrero and the greatest non-CMLL luchador star in Mexico Rey Misterio, and ex-CMLL Universo 2000. While UWA has some more stars, including Mascara Ano 2000 and a couple of seasoned veterans Lobo Rubio and Perro Aguayo, as well as a women’s division, the basic lineup stays the same. They also both benefit from insights provided by the notorious Bill Apter. Their situation, however, is a bit different, with Pena’s UWA located in Western Mexico in the home region of CMLL and dreaming of overthrowing the king, while WWA stays comfortably in Northern Mexico. UWA is also much more committed to promoting a modern, fast and aerial style of lucha, despite being the one which has two 50+ veterans among their top players. Both companies promote wrestling on a level comparable to CMLL’s, with the small difference in audience reactions being mostly a result of their workers being less famous, not less talented.



EUROPE – Kingdom of CWA


The Catch Wrestling Association isn’t the King of Continental European Wrestling due to some great achievements. It’s just that apart from Les Thatcher’s short-lived Eurostars no company promoting regular shows appeared on the European scene in the last decade. Otto Wanz’s touring traditional show is therefore the only game in town, but despite a lesser size and quality than the rulers of other areas, it still has its interesting quirks. It promotes a weird combination of old, past their prime fighters (such as Otto Wanz himself, an ex-boxer who, having turned 48, is now nowhere near as good as his multiple tournament wins and current main title reign would indicate) and young, highly talented and motivated workers (such as incredibly athletic and smoothly-worker brawler Baldwin Jeker* or the impressive Italian technician James Maritato) with a huge amount of foreign talent, touring or loaned via the NWA. Many a well-known worker has done a tour or several in CWA: Chris Benoit, Dynamite Kid, Keiichi Yamada [as Jushin “Thunder” Liger], Ken Shamrock, King Kong Bundy, Konnan, Masakatsu Funaki, Mike Rotundo, Naoki Sano, Owen Hart, Rey Misterio Jr., Rick Rude, Scott Hall, Scott Steiner, Shawn Michaels, Shinya Hashimoto, Silver King, Tony St Clair, Vader, Yokuzuna and Yuji Nagata. The list of outside stars who only came by for a match or two is also impressive – it includes Butch Reed, Chic Cullen, Johnny Saint, The Great Muta, Kendo Nagasaki, Kenta Kobashi, Masanobu Fuchi, Riki Choshu, Steve Austin, Ted DiBiase and Tony Walsh. And let’s not forget about people that started or got their big break in CWA before emigrating, such as the current WCW employees Alex Wright, Luc Poirier and Prince Zefy, as well as Satoshi Kojima who learned his craft between CWA and UWFi, or the people who are winding down their careers in CWA after succeeding elsewhere, with the most prominent example being George “The Animal” Steele.

However, diverse and largely unknown talent brought in for a short time to work a product that needs both smooth in ring action and a strong connection with the fans leads to the possibility of their matches either tanking horribly or being awesome. In 1996 we have seen examples of both. February’s Number of the Beast** was ruined by a main event NWA title defence where Chic Cullen (a great and decorated ASW veteran who still has much of his abilities, but whose body is getting frail, who has little innate charisma and is not really known in Europe) defeated Mile Zrno (a 49-year-old veteran of CWA, great person and trainer but at this point battered, frail and way past the point where he could keep up in-ring with even an aged Cullen) in a match that failed elicit much of any reaction from the crowd. By contrast, Syndicate Rules X** had its (quite good, actually) main event bout between Otto Wanz and Baldwin Jeker overshadowed by a semi-main event where the veteran yet still very capable Steve Wright (Alex’s father and one of the better European technicians) and Masakatsu Funaki (who, to be fair, despite being primarily an FMW guy, is such a regular in CWA’s ring that he hardly counts as an outside talent nowadays) stole the show in one of the better technical displays European rings have ever seen. And seeing as the best series of matches in CWA’s history is still Vader against Steve Wright from 1988-1990, it’s no wonder why they keep bringing new outsiders in.
This instability does provide some emotional rollercoasters for CWA fans, but doesn’t seem to be a problem for the company itself. With a steady timeslot for tour highlights and events on the German (but available throughout Europe) cable station RTL, CWA maintains the interest of what wrestling fans can be found in Europe, and with more than 1500 people attending the tour shows and a steady interest in their big events, the future of catch wrestling is secure.

//* Baldwin Jeker is, unfortunately, a regenerated worker, because I forgot to turn the option off… Ah well, this is as good a place as any to ask – do you prefer your historical long-term simulations to feature regeneration and/or new worker generation, representing people who in our timeline never got into wrestling but somehow did in this one? Or do you prefer them to stick closer to history?
** Those randomly generated event names are so bad and not in CWA’s style, but I’m not sure I want to try and invent new ones when those are already in the game history…



CANADA – A Kingless Land

Canada is a strange place. The overall interest in wrestling is, proportionally, possibly bigger than in any other place in the world, and WWF programming is quite popular, yet until this year there were only two relatively small promotions around, with little to no independent shows worth noticing. While the recent emergence of ECCW, a fast-paced hardcore company with the talented Adam Copeland as their figurehead that utilizes a touring schedule, the local scene has begun to shape up a little, but the promotion is too young and small to even have a shot at becoming the definite leader in the region. However, there is not much competition for that title. All-Star Wrestling (not to be confused with All Star Wrestling, the King of UK) has recently been improving since Eric Bischoff took over the booking in 1994, but it’s still quite small and not very popular even in its home British Columbia. And Stampede Wrestling Calgary…

The Could’ve Been King – Stampede Wrestling Calgary

It is probably unfair to say that SWC’s story boils down to the fact that Ross Hart isn’t a great booker. He probably couldn’t have kept the best workers he had available forever, or even for much longer, and without them SWC achieving and maintaining a country-wide following is not a realistic vision. However, booking the best part of last decade as Harts versus Singhs was decidedly not the best idea. “Hometown heroes versus dastardly foreigners” is a classic wrestling trope, but without good wrestling it can only provide some cheap heat from the traditionally-minded, not lead a promotion to new heights. Especially when the only talented heel stable member, Gama Singh, gets relegated to mainly tag wrestling. Instead of Gama, Ross Hart had the relatively mediocre Makhan Singh, aka Mike Shaw, as the heavyweight champ for two and a half friggin years before finally making his superstar-in-making brother Owen Hart win the belt (which elevated the title quite a lot – Makhan had good matches against Owen, not so much against Bruce Hart, and the occasional different challenger was even worse; Owen could do good to great matches [for a regional promotion] against all three Singhs). After a bit more than a year, he put the title on Makhan AGAIN (with mediocre results). While Owen got a second run in 1992, he soon left for greener Japanese pastures. Both his remaining brothers were tried out as replacement champions – Keith proved to be average at best, and while Bruce (the owner of the company after their father Stu finally retired) fared better, he still was not remotely close to Owen. Now there’s finally some positive change with the Singhs gone from the company, as Jonathan Sayers holds the belt with about the same acceptable but far from groundbreaking results as Bruce Hart. This may be harsh on a regional company with no big ambitions – hell, they are without doubt the best in Canada and better than many smaller promotions around the US, and with their workrate-focused style they have put out some decent wrestling. Yet, we are talking about a company that since 1987 has at various points employed Brian Pillman, Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho, Hiroshi Hase – who had some good or very good matches for a regional gig, but never got capitalized on or pushed before they decided to look elsewhere for their place in the world (with various degrees of success). Had Stampede focused more on those talented workers instead of pushing Singhs and the less-talented Harts as the main forces in the company, we could have had a king in Canada. A glimmer of hope has recently emerged as it seems that Ross Hart has recognized the talent of Lance Storm and Artus Lapointe*, putting some gold on them (the tag and midcard straps respectively) and actually giving them a bit of a push. It remains to be seen how that will turn out, especially as Eric Bischoff also pushes them quite hard (though without any championship gold as of yet).

//* [who is a regenerated character with Stu Hart’s face apparently...]


*****

COMMENTARY ON THE MOD

So after I’ve done the initial overview, I feel I can provide some comments:
• It’s huge, it’s full of people I’ve never heard about and it’s turning into a great living world! I really like it, especially with lots of narratives and ager pics which help feel the passage of time.
• Two problems I’ve found so far – the CMLL hiring only psychopaths and the WCW Power Plant not being set as owned by WCW. I haven’t really rummaged through the database innards too much, though.
• Importance levels in Scotland, Ireland, Europe and Australia are quite low after those 10 years. This means that even having B+ pop all over the British Isles does not make All Star Wrestling (UK) a national promotion, because they need C+ importance in 4 regions and B+ pop only gives you D+ imp in Scotland and D in England. It also means that WWE can’t really get a stable international status (they keep achieving and then losing it), as a B+ pop across Europe does not even equal Cult there (only in Central Europe their importance exceeds C+; it’s C in Scandinavia and France), in the UK they have the same problem as ASW, and B/B+ all over Australia gives them a D+ or E+ importance in ¾ of the region
• In 1996, WWF had NINE A* matches, including 7 different competitors in various combinations (Ricky Steamboat, Kerry von Erich, Randy Savage, Ric Flair, Jake Roberts, Roddy Piper, Rick Rude). The number of workers in WWF that the search engine qualifies as Excellent in-ring workers is 20 (including 3 female wrestlers), Excellent performance skills – 34. 51-year-old Dusty Rhodes has an average rating of A across 12 matches in 1996 (and is the World Heavyweight Champ, actually). All of this makes me feel that the stats of the American veterans might have gotten a bit inflated, perhaps due to good destiny/ageing rolls – although as early as 1989 there were 7 A* matches in WWF and 10 A* matches the year after, so the initial stats seem to be quite high, too. I get that a WWF with all the best old guard wrestlers that WCW got in our timeline would have been glorious, both in terms of in-ring action and popular appeal, but I do feel that might be a bit much. Especially when you compare those WWF numbers to AJPW – 4 times company of the year, 5 cards of the year, got the best talent from NJPW, zero A* matches ever. NJPW got one just one A* match before they were forced to close. CMLL also had none, as well as ASW UK (with their 15 A* events in the last 2 years and some of the best middle-aged talent in the world in addition to their own good workers – OK, their top guys are B+ pop not A*, but their product is AFAIK more performance-based).
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Unread 01-11-2018, 09:52 PM
DomNWO DomNWO is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 68
Default

you plan on going further with this save? I'm really interested in this!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Unread 01-13-2018, 07:27 AM
Ufnal Ufnal is offline
Rookie
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 88
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DomNWO View Post
you plan on going further with this save? I'm really interested in this!
Yeah. I'm writing up a bigger post now, about NWA and more specifically about a certain belt that rose way above what it was supposed to be... [which is also a tryout for my idea of writing up title histories - we'll see how it reads and if anybody cares]


Or maybe you meant simming it a few more years? I am considering that option, yes.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


Array [all_times_are_gmt_x_time_now_is_y]


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.