The Official WWE Discussion Thread *May Contain Spoilers*

[Tha Black Phenom]

WWE Network.. I guess it was a matter of time.

As for the angle, well maybe they have a set plan for NOC. Maybe it does look like hotshotting, but they have plenty to work with now and with Punk and HHH being promo kings, they'll make good use of it.

Going to Raw live next week, so I can't wait.

[Teh_Showtime]

I should be there right now... I totally crapped the bed on this one. Looks like I'll have to wait another year or so to go to a TV event.

[angeldelayette]

Where is CM Punk to ask what happened to the Anonymous Raw GM? lol.

[djthefunkchris]

Originally Posted by Fantabulous

When you were regularly doing 6's in your heyday, 3.0's don't look good to TV executives who only know numbers and not the reasoning behind them. Nobody should kid themselves that either side is happy with the numbers as they are right now.

Your only talking about four years... and really only around 3.5 years (1.5 actually averaging around 6.0). They have consistantly been around where they are outside of the first couple years of RAW (which was considerably lower).

You have to understand how ratings work as well. It is based on a percent of households, not based on how many households.... although you can figure that out. There are alot more TV's now then there were 20 years ago.

For example: There were 102.2 million TV households in 2000-2001 (Raw's heyday). Now there are 115.9 million households.

Each 1.0 represents 1%. So 1,022,000 households for 2000-2001, 1,159,000 viewers now.

A 6.0 in their Heyday would be 6,132,000 viewers, a 4.0 then would be 4,088,000.

A 4.0 today would mean 4,636,000 viewers, a 6.0 would be close to 7 Million (6,954,000).

EDIT: I meant to put something else here for an example. A 3.0 today is roughly the equivalent to a 3.5 in 2000-2001. So in all honesty, the viewership, according to the numbers (Which Neilson numbers are in question moreso then not), WWE is actually averaging more viewers on RAW outside of a very small time period.

There is alot more options now, then there were 20 years ago as well. All this stuff that people don't think matter's, really does.

Let me use an anology (although I often hate using them). IF you have two flavors of Ice Cream to choose from for desert, and you split it amoung 10 people, they are going to do quite well. Now, if you now have 15 people, but 10 flavors of ice cream to choose from, another five types of deserts on top of that (pie, cake, etc.), then your not going to expect the Vanilla and Chocolate to actually do as well as they did when the other's were not available, although they are still your two highest rated deserts.

In a nut shell, your crazy if you think the network is unhappy in the slightest.

[20LEgend]

I can't stand Kevin Nash, he really is so out of touch. Made WWE cool and exciting again, lol, Nash. Also poor explanation of the text (Nash to Nash) there is clearly more to this.

MizTruth were great again.

Also Mr. H's, just accepting the resign as COO stip was stupid, why would he, he has no need to.

Logically, this feud is getting worse. Started off with Punk being sharp, breaking all the cliches, now he is just falling into the traps (illustrated by his match with Cena when Nash came out. He had it won and then turned around.) And the whole HHH had something to do with it, I get he believes that, but to be so sure makes him look I don't know the word , I hope he's right though because if it's Nash and Johnny Ace, I'll be pissed.

[juggaloninjalee]

My opinion of last night mixed with some fantasy booking.

HHH fires Nash for real.

After the stipulation of losing his position as COO Nash feels he has to be there to help HHH win. Nash feels that if he helps Hunter win that he will get his job back.

Either way I think Nash will only be around until the Royal Rumble and then he will be no more.

[Carmichael]

CM punk has to take responsibility for this rubbishness, I think hes fantastic on the mic, like very entertaining, so i'll give him a pass on the weak segments with Nash and HHH.

However, last week his match with the miz was terrible and it got a low rating in the breakdown, last night his r truth match was boring again.

When you see what reaction Cena or Randy Orton are getting in the ring, you cant blame the booking for the lack of interest in CM Punks matches, hes so overrated in the ring by the IWC its unreal.

[Self]

I miss 'growing old gracefully, hanging out with cruiserweights, comedy' Kevin Nash, with all his grey haired glory.

[OldStingberg]

Well, they did nothing to address my major complaints last night. The HHH/Nash/Punk story is getting worse and Cole is still terrible (though he did good work during the Ryder segment). And I don't get the build up for the tag title match. Air Boom and Awesome Truth are two of the best/most popular things going right now, they really should have done a better job with this instead of "we challenge you, we accept on your behalf, I shall now lose to CM Punk". Why not have Awesome Truth 2-on-1 Punk one of these last two weeks and let Air Boom make the save?

Besides that, though, I really enjoyed Raw this week. Like I said, Air Boom and Awesome Truth are both great. I loved the Zack Ryder stuff. And I enjoyed the 8-man tag match, both the build up and the execution. Solid week, which is good considering Punk is still trapped in a storyline that's slowly sucking the life out of his character.

[Carmichael]

Originally Posted by OldStingberg

Solid week, which is good considering Punk is still trapped in a storyline that's slowly sucking the life out of his character.

I don't understand this mentality at all, CM punk is still part of this storyline, so if its not clicking he has to take responsibilty for it too. I like punk but he really has to take his share of the blame for this bombing.

I'm sick of the IWC just playing into the lazy stereotype of ragging on the old guys and pretending ROH guys are doing nothing wrong. I think sometimes thats true but in the real world you have to think, Punk's been stinking it up in the ring and involved in really boring promos. I'm will to give him the benefit of the doubt because hes obviously good but he has to take his fair share of the blame.

[20LEgend]

For me though, as average as Punk has been at times (calling Steph is getting boring) Nash has been a lot worse IMO, just insults that mean nothing and terrible references. That said the hilarity of Nash claiming he made the WWE exciting again was quite something.

[OldStingberg]

Originally Posted by Carmichael

I don't understand this mentality at all, CM punk is still part of this storyline, so if its not clicking he has to take responsibilty for it too. I like punk but he really has to take his share of the blame for this bombing.

I'm sick of the IWC just playing into the lazy stereotype of ragging on the old guys and pretending ROH guys are doing nothing wrong. I think sometimes thats true but in the real world you have to think, Punk's been stinking it up in the ring and involved in really boring promos. I'm will to give him the benefit of the doubt because hes obviously good but he has to take his fair share of the blame.

I've got few issues with Punk's performances. He hasn't been good, per se, but I think that's because of the cards he's been dealt, not because of how he's played those cards.

I'm not even all that critical of Nash's performances. I think they're getting better and they're probably good enough for what he's supposed to do.

My problem isn't with the performances, it's with the story. My problems are with the idea of this dumb whodunnit, the idea that Nash is a credible heel at this point, the idea that Punk should be insulting Stephanie for seemingly no reason, the idea that Triple H should take the moral high ground and defend his wife, etc.

So unless Punk has become part of the WWE creative team, I'm not putting much blame for this mess on him.

[Carmichael]

I agree the storyline hes been put in, is dumb. However you cant credit CM Punk solely when he does a shoot that started this all off before MITB or the exemplarary booking at MITB which was a great show and then just absolve Punk of the blame and lay the blame at the creative team when the storyline hes in is not as interesting

To me it looks like this is all CM Punks work, these lines aren't being written for him at all. Im 90% confident of that.

Personally i think he got an incredibly fortunate hand dealt to him, by being allowed to shoot on the WWE that got us all interested and the luck that there was a short space of time for it to build up enough heat and then MITB being in chicago which helped tremendously because outside of chicago, hes been fairly meh in reception.

I just cant believe you can blame, Nash, HHH, the creative but nt give punk his fair share of the blame. Its been **** all round, Punks boring matches on raw in comparison to the other top guys, his promos have been whilst funny in places and rubbish in places they have been way too narrow in their appeal IMO.

Whilst its fair enough its been a dud storyline and its not all punks fault, hes played his part in it imo and i just dont think its fair to hate on everyone else but punk, just laziness continually laziness from the IWC, hate cena, hate the top echelons of the WWE and anyone whose been in ROH is god.

im massively generalizing and playing into stereotypes of the IWC myself with that last sentence but there is semblance of truth in this. If Austin or The rock were in punks segments they wouldnt have looked as **** imo

[OldStingberg]

Since you're obviously not talking to me anymore and instead just railing on your perception of the IWC, I think I'll back out. Take care.

[Tha Black Phenom]

Likewise, by that own merit, if Cena and Orton were in the storyline it would've soured long ago.

It's not that I disagree with you about his matches with Miz and Truth, but at the same time I wouldn't look at his Raw matches with a microscope. It's a weekly show so he'll be hit and miss at times, and clearly he has great chemistry with John Cena and made the best of it.

Originally Posted by 20LEgend

Also Mr. H's, just accepting the resign as COO stip was stupid, why would he, he has no need to.

Because he's confident in winning... and it was obviously the compromise. "I'll accept your stip if you accept mine"

Originally Posted by Carmichael

When you see what reaction Cena or Randy Orton are getting in the ring, you cant blame the booking for the lack of interest in CM Punks matches, hes so overrated in the ring by the IWC its unreal.

Because Orton and Cena have been made ages ago.. Punk is being made right now. Well, rather that he's gotten made during his storyline with Cena, now it's his job to uphold his status and momentum.

I never expected Punk to stay consistently refreshing, the Steph jokes are getting a bit tiresome but I expected stuff like that. Those "pipebombs" can only go so far but hopefully he keeps it fresh, somehow.

Which ironically, it's probably a good thing they're hotshotting this angle. If they waited like previously said, who knows how much it could've dragged on the way we've seen it do. The IWC always wants the 'ultimate payoff' when there are other factors to consider.