Originally Posted by Jaysin
I should know this by now, but I don't...so, I'm an International Promotion. Great Muta is my most over wrestler(99 over all USA and Canada), but his psychology is at 73. He's in program a storyline after winning the WCW World title from Bret Hart. He's teaming with Ric Flair and the Horsemen against Ricky Steamboat and Bret Hart.
He's been mostly working tag matches with Flair(100 psychology) against Steamboat(94 psychology) and Bret Hart(87 psych). Since their psychology is so high, will he gain more psychology just by being in the ring with them and letting them call the match, or do I still need to have matches scripted for him?
I'd call it. You'll likely get a small ding for Muta's psychology but a roughly equal or possibly even greater bonus for everyone else's if you're calling it. I've also noticed that calling your own matches will help your psychology grow at higher levels, so it's probably better to do so even with that. Angry Gilmore for example in my game grew in psych with no-one else even within 15 points of his psych, after years of time in SWF without growth while with my regional promotion. Same happened with Joss Thompson before Gilmore showed up, and Adam Matravers who was behind Joss but also gained through this. It's not enough evidence to be sure, but I'm getting pretty confident that in order to reach the top of the psychology ladder you need to be calling in ring, which is why the AI is so bad at developing the stat because it doesn't use those notes at all.
Originally Posted by Eidenhoek
I've been toying with the idea of making a third diary due to shut up I'm awesome. Also, read the bolded part for brevity.
I wanted to run with BHOTWG, splitting the roster into Heavyweight and Lightweight divisions. I'll then have the top Junior titles be main event titles, leading to, potentially, lightweight guys going into the HoI. (as the level of belts stands, Elemental/Optimus shouldn't have gotten in)
For my intro post I want to talk about some Japanese wrestling history, with Burning Hammer on the top for awhile (they were in '77 >_>) and so on. So my question is:
How would you characterize the products of BHOTWG, PGHW, and GCG? Why did GCG fall?
I'm thinking Hammer's got a brawling/flying influence on the top/bottom of the card, with Pride picking up the technical spot (namely due to Yoshimi "**** yo limbs" Musashibo). GCG is...what? I know bad business decisions screwed them, but BCG says something about a divergence from...something?
I'm no expert on Japanese wrestling in the real world so I can't do comparisons there, but I can tell you a bit about each promotion in Cornellverse terms. In Japan, heavyweight wrestling has always been the king. Wrestling is a sport and the big guys are considered to be better than the junior because as with all sports, size and skill beats just skill (or something like that). As suchit used to be that almost all promotions had similar styles, with heavyweights ruling the roost in slow paced technical matches, the ocassional foreigner coming in (usually as a heel) to try and beat up on the domestic heroes only to be thwarted by the homeland heroes. Junior wrestling was largely just the same styles as the heavyweights, perhaps a shade quicker but ultimately just more of the same and thus... inferior.
Then Elemental came along and changed things with his unique high flying style, becoming a sensation in no time for BHOTWG. Ever since then more juniors adapted to the new style, seeing in it a chance to possibly grow to make more money as the like of Elemental vs Optimus headlined shows and Elemental even got World title shots (though no major title reigns). The BHOTWG roster is largely divided into heavyweights who fight heavyweights and juniors who fight juniors, with little interaction between the two. That's why there are very different styles between the heavyweights and junior divisions, and seperate titles too. In BHOTWG Juniors aren't allowed to compete for the BHOTWG main title, which seems to be an honour only Elemental himself has had. Interestingly, Kikkawa's return to BHOTWG with the INSPIRE King of Fighter's title does not have that limitation on it... the King of Fighters belt is defended 1 vs 1 only (at least, it was in INSPIRE) and is open to anyone who wants to be the best in the world. As such, it's natural storytelling in BHOTWG for Kikkawa to try to manipulate half of BHOTWG's roster into supporting whatever he wants since they will get the chance to fight for a prestigious title against one of the best (Kikkawa is unarguably one of the finest heavyweights in the world and MASSIVELY over to boot), putting pressure on the BHOTWG champ to do the same in singles... and possibly tag too. Slightly tangentially, I imagine there being 3 big unification bouts in BHOTWG for the INSPIRE and BHOTWG titles. The first is Kikkawa challenging for the BHOTWG belt and losing. The second is the BHOTWG champ challenging for the King of Fighters and losing... and the last is both titles on the line, winner takes all. Kikkawa should win that IMO to open up the main titles to junior wrestlers, but that would be up to the individual. Given that both major titles should really only be defended once per touring month that should be about 18 months of story right there since both men should be looking after their own titles between big matches too.
PGHW... well, that sprung up in 1996 when Sadaharu Jimbo wanted to focus more on wrestling than BHOTWG. PGHW has never had a junior division and focusses mostly on hard strikes, strong suplexes and very physical grappling (which IIRC is known as The King's Road style in real life. See Kobashi, Misawa and friends on Youtube for examples). While BHOTWG allows for an element of showmanship (like Hooded Kudo's gimmick, junior's masks, sumo and MMA crossovers all over the place, many gaijins coming in), PGHW cares less about that and is all about the action. Their top stars are tough as they come and to even get on the roster you need to be a pretty competent grappler and show some fire. When they started (according to my own CV97 mod) they brought in many indy wrestlers and trained them up in the sort of styles that Jimbo himself, Danger Kumasaka, Koryusai Kitoaji and Hito Ichihara had been developing... and then passed this all on to a new generation of stars who hadn't joined BHOTWG, who were dominant at that time. The stars trained then have been PGHW's core ever since, though they are now at the tail end of their careers and looking to move over for the next generation as the PGHW style doesn't favour a long career.
As for GCG... once upon a time they were competition for BHOTWG, putting out a competing Heavyweight style product with them back in the 70s and doing well. But some key injuries to youngsters like Hanshiro Furusawa (now owner) and the emergence of Elemental and Haruki Kudo (both huge stars) meant that GCG couldn't compete critically with their rivals. With the GCG dojo not producing much in the way of homegrown talent they had to rely on their two loyal stars in Yoshifusa Maeda and Kazu Yoshizawa to carry the company, who were great but not quite on the same level... all the while BHOTWG were raiding the roster as Furusawa fought to hold on to what they had rather than try to find a new way to compete. In short... failure to innovate hurt them badly. In the CV97 mod I realised that GCG were absolutely eviscerated by roster stealing in 96-97, with PGHW stealing some of their young talents (Eisaku Hoshino in particular) while mopping up most of the finest indy talent too... then HGC debuted and stole half of the foreign workers that GCG had built up, taking home Rip Chord/Dread (former champions within the last 2 years), the Demons of Rage, Robert Oxford/Joel Bryant and the Vessey Brothers (a non-canonical steal)... after so much time spent rebuilding the GCG roster was destroyed and the company almost ruined too, leaving Kazu and Yoshifusa to rebuild on once again as Pistol Pete Hall also went down to a massive knee injury that left him out for years, despite being a loyalist for them.
For the first time in decades GCG have a chance at greatness again though... the political machinations in BHOTWG have gifted them the legendary Haruki Kudo who helped book BHOTWG to greatness. Pistol Pete Hall has returned with great fire (though is old) and Kazu/Yoshifusa have passed their loyalty on to the exciting duo of Toshiharu Hyobanshi and Hiroyasy Gakusha, elevating them to the main event and cementing their places there in GCG as he veterans retired (aged 50+ each). Rumours are abound that Kudo's protege Koshiro Ino would choose to follow his mentor to GCG if he leaves America, while the GCG undercard has some great potential in the likes of Takayuki 2000, Kiminobu Kuroki and the owner's son Mabuchi Furusawa. Assuming they don't get hit by injuries, lack of loyalty or natural disasters then GCG look set to possibly finally make a comeback that could last... but without actually innovating by adding junior wrestling or creating a distinct style like their rivals they may not actually make it. But Kudo is brilliant, and that's where the future may lie, especially as his ties to Kaneie Komine (I had to look that name up
) the former BHOTWG president could lead to an injection of cash and business flair that Hanshiro lacks, leading to a new era in GCG.
Whether GCG loyalists would like that though is a different matter, which is where Black Canvas Grappling comes in. If GCG changes their style after more than 30 years of resisting change then long term fans may revolt... while at the same time, if they don't change they may continue to languish behind PGHW, BHOTWG, an emerging WLW and even 5SSW. GCG (in historical mods anyways) used to have a women's promotion that was their sister... by working with 5SSW, or at least gaining benefits of the back of them, GCG could use that as their springboard because there are a lot of talented girls out there that just need the platform to help them get noticed and GCG is rapidly building one with the arrival of Kudo.
I've ignored WLW somewhat in this... they're a modern, exciting, junior promotion in a world where heavyweight wrestling still reigns supreme (see all the other promotions
). As much talent as WLW has on their roster they have to break public perception if they want to be taken seriously and Japan may appreciate the skills of the workers (high grades) but narratively speaking they aren't quite taken seriously. If Emerald Angel could break out like Elemental did, or if they got their own Hooded Kudo on the roster to bring fame to them then they could explode, but without the superstar ingredient they will always be a minor promotion with a product that lends itself towards them growing quickly in game, but not narratively.
I hope that helps. I like playing in Japan with the CV and can see the politics of it way more clearly than anywhere else... it's actually pretty deep but is also very subtle, so it's really easy to miss things if you don't know how to put all the pieces together or haven't spent ages trying to retcon a mod to take into account all the little facts we're given about it.